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Thought as much- thanks for confirming.

Just as a mostly irrelevant aside, Alanna, I wonder if maybe whoever you were talking to was mixing some World of Darkness lore into their D&D. In their Werewolf game, garou (werewolves) age either at a human rate or in "dog years," depending on which shape they were born in.

I recently gained a vested interest in this subject matter, so I resurrected this thread (which I assume is generally more acceptable with Lore topics than GD ones) to ask for clarification.

Gunz wrote:

Yup. But it's kinda been a house thing where characters don't permanently change to their animals alignment on Amia, unless the RP somehow leads down that path. There have been neutral/good Lycans who have an evil animal form who retained, for the most part, their good/neutral side. Most of them of course did have their struggles with it. I say that thinking back to PCs like Alanna, Kaci and my ex-PC, Willow. They were all good/neutral and struggled/struggle with their evil aligned lycanthropy.

Estara wrote:

I can corroborate Alanna and Liz on this one. You inevitably become that alignment due to the growing strength of your disease (like how Quintessence kills you!), but disease is seen like cursing-- once gone, your character goes back to the previous alignment. At least to start! (Unless the DM ruling has changed. But that's how it went for Sam! That's right! Sam went from LG to CE and back to LG again. And she ate live people and cut off her friends' body parts. NASTY STUFF YALL.)

Don't these posts directly conflict? The easiest explanation here, and one I'll accept, is 'it depends on how the RP is done'. I'm not saying balancing feral instincts and civilized morality isn't or shouldn't be difficult, and it's both intriguing and rewarding to explore. But I hate exactly four things in the world more than 'forced alignment/shifts because the lore says so' (lycanthropes, dragons, certain outsiders, etc.), and not by a very wide margin, either. Especially since absolute feral nature is True Neutral by definition, not the essentially random alignments Wizards arbitrarily decided fit different lycanthropes.

Ahem. Sorry. Like I said: hate. So what's the modern consensus on lycanthrope alignments? Is it still chosen only if you're natural, or can someone with sufficient willpower/sense of self/time to be zen/natural lawful inclination/etc fight the alignment shift if they're afflicted? Again, case-by-case is a valid answer, just so I know whether or not this is absolute.

Also, while I'm at it, is this a lore-major-only request scenario like a Noble Background, or does the transformation widget also cost DCs? Further, if someone is afflicted, what lunar cycle does Amia use?

I do believe the former statement may have been at an earlier time in Amia's past when those sorts of things were a bit more lax. The latter statement is very true, however, for how things are on Amia. At least for the sake of an afflicted lycanthrope. If a good character, for instance, is afflicted with lycanthropy (specifically werewolf), there will be a huge inner struggle. Of course, you need to focus on the RP for this. But, when it comes to the transformations, it still follows all the rules in PnP. Wisdom check after each change until you succeed in order to successfully remember and become aware. Following the awareness, you'll have more control of the form itself, but carry a powerful urge to do stuff in accordance with the type (mercilessly rip apart friends and family for no reasons, in the case of a werewolf). Additionally, once aware of the lycanthropy, the character is forced a will save on each change (DC 15 +1 for each change that has occurred). If the will save is failed, the character will assume the alignment of the lycanthrope, permanently, or until cured (which becomes FAR more difficult at that point). Also, if your forcefully assume either animal or hybrid form of your own volition, you automatically and permanently assume the alignment.

In the case of a natural, I believe the alignment is more lax as they were born and such and are able to adapt to it far more easily than an afflicted. It's just part of who they are, as opposed to an affliction or disease.

As for the question of DC cost and the like, it does use transformation widgets, which are just widgets that change your shape. Nothing else. As per the request rules, such widgets are 5 DCs each, and you'd need two of them for a lycanthrope (animal form and hybrid form).

Hope this helps.

Natural weres do not have the alignment restrictions. The two conditions operate in completely separate manners - the Natural lycan has full control of transformations at birth, and does not automatically assume the ascribed alignment of its animal form, and can through a bite inflict lycanthropy upon normal beings. Those beings, once infected, are Afflicted Lycanthropes. They are created only by Naturals, but share very few of their traits. Their shifting works as Terallis said, and eventually become the alignment of their animal shape unless cured. Another difference is that afflicted lycanthropes cannot create more lycanthropes. The disease stems entirely from Natural lycans. Odd, but that's how it works!

So, I'm going ahead and performing some necromancy on this thread again due to some stuff I've been thinking of, lately.

Now, when I've played D&D in the past, on maaaany occasions, it was sort of brought up that afflictions could potentially cancel each other out. Almost like the idea of using one type of lycanthropy as a potential cure for another type of lycanthropy. One such instance I encountered in one of these games was my character being bitten and contracting lycanthropy from a werewolf. A great bit of struggle and around a week later, the group wound up rescuing a family of weretigers. After realizing my character was afflicted, they had offered to bite him and attempt to cancel out the other curse with their own. Ultimately, it did work. However, similar things happened in a few other campaigns I was in.

On a similar note, I have to wonder something else. If a person becomes afflicted and is severely affected (close to or fully failing their will save and shifting the alignment), but then cured, but still retaining much of the corruption and alterations to themselves, would a separate form of lycanthropy aid it? For instance, if a Good character is contracted with lycanthropy from a werewolf (CE) and becomes heavily affected by it, barely teetering on the edge, but is then cured. This person becomes better, but given how bad it was, they aren't really themselves anymore after the lycanthropy altered (whether obvious or subtle) their personality and moods. After this, they get afflicted again by a werebear (LG), and go through the process again. If they were to give in to the werebear portion and essentially carry with it the Lawful Good alignment shift, I'd assume their personality would begin to fix itself, or at least be pulled away from the more Chaotic Evil alterations made by the werewolf side?

So, all-in-all, I'm wondering if both of these sorts of things are really a thing. Mainly because, no matter where I seem to look, I can't find any mention of it in any source books. Due to that, I'd assume it could very well be the case as there's nothing to say otherwise?

Thanks.

We don't force the alignment restrictions on animal types.

Wait. Really? When I did the request in the past, I was explicitly told that I had to. Not that I was going to do it any other way, but yeah. But I suppose it's also a question in general if people feel it may work that way. Haha.

We don't, no. My werewolf is not Chaotic Evil and was not enforced to be so from the beginning of her conception. So the animal types are not alignment locked. May have been a thing of the past? Or perhaps it was a plot thing. Times change. I could see it having 'evil' tendencies when you're afflicted through a bite, because of the animistic urges and splitting of from your sane self. But no, no alignment locks.

For all I know and found, lycanthropy can neither cancel eachother out nor can you be multiple times afflicted.

If you have one form of lycanthropy, being bit by another lycan, no matter which kind, will have no effect. (Unless your affliction was first cured).

Selune / Lycanthrope Lore

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