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#StraightOutaAvernus
 
PostPosted: Fri, Sep 23 2016, 1:03 AM 

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Location: WHY SHOULD I TELL YOU WHERE WHEN YOU'RE ABOUT TO DIE?! NGAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!

Due to the growing popularity of Draconic characters, and the general obscurity of the Draconic language notes written by LetumLux a few years back (as it was never given its own thread); this thread exists for those seeking to enhance their draconic role-play with its IG usage outside a bracketmarker -- casters and draconic characters alike. It contains the links needed to properly utilize it, as well as those containing LetumLux's already 'quite' in-depth notes on the subject, and those containing notes I personally adhere to.


As I'm merely condensing information, I permit the dispute of any validity; and likewise permit the post to be modified by the DMs/Admins as may be seen necessary to remove information which is not deemed with basis for use in canon.

~Translation~


The books would have that you use a small selection of the pre-translated english language to somehow operate as a catch-all for all tenses and all forms of every word out there. The list is large enough for the reference of some creatures and conversational norms, certainly; but it is far less expansive than the expanded canon Draconic Lexicon. This uses conventions between the words to expand them, as well as provide rules of tenses and plurals so you don't have to.

Naturally, it's possible to determine these conventions for yourself over time, and while I'm just of a draconic nerd to be working on that; I acknowledge that most aren't. For basic common-to-draconic word changing, this will function swimmingly. However, it will not explain for you structure.


~Sentence Conventions~


For those of you who wouldn't dig, here's all the translator site's notes on language structure condensed into a single list. LetumLux's thread has more notes regarding the language, though, that I wouldn't post here out of simply the fact that it has already been linked.

As you might imagine, draconic has a few conventions which cause complexity with even the use of a translator in correctness -- specifically with regards to possession.

    1. The draconic language lacks canon words for 'my'. The word 'my' in the draconic dictionary there is implemented as a filler phrase -- where to imply possessiveness, draconic functions as real languages of this nature; using instead a prefix to imply the phrase.

    Stephens, 38 wrote:
    "[Dungeons & Dragons] Draconic has no word for 'my' or 'mine', but uses a series of prefixes, depending on the exact meaning. An object that is claimed a dragon speaker would begin with 'veth' or 'vethi', a being with a relationship to the speaker, such as friend or relative, begins with 'er' or 'erthe', and all other forms of the possesive begin with 'ar' or 'ari'. For example, for a dragon to say 'my sword', or 'the sword is mine', he only needs to say 'vethicaex'. Or, to say 'my enemy', he would say 'arirlim'. To indicate possession by another, the name of the possessor is combined with the object into a single word and prefaced with 'ar' or 'ari'. For example, to say 'my enemy's sword' he would say 'arirlimcaex'"


    2. The above possessiveness rules apply solely to present tense possession by an object capable of being assigned a pronoun or a proper one. In any case by which one would be referring to something in a past-sense or within a broader use for rhetoric (such as a metaphor), restructuring of the sentence is used instead. For example, if one were to say they had "A Dragon's Hunger", they would instead speak of possessing "The Hunger of a Dragon"; and if one were to express that someone possessed "A sparrow's grace", they would find themselves instead saying they had "The Grace of a Sparrow". This is because the word-structure of normal possessives is intended to account for masculine and feminine terms which don't exist, as well as general sentence flow -- where confusion with a sentence's subject might otherwise exist in rune script.


~Naming Conventions~


WARNING: Homebrew Lore Beyond this Point!

A lack of any proper conventions for draconic naming has left me, of my own fault and purposes, at a loss for how one would decide the name of an object or creature. As deriving from real world naming conventions, I have assembled what I believe best the solution to this.

See -- when you're looking at a real name, often you are actually viewing the latinized form of its origin; which is more often than not a compounded word in its origin tongue, that is then further condensed by way of different compacting procedures. This is true with both names of people, creatures, and objects (the phrase "Quran", for instance, or its hebrew counterpart of the "Tanakh", which rather literally 'both' translate into what is quintessentially the term "Teaching Prophet's Writings"; and the symbols used to represent these in their respective languages, which are essentially RL contemporaries of a rune script language, are compacted in this manner by the combination and removal of certain portions of each word composing it -- with proper nouns often receiving the same treatment through combining words, roots, and suffixes of Greek origin.).

Races descending from dragons, a race which is as pragmatic and objective as it is proud and strong, would typically name their children after physical traits and/or adjectives relating to power or ideals. This method involves the same procedure as defined above, where the compounding of words in draconic can be best achieved through one of two methods:
    Direct Combination -- in which the words are simply combined with no space
    Annotated Combination -- where the combined words are broken into defined syllables with annunciation, as represented by a " ' ".
Once this is achieved, the words may then be condensed to a form which flows from the tongue with proper inflection and matches to standard form. Draconic names are typically powerful by intonation as much as by meaning -- and wether this is in a matter which is elegant or a matter which derives itself as ominous or oppressive is easily reflective of the alignment of the dragon in question.

The typical draconic speech convention of modifiers being ordered by perceived importance may also apply (See: LetumLux's thread)

It's traditional, due to the natural accenting which a draconic tongue and the reptilian larynx of its creators forces into the speech itself, to maintain the flow of a name in conversation through ending it on easily-hissked syllables. Those which have end-sounds such as "th", a strong "r", a strong "i" or a subdued "k" are usually plenty acceptable -- and despite prior conventions, they should be the highest priority in forming a name which is conducive to Draconic script.

For example -- a Silver Dragonwrought kobold may well be born into the name "Filliki'ith"; a rough compounding of the term "Lord of Justice". Meanwhile, the same phrase being ascribed to a lawfully inclined Blue Kobold may well come off more as "Ith'ilkiati". My character, Stormwind's, own name has no condensation, as the rough phrase "Achuak'iejir" is plenty reflective of the abrasiveness of the Green without it. The decision of when it is and isn't necessary is ultimately in the eyes of the beholder; though, another important factor to be considered is what words should actually 'be' condensed into a name.

Dragons, themselves, do not always obey these conventions; the actual Wyrms well being able to make their own mismatch of that which is and isn't actual Draconic words and throwing them together to form a rough meaning which is sufficient to convey intent without short-changing their splendor through limiting it to words that already exist and fully hold meaning to others. A dragon, more often than not, takes unto itself a title of prestige; and would often prefer itself stated by that regardless, which often causes the name to serve as more a symbol than the title itself does.


~Dialects~


To return from the homebrew constructs of naming, it is worth notation that Draconic is rarely as universal a language as it is implied. 'Draconic', in its simplest terms, is as varied as Spanish in Latin American and European nations. Structures in lore exist to define that it is forked off from the original True Auld Draconic speech (the one true scholars of the non-arcane tongue usually use; which all Dragons know, but it is implied they do not use of choice) into subtypes for the individual forms of True Dragon, as well as those diluted by the planar language of any planar subspecies' plane of choice, the Yik-yak dialect Kobolds utilize; and indeed, the Loross form which High Netherese Arcanists are well known to have used due to its use of phrases more deeply connected to the weave for ritualistic proceedings -- and for that matter, the much more tame form of Arcane Draconic which has persisted among less high-ranking Wizards since is often only fluently known to the extents that are required for magic use, and simply doesn't 'have' words or conventions to make it useful for speech.

So what 'does it mean' to know Draconic? What use is it?

The simplest way to approach this concept, due to limitations of the in-game and out-of-game engines, is simply to assume that due to the standardization of some portions of the tongue; understanding of any given dialect is by definition ability to understand, if not fluently speak, all others. Accenting and additives to words from these other forms can be adopted if the individual elects to, and interchangeably be used with the same intonation, because the differences are superficial enough that while their written form may well be different; it is as much a construct as the dialects of the English language -- simply odd words with meanings akin to words which would otherwise be separated or different in other dialects that are, for the purposes of being streamlined for the 'intended audience', changed.

A white dragon may well speak a more simplified form of the draconic tongue that's much more like Arcane, whereas a Red dragon may elect to speak with more flowered and robust accents to demonstrate its fluidity with speech; and therefore its intellect. However, talking together, they will often understand each-other.


The only importance of this from a roleplaying aspect is to understand that your character, when talking to other disciples/mages/dragons/half-dragons/kobolds may well be speaking in a manner which is more sharp/wordy or less so; and as a result, the learning process of Draconic for a non-instinct or native speaker with less than 14 INT may take longer if it is done between two different sources.



Dialects of Draconic which exist include those of each type of Chromatic/Metallic, as well as those of Planar Dragons and Deep Dragons, the Kobold Yik-yak, the simplified Draconic of Lizardfolk and Troglodytes, the Yuan-ti language, Arcane Draconic used by Low-level Wizards, Loross used by Imaskari/Shadovar nobility and High-level Wizards, 'True' Draconic (only actively spoken by the Draconic Deities), and the Drake dialect used by all non-planar non-true Dragons.

Gem Dragons may use the tongue of either a dragon from their plane of dwelling, or a Chromatic/Metallic that shares their breath weapon -- due to similar vocal structure.




I'll reserve further editing for later, since I believe I've covered everything important for now. The dragon-savvy DMs may add in any further notes seen fit. I'll accept PMs with questions regarding further needed conventions.

_________________
*So, i've got a question for ya.
*do you think even the worst person can changeā€¦?
*that everyone can be a good person, if they just try?
*all right.
*well, here's a better question
*do you wanna have a bad time


Playing: Tanar'i Shit Disturbers


 
      
bobofwestoregonusa
 
PostPosted: Wed, Oct 05 2016, 16:49 PM 

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There was actually an excellent draconic language lore thread that the kobolds were using before they all quit en masse but I don't know where it is.

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bobofwestoregonusa
 
PostPosted: Wed, Oct 05 2016, 16:54 PM 

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FOUND IT

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DC taxation is theft!


 
      
That Guy
 
PostPosted: Wed, Oct 05 2016, 17:27 PM 



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I have a question!

If this is homebrew... is Amia adopting it as official Canon lore? I mean... if not, things can get kinda confusing. What's to stop someone else from making their own homebrew language for Dragons?

Juuuuuust checkin'!


 
      
TormakSaber
 
PostPosted: Thu, Oct 06 2016, 4:24 AM 

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It really doesn't matter so long as it's still Draconic and translated for any PC who knows Draconic, imho

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Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham


 
      
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