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EdwardVB
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 Posted: Mon, Jul 04 2016, 15:51 PM |
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Joined: 30 Mar 2013
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The freedom effect is pretty much essential to have on your gear or with a potion handy. There are so many classes, spells and items with very interesting effects that don't see much or any use because of the popularity and easy of access of the Freedom property. I suggest limiting Freedom to temporary means like potions and spells, reducing the duration and adding it to the list of spells you can Breach. Mindblank is in a very similar situation where it's one of the first potions everyone chugs before a fight. Maybe make it so the Mindblank only resists mind affecting spells 75% of the time so there is a 25% chance you'll need to roll that Will save similar to concealment.
I'm just throwing ideas out there, these are obviously not the only ways to change this situation of 'everyone is immune to everything'. With the new CC duration reductions I've been seeing on the forums it would make even more sense to allow the spells to land a little easier now that they are no longer instant kills. If you completely disagree and think that Freedom and Mindblank are fine as is please tell me why.
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Vesari
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Posted: Mon, Jul 04 2016, 18:20 PM |
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Joined: 05 Apr 2013
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This. Changing/limiting these effects could make for some interesting fights.
_________________
Mai'yr Baequi'arnith
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Murex
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Posted: Mon, Jul 04 2016, 18:31 PM |
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Joined: 01 Dec 2009
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Or just a +10 to will saves for the Mindblank. Still leaves a reason to buff will.
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That Guy
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Posted: Mon, Jul 04 2016, 18:37 PM |
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Joined: 13 Nov 2014
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While I know you are thinking about PVP... keep in mind, most if not all the higher level areas of the server pretty much require mindblank and freedom. Adding 10 to will saves won't quite make it worthwhile, IMHO. Until the areas are re-balanced for a change like this, it's just making the grind that much more tedious.
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Commie
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Posted: Mon, Jul 04 2016, 19:16 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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Freedom change is going in.
Don't expect mind blanks to change ever as it basically renders enchantment a pvp "save or dies on every spell level" the school.
Because let's face it, being mezed against a wizard is basically death already.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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treasured memories
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Posted: Mon, Jul 04 2016, 19:55 PM |
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Joined: 09 Nov 2015
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Mindblank is fine as it, I think. Really easy to dispel. Freedom is more understandable, since it's on a lot of gear, therefor not dispellable. And, this? Commie wrote: Freedom change is going in. A change to the effect itself, or removing it from gear? Sorry if it's mentioned elsewhere.
_________________
so he would always have a friend
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Commie
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Posted: Mon, Jul 04 2016, 19:59 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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treasured memories wrote: Mindblank is fine as it, I think. Really easy to dispel. Freedom is more understandable, since it's on a lot of gear, therefor not dispellable. And, this? Commie wrote: Freedom change is going in. A change to the effect itself, or removing it from gear? Sorry if it's mentioned elsewhere. Heard it's changing to like use per day. _________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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treasured memories
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Posted: Mon, Jul 04 2016, 20:12 PM |
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Joined: 09 Nov 2015
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Oh, dang. Isn't that kind of an indirect buff to casters who can dispel it? Not that I mind, I like casters.
_________________
so he would always have a friend
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Commie
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Posted: Mon, Jul 04 2016, 20:36 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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Yeah. Casters were bottom tier and this fixes it.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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EdwardVB
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Posted: Tue, Jul 05 2016, 10:54 AM |
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Joined: 30 Mar 2013
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Awesome! I didn't know Freedom was turning into use/day. I'm glad.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 15:41 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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casters are nowhere near bottom tier, lack of imagination makes people bottom tier, frankly if you as a wizard cant bring down a person with mindblank up and has freedom, your not utilising the class to its fullest, I dont see a need for a change for either of this, and yes as a pve'er removing, or even limiting freedom, will make a hell of alot of dungeons unplayable for non casters, and no you cant always get a wizard to buff, same goes for mind blank, both are vital in fights.
as for pvp, removing mind blank will have one huge consequence, fear based chars will win all fights, its that simple, all of them no exceptions, there is no defence in a fight that last more than 20 rounds against fear based chars, you will fail a save eventually, and you are by no means guarenteed to kill anyone fast if they run around until you fail a save.
freedom is more complicated, but the damage that it will do to pve runs is just too much to varrent any benifit in pvp regardless.
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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Commie
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 16:05 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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fear was just super nerfed in duration along with most cc. 5 rounds max now.
also casters are pretty low tier. if you can tank their initial volley they just lack the ability to do it again. the longer a fight goes the more 'expended' they get.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 16:14 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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Commie wrote: fear was just super nerfed in duration along with most cc. 5 rounds max now.
also casters are pretty low tier. if you can tank their initial volley they just lack the ability to do it again. the longer a fight goes the more 'expended' they get. there are alot of ways to disable a fighter, not all of them maxed IGMS, and 5 rounds is enough for a barbarian to utterly destroy almost anyone, and then they just have to run again if it dosnt and it progs again...rinse repeat easy victory
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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Commie
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 16:44 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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barbarian fear is still a skill check based effect that wasn't addressed in the current round of balance changes and still re-applies every time you leave and re-enter their aura.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 16:51 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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Commie wrote: barbarian fear is still a skill check based effect that wasn't addressed in the current round of balance changes and still re-applies every time you leave and re-enter their aura. it dosnt matter, fear aura's are so easy to max out as a barbarian, so much that its almost impossible to succed a save if you are not a mental class or use a magical mind shield clarity mindblank and so forth, and fear does not leave when you get out of thier aura, so again..all they have to do is keep the fear checks comming and you will fall if you dont have magical mind shield of some kind. there is a ton of stuff like this, least of which is just how easy it would be for anyone to summon some random thing with fear and just wait.. while all non caster/umd players get utterly destroyed by fear, fear is by far the most overpowered thing in nwn, cause it ticks constantly, constant checks that you will fail 1/20'th of the time...and then your dead, cause it dosnt take a pvp player five rounds to kill someone, and even if it did, just reapply the fear, problem solved, without a mind protection all non caster/non umd chars, become unviable for pvp, cause they have no way of defence unless they are extremely lucky with rolls or pack a punch that is so hard it punches through the AC DR and gods knows what else of barbarians..oh yea and the usuall 600 hps
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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Commie
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 16:55 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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the fear spell was just changed recently.
im sure the barb fear aura will be changed soon as well.
fear also isn't the most op thing in the game, and really won't be once all the fear stuff (because right now i think it's only the barb effect) gets nerfed.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 16:58 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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Commie wrote: the fear spell was just changed recently.
im sure the barb fear aura will be changed soon as well.
fear also isn't the most op thing in the game, and really won't be once all the fear stuff (because right now i think it's only the barb effect) gets nerfed. until it is nerfed to such a extreme that fear no longer lasts for ages, no longer ticks every round, no longer reapplies the duration if you miss another save and is no longer a toggle aura, then removing mind blank potions should not even be in discussion, also I will add that removing mind blanks will ruin a ton of pve aswell, good luck going through the fire giants without mindblanks to block the storms of vengence.
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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Commie
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 17:00 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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yeah i agree, if it were up to me mind blanks would last an irl hour.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 17:02 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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Commie wrote: yeah i agree, if it were up to me mind blanks would last an irl hour. yea I agree, they cost way to much for normal non super rich people, to just quaff through
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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Commie
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 17:05 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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not so much on the cost. they cost little and one fire giant run will easily net you 150k or more.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 17:07 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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and just to get back to my most important point, caster does by no means need a buff of any kind what so ever, clerics and druids are by far the most powerfull classes in the game, and sorcs and wizards are close behind.. if anything non umd/non casters need buffs like +6 weaponry
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 17:07 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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Commie wrote: not so much on the cost. they cost little and one fire giant run will easily net you 150k or more. fire giants are late game dungeon, you also need mind blanks for minor dungeons
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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TormakSaber
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 17:59 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere
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At low levels, simply mythal Protection against Evil onto the Ring of Invisibility you've probably got for emergencies.
_________________
Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds
Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
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Tarnus
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 18:02 PM |
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Joined: 28 Aug 2015
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Seems I need to take a closer look at the mythal-able spells, didn't realize that could be done.
_________________
Playing as:
Aleana Xiloscient: Wherever the winds take her.
Jealesyl Truesong: A voice in the dark
DM Prometheus: Bringing you fire
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TormakSaber
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 18:04 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere
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It gives you 3 casts that each last 5 hours - more value than a mindblank potion and infinitely useable.
_________________
Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds
Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
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walnutboy
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 18:06 PM |
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Player
Joined: 22 Jul 2015
Location: Lincolnshire, United Kingdom
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I really need to mythal more lol
_________________
When it rains, look for rainbows.
When it's dark, look for stars.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 18:06 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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TormakSaber wrote: It gives you 3 casts that each last 5 hours - more value than a mindblank potion and infinitely useable. yea, that would cover all the mind blank situations at low level I can think off, good advice
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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maglorine
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 18:19 PM |
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Joined: 13 Oct 2006
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I've used that method to generally good effect. Mythalled helmet and with 3 uses you basically don't run out. There's one lower level critter that has a fear aura which will smack you since it must be neutrally aligned but other than that you don't need clarity or mind blanks until epic levels.
_________________
Tark Hammerfeast - Immovable Object
True Greenspan - Bendir's Boy Wonder
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 19:11 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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maglorine wrote: I've used that method to generally good effect. Mythalled helmet and with 3 uses you basically don't run out. There's one lower level critter that has a fear aura which will smack you since it must be neutrally aligned but other than that you don't need clarity or mind blanks until epic levels. what critter is it?..just out of curiosity
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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robbi320
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 21:01 PM |
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Joined: 04 Jan 2015
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Electric Castle, Dread guard Elite, or something... It's Neutral, and really annoyibg.
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MightNMagic
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 22:38 PM |
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Player
Joined: 30 Jul 2013
Location: Space Australia
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Commie wrote: Freedom change is going in.
Don't expect mind blanks to change ever as it basically renders enchantment a pvp "save or dies on every spell level" the school.
Because let's face it, being mezed against a wizard is basically death already. There's literally a "save or screwed" spell that Freedom counters on every spell level of the game and in the cases of some levels, 2-4 of them. Roll a 1 and you are screwed, period. Might as well get up and order a pizza because you're ending up in the Fugue. Mind you, that's vastly more than Mindblank protects against. Factor that in almost every encounter in the game past about lvl 15 has at least 1 caster (and in the cases of some places, all 6 monsters are casters - cripes), doing anything with Freedom/Mindblank is stupid and will end up guaranteeing anyone a death 1/20 casters due to the hatred of RNGesus. What the blue hell happened to "Step One: Cast Dispel?" What's with the hand-holding of casters lately? The utterly unbalanced garbage I've been reading lately is going to turn this server into Arelith or Ravenloft. Unbalanced places where facing anything with a spellbook is likely a death. Ugh.
_________________
Rashad the Azure, Zakharan Merchant-lord Most Fair and Master of the Desert Wind
Loremaster Tukson Devers, Oghmanyte Wrestler of Knowledge and Child of the Passive Voice
(No tells for Rashad while I'm playing other characters please.)
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Commie
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 22:54 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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well they nerfed most cc spells to be only a handful of rounds so it's far less of a thing now.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Tue, Jul 12 2016, 23:42 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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Commie wrote: well they nerfed most cc spells to be only a handful of rounds so it's far less of a thing now. and funnily enough it dosnt take more than a few rounds to kill people, because it is actually extremely easy to drop earthquakes or a shitton of maxed IGMS, that are now again, the lord of the server. also, you can reapply cc
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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Commie
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Posted: Wed, Jul 13 2016, 0:22 AM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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eq spammers and igms spammers are going to have low reflex saves or low hp, likely both. hit that.
end of the day as long as it's a d20 system, rolling 1's are going to decide combat. some people have rolled 1's so hard it was heard round the server. thems the breaks.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Wed, Jul 13 2016, 12:57 PM |
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Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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Commie wrote: eq spammers and igms spammers are going to have low reflex saves or low hp, likely both. hit that.
end of the day as long as it's a d20 system, rolling 1's are going to decide combat. some people have rolled 1's so hard it was heard round the server. thems the breaks. hit them with what? reflex saves, which almost no fighters have anything to use against, and just you mentioning HP's shows just how little you know about what casters can do with spells, your lucky if you even get through the defences of a cleric or even a wizard, without already being dead, not to mention that clerics can be nearly as good as fighters in close combat on top of that. Your reasoning is faulty, at this point I give up, you just want the instant wins back for the casters, either that or your have not played a non umd/non caster in ages
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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Commie
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Posted: Wed, Jul 13 2016, 16:01 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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well i mean if you can igms odds are you're on a d4 of hd and don't have fort and reflex as favored saves.
just sayin.
also iron horn them.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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Kraniumbrud
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Posted: Wed, Jul 13 2016, 17:50 PM |
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Joined: 08 Dec 2008
Location: Denmark
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Commie wrote: well i mean if you can igms odds are you're on a d4 of hd and don't have fort and reflex as favored saves.
just sayin.
also iron horn them. d4 hp dosnt mean squat when you have to get through mage defences, and as for iron horn, you really are just proving my point, not every char has UMD or spells
_________________
-Ja'acira Arrows'R'Us
-Balorin Wolfhammer- A dwarf so old he remember when the Beer stein was invented
Saisha Jai'diem Knight of bahamut, and abit of a looker
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Commie
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Posted: Wed, Jul 13 2016, 18:56 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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Kraniumbrud wrote: Commie wrote: well i mean if you can igms odds are you're on a d4 of hd and don't have fort and reflex as favored saves.
just sayin.
also iron horn them. d4 hp dosnt mean squat when you have to get through mage defences, and as for iron horn, you really are just proving my point, not every char has UMD or spells You don't need spells. Just attack them when they arnt warded, which is the vast majority of time. The wizards and shit that utterly rely on wards and epic mage armor and whatnot often don't "gear" effectively or can't get saves up without losing other things. It's a fact. So roll on em. Giving a "prepared" caster a chance to prepare is a huge tactical blunder. _________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Wed, Jul 13 2016, 19:04 PM |
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Joined: 26 May 2010
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That's ... the essence of being a caster vs melee. You aren't even saying anything that everyone doesn't even know, so that really doesn't help whatever point you are trying to make. A caster without any buffs is going to loose unless the meleer is completely underpowered/ungeared or just plain awful.
That's like saying 'fight the guy in melee before he can draw his sword'. It's common sense. And I doubt anyone actually would let a caster buff for a few rounds before attacking them.
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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Commie
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Posted: Wed, Jul 13 2016, 19:29 PM |
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Joined: 02 Dec 2015
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Well it's really not all that obvious to everyone.
_________________ ANT ALARM Count Kaldrjarn Pitt | Archmage Kilmar | Sarguk Morderer ANT ALARM MisterLich wrote: First of all, my brain is one of the best here.
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