View unanswered posts | View active topics * FAQ    * Search
* Login   * Register




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 55 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Titanarrow
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 20:16 PM 



Player

Joined: 03 Sep 2015

Is it me or about 89% of all the underdark personalities you meet are derived from what I call: The Drizzt attitude.
The underdark and drow cities are drow cities because they have a decorum to them. When you do not respect this decorum, normaly you would be maimed and killed outright by the drow or their slaves. BUT for some reason, everyone is a rebel, everyone dont listen , and everyone is soo cool and full of themselves, not allowing their character to fall in line, ever, under penalty of being a loser? Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, dont come down there to be the I win all the time or you have to pvp me plz. If you want to win at politics, make a female drow, not a renegade male that just live there because you ran away after being destroyed by some female, or whatever else reason.

Sorry for telling ppls what to do, but it really ruins it for the ppl there that dont actualy want to kill or maim or punish at all time any creature that they interact with. There is so much more types of rp to be had and it seems it alwais comeback to those same notions ensuing a dramatic scene and a heroic I run away unhindered and in a invincibly determined narcisic way.

Thanks.


 
      
Analog Kid
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 20:40 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 13 May 2010
Location: The Great White North Eh!!

Titanarrow wrote:
Is it me or about 89% of all the underdark personalities you meet are derived from what I call: The Drizzt attitude.
The underdark and drow cities are drow cities because they have a decorum to them. When you do not respect this decorum, normaly you would be maimed and killed outright by the drow or their slaves. BUT for some reason, everyone is a rebel, everyone dont listen , and everyone is soo cool and full of themselves, not allowing their character to fall in line, ever, under penalty of being a loser? Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, dont come down there to be the I win all the time or you have to pvp me plz. If you want to win at politics, make a female drow, not a renegade male that just live there because you ran away after being destroyed by some female, or whatever else reason.

Sorry for telling ppls what to do, but it really ruins it for the ppl there that dont actualy want to kill or maim or punish at all time any creature that they interact with. There is so much more types of rp to be had and it seems it alwais comeback to those same notions ensuing a dramatic scene and a heroic I run away unhindered and in a invincibly determined narcisic way.

Thanks.


Beautiful. Just beautiful. Love this. :)

_________________
I Am:
Derrin: 'Nothing to see here'
Beck: Hard working dwarf paladin.
Naela 'Widow': Wandering priestess.
Celinor Triellian: Paladin of Corellon.


 
      
RaveN
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 20:52 PM 

User avatar

Administrative Developer

Joined: 08 Jun 2010

One major gripe of mine as well. I used to relentlessly beat / discipline for insubordination when necessary, and that earned me a whining thread from a player who said I was being "cruel".

Just keep in mind when you play a drow it's supposed to be cruel, and terrible. Takes a lot of humility to play one correctly, but the value added is pretty immense. The value added of another Drizzt is value lost.

_________________
a.k.a. Audrey Zinata


 
      
Broldi
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 20:53 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 06 Dec 2012

I remember Dro, my barb drow stepping out of line a lot, and getting away with it from preistesses a lot. The most he had was a demotion from them. I was expecting a full on beating from the guards, or a lashing. Was kind of let down, tbh. When I emoted a physical punishment with rolls etc, it got ignored. Several times.

I note that Dro's always been submissive with occasional outbursts due to self-love, and being very short-fused.

Faded, should have poked me. Dro welcomes the beatings.

_________________
MAURICE "THE JUGGERNAUT" GRAFF


 
      
RaveN
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 20:57 PM 

User avatar

Administrative Developer

Joined: 08 Jun 2010

It's weird, because it's a circular problem, almost. One, that I don't want to sit there continuously beating people for being stupid, because, it makes you wonder why my PC wouldn't just outright get rid of them. Drow don't tolerate imperfections or stupidity with any great deal of patience. So part of me just pretends it doesn't happen, so I'm not just just constantly trying to justify why someone isn't just better off dead. In my experience, that's kind of what the "Drizzt" effect is. In the end, one player kept insisting that I was being abusive, and if I continued, I would chase off the drow in the underdark, as few as they were.

So in a way, it does kind of feel like a tightrope to walk, but not many people stay on it. I hope people learn from this and move forward, though, because it can make it so much better for everyone, if the interactions were more balanced, and fell into regulation with the OP's points.

_________________
a.k.a. Audrey Zinata


 
      
Analog Kid
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 21:03 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 13 May 2010
Location: The Great White North Eh!!

I found that it often came down to "my X build is better than you cleric/X build. Lol! What. Old you possibly do to me!? Lol! ".

Just bleh

_________________
I Am:
Derrin: 'Nothing to see here'
Beck: Hard working dwarf paladin.
Naela 'Widow': Wandering priestess.
Celinor Triellian: Paladin of Corellon.


 
      
Ts_
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 21:24 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 28 Jul 2008

I find it quite sad to see this thread, as the tone seems to contradict blackjack's thread over here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=83576 .

All I can suggest for you is: Keep calm and carry on.

The following might be completely incorrect, so feel free to correct me, but I think it's food for thought because your assumption is that your characters have IC weight:

In L'Obsul your house has no weight, unless you are from House Zau'tar, which is the NPC house ruling that place (if the travel agency carpet is up to date).
I cannot say anything about Nec, but I would assume that just claiming a title of a house you founded is not enough OOC backing to push other people around ICly. Sorry.

Regards
Ts

_________________
Ralghok & Hazamir "The Weasel"


 
      
LunarBloom
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 21:24 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 05 Jan 2015

Drow societies are not meant to be filled with epic levels running around freely, like most settings in traditionnal D&D. People need to play around that, stop flaunting yet another powerbuild and forget about the stats a bit.

_________________
Mary Beauchamp
LesFleursDuMal ~,~'~{@ Skype: MaryOfWaterdeep


 
      
serbiris
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 21:32 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 14 Sep 2010
Location: Sydney, Australia

I played a subservient drow for a long time. And after a while in game, she stopped being so subservient.

Sorry, but her personality was shaped by in game events and I can't edit that for your comfort. Though if it's any consolation, I rarely play her anymore.

_________________
@Thanatopsis#6293


 
      
angst360
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 22:40 PM 



Player

Joined: 10 Jul 2014

Ts_ wrote:
I find it quite sad to see this thread, as the tone seems to contradict blackjack's thread over here: http://www.amiaworld.net/phpBB3/viewtop ... =2&t=83576 .

All I can suggest for you is: Keep calm and carry on.

The following might be completely incorrect, so feel free to correct me, but I think it's food for thought because your assumption is that your characters have IC weight:

In L'Obsul your house has no weight, unless you are from House Zau'tar, which is the NPC house ruling that place (if the travel agency carpet is up to date).
I cannot say anything about Nec, but I would assume that just claiming a title of a house you founded is not enough OOC backing to push other people around ICly. Sorry.

Regards
Ts


Well put.


 
      
Yheardrin
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 23:14 PM 



Player

Joined: 08 Jul 2015

Like Ts stated lobsul is an open UD city. That said tho still wise as a drow male to show face to a yathrin visiting the city, doesnt mean you have to or that ever drow player must. If a male drow was skipping along streets of nec praya disrespecting females one should be ready for some beatings.


Yheardrin
BladeNmask


 
      
Pony
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 07 2015, 23:28 PM 



Player

Joined: 07 May 2005

I believe you should take it as an opportunity instead. Chalking it up as an ooc problem does you a disservice and prevents you from turning it into something really fun. It gives your group of players who would like to create a strong lothite matriarchy the chance to create it.

This topic has a post of mine somewhere near the top where I discuss some of the aspects of drow and underdark society. I think it would be worth a glance as it explains why the development of insolent drow and disrespectful non-drow is actually a completely understandable development in this case.

What it basically boils down to, is that the lothite matriarchy only exists as long as it manages to dominate. And the type of lothite matriarchy people love from Menzoberrazan is actually a highly nuanced system that requires a lot of finesse and cut-throat intrigue to uphold. Once that system begins to break down, those who out of fear were forced into the bondage of submission (non-clerical females) will be free to begin to test their new boundaries. And if not kept in check, you may have a coup on your hands that might overthrow both the faith and matriarchy that are so closely linked in lothite society.

Your female cleric hence has the opportunity to truly rise in the grace of lolth, by demonstrating all the vile qualities the spider queen so adores in her followers, and restoring the power of the goddess in that region of the Underdark.

It was certainly one of the driving ic storylines for my character when I played in the UD a while ago, and it was a lot of fun.


 
      
PassionateShadow
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 0:03 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 07 Jun 2014

Excellent... my campaign to over throw Lolth as a deity is a go.

_________________
❤ Amia is Fun Again! ❤
#GreenisNotACreativeColour

Image
"It's easy to feel like a hero. It's a little harder to be one."


 
      
Naivatkal
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 0:18 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 27 May 2010

Pfft, Nec ain't gonna be anything by Lolthite predominantely :3


Lot of people have the right of it, and yeah it's really annoying. I've encountered so many PCs (usually played by the same people) that do nothing useful besides antagonize and try to provoke PvP. It's annoying as Lollipopsquirrel, especially when it's done around guards and other shit where the typical response is 'chain them' and yet you can't do anything. Not to mention they tend to powerbuild so you are going to go down in any sort of fight. And then your priestess looks disgraced and pathetic and it kills the immersion.

It goes back to everyone playing nice getting along OOC for the sake of fun times IC. That's all I want, everyone to have a good time. OOC drama is what killed my drive to play in the UD; it's got seriously bad. Let's all just get along and help make things thrive. You don't have to play a Lolthite, but use intelligent subterfuge please :) I know of some PCs that have been doing that for some time and it warms my heart; because drow are sneaky and not into open warfare in a city. That just makes yourself look bad.

_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming


 
      
Titanarrow
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 2:50 AM 



Player

Joined: 03 Sep 2015

Ts_ wrote:
I find it quite sad to see this thread, as the tone seems to contradict blackjack's thread over here: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=83576 .

All I can suggest for you is: Keep calm and carry on.

The following might be completely incorrect, so feel free to correct me, but I think it's food for thought because your assumption is that your characters have IC weight:

In L'Obsul your house has no weight, unless you are from House Zau'tar, which is the NPC house ruling that place (if the travel agency carpet is up to date).
I cannot say anything about Nec, but I would assume that just claiming a title of a house you founded is not enough OOC backing to push other people around ICly. Sorry.

Regards
Ts


The problem is not only in between drows, its amongs all the underdark races out there. Leave the inner politics of in drow fighting and see the bigger picture of the Drizzt attitude.The decorum is the key word.


 
      
angst360
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 3:31 AM 



Player

Joined: 10 Jul 2014

// edited out because the OOC drama has been worked out, and as everyone involved seems to agree: life is too short and the UD is too small as it is. Moving along...


Last edited by angst360 on Tue, Sep 08 2015, 6:28 AM, edited 1 time in total.

 
      
Analog Kid
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 3:35 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 13 May 2010
Location: The Great White North Eh!!

angst360 wrote:
The wrong thing.....


Discussions don't need laundry aired. This is the quickest way to get a thread locked by the way.

_________________
I Am:
Derrin: 'Nothing to see here'
Beck: Hard working dwarf paladin.
Naela 'Widow': Wandering priestess.
Celinor Triellian: Paladin of Corellon.


 
      
angst360
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 3:49 AM 



Player

Joined: 10 Jul 2014

Gee, wouldnt want that..


 
      
OpenTheRift
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 3:54 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 17 Feb 2014

lol dis thread

_________________
bad man


 
      
Arcane Crusader
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 4:04 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 21 Aug 2008
Location: Spokane, Wa.. USA

Ts_ wrote:
In L'Obsul your house has no weight, unless you are from House Zau'tar, which is the NPC house ruling that place (if the travel agency carpet is up to date).
I cannot say anything about Nec, but I would assume that just claiming a title of a house you founded is not enough OOC backing to push other people around ICly. Sorry.

Regards
Ts



MY thoughts on this exactly. L'Obsul isn't a "drow city". Drow just happen to go there.

_________________
Image

AllanaMolov said: "Dirk is like the grossest, worst version of Robin Hood ever and I love it"


 
      
Arkun
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 4:46 AM 



Player

Joined: 14 Aug 2015

L'Obsul is a tradecity in which many different Underdark races are expected to be able to work together -- as many people have said already, a little bit of friction is all that's needed to set off people stabbing each other in the back. That being said, OOC feels for IC funsies is one thing.

All people in the UD (Players) know one thing -- that the people they're playing with are playing generally evil characters who will turn around and backstab them when the time is nigh and the maximum profit of any sort can be achieved, be it power or fame or whatever they feel they deserve that the other person is holding them back from.

That's all IC.. And it's gravy.

But that doesn't mean people should be mean to each other OOC. We're a small community and as people have already said, OOC drama has driven them from the UD. This is obviously a problem, as we do not have the playerbase that the surface does have. Respecting the feelings of someone OOC is as simple as saying 'Hey, if you actually want to escape, we'll make it happen so that it makes sense for everyone'. Or as simple as just telling someone they're doing some great roleplay even if it's a particularly awful situation IC.

After being shown the background reason for this thread being created, I get the feeling that OOC temper flared up and caused an irrational reaction. Which sucks. We're all human, though.

For the whole Drizzt attitude? Well, we're not playing tabletop, we're playing a game with people from various parts of the world who come together with different ideas and feelings on various matters. The best we can do is try and facilitate peoples ideals and try to push on, and sometimes, that just don't work and people gotta go their separate ways.

Blackjack's post stands as what we (Myself + Blackjack) desire for House Torviir and the UD in general. We'd love to get people to come together, but that results in friction between people.


 
      
Ts_
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 9:39 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 28 Jul 2008

Hey,

I hope any OOC grumbling can be worked out.

Titanarrow wrote:
The problem is not only in between drows, its amongs all the underdark races out there. Leave the inner politics of in drow fighting and see the bigger picture of the Drizzt attitude.The decorum is the key word.

I don't endorse pointless and nonsensical PvP. If a character would be thrown out of Nec for his behaviour, he should not stay there. Otherwise it's metagaming the guards. Then again, that's only up to the DMs or guard PCs if such a faction is DMly endorsed.

Non-drow in Nec should not be there at all because there's supposed to be no way in unless you're a drow. (Please fix the simple script that has been bugged for years!) Or you're working for a house, and then a priestess should just complain to those higher in the ranks or the house should be formally disgraced or something. (Maybe Nec needs a bit more of a house ranking? Where you can bring forth charges against each other and thereby gain rank yourself? Just an idea.)

In LObsul, it's different. Plain as that. There are plenty of free non-drow living there. There are drow rebels. (There's a few areas full of drow rebels nearby.) There are entire clans of goblins and kobolds. There are powerful mindflayers right there, who love your delicious +2 INT, and presumably don't care about your title. So really, you need to expect drizzt orcs, kobolds and whatnot there.

Also, the problem you encountered with your lack of authority has the same roots as why it is easier to play a drizzt than a "proper" drow or orc: Most PCs are immigrants or outcasts, I think, to work around the issue of having NPCs nearby that are supposed to have a relationship with you. So why do these PCs leave? Because they don't fit. (And that's also why they become heroes and don't end up as broken slaves.)

Regards
Ts

Ps: I'm looking forward to seeing you IG!

_________________
Ralghok & Hazamir "The Weasel"


 
      
Nalkanar
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 9:46 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 07 Jan 2015
Location: Central Europe

Isnt the main problem in the fact that Amia has strict rules that restrict torture, PvP etc.? You can try to gain respect without it but by my experience it is rather hard if you sometimes dont punch someone... or even better make that someone suffer bad for his disrespect.

_________________
Zendaer Amattis
Faelyn Aegyskeryn
Kaido

CET time zone


 
      
Ts_
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 12:05 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 28 Jul 2008

Nalkanar wrote:
Isnt the main problem in the fact that Amia has strict rules that restrict torture, PvP etc.? You can try to gain respect without it but by my experience it is rather hard if you sometimes dont punch someone... or even better make that someone suffer bad for his disrespect.

Wouldn't that just play into the hands of PvP griefers?

Regards
Ts

_________________
Ralghok & Hazamir "The Weasel"


 
      
The Great Equalizer
 
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 08 2015, 12:43 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada

The whole Hierarchy of respect thing rather fell apart for a few reasons, most notably from my own viewing was due to Females of various houses stopping giving respect to the complaints of other females purely as an IC ploy to position each other above other houses by not showing respect for the others authority over them, but this of course ignored the issue of males in general having free reign being a bigger issue than any of that on a large scale because on Amia thats not really an issue since Males aren't actually subjugated so there is no need to keep them in line to the same level, as its no longer Male vs Female in anywhere near the same way.

"Easy" to fix, all it takes is some getting on the same page OOCly as a large enough part of the group and agreeing to both bring in more of that sort of thing to your own RP and also the allowing of it to happen on all side (As you need to normalize it or else it seems like a power move) and not have it turn that into both an OOC and IC tool for vying for power.


 
      
Genar_Detkasa
 
PostPosted: Wed, Sep 09 2015, 5:59 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Location: Melbourne, Australia [GMT +10]

I think the priestess PCs have it the most rough, as canon ball-busters they are obligated to make sure they are respected. If a priestess isn't given respect, it undermines her position in the eyes of everyone.

And when a priestess does crack down on someone who disrespects them, they face a few hurdles. Firstly, can they actually pull it off? There's the facet of mechanical PVP, but there's also the other facet of whether the other PC actually feel the IC pressure of 'I'm so screwed if I keep defying her.'

On the other hand, I've seen players who get personally offended when their characters get their balls busted for something they see at least is fairly innocuous. And this is another large part why priestess PCs get it rough. Admittedly yes, there has been some bad actors with priestess PCs in the past and it can be difficult to hold a priestess to account IC-wise, but in general that's not the case with most priestesses. It isn't personal, they are -expected- to lay down the smackdown.

Anyway, people should steel themselves that the potential exists for their characters to be kicked around, I highly encourage anyone to read Laws of Nec'perya which is the third post, they give a good idea of 'red lines.'

On the flip side, I get why people with non-priestess PCs don't like the potential ball-busting aspect, but really that's a small part of the parcel. Drow RP is highly political and lots of fun (as consequences DO indeed matter here); the most visible players are the priestesses who have the most to lose and most to gain since the most attention will be on them. While it may seem this is at the expense of other non-priestess PCs, I'd say it actually frees you to pursue whatever agenda your PCs have behind the scenes. Drow RP -IS- highly political and as such, priestesses can easily be a powerful asset to your character's plan and interacting with them can provide some excellent RP when you're negotiating with competing interests.

I find the current shortage of priestesses to be quite unfortunate, they can be a lot fun to RP with.

EDIT: More since I had to relocate my computer.
As an aside, some thoughts on other Underdark races' attitude towards drow and vice versa. It seems to swing between them giving the typical drow-fearing attitude or regarding drow as they would normally regard other species. I see some difficulty in a drow PCs managing both attitudes, moreso if both have plenty of epic levels. So it can be a bit bipolar, but generally when it comes to PCs who are Underdark races like kobolds, svirfneblin etc; my PC tends to view them more like mercenaries than some ordinary lesser shmuck on the street especially since he can't reassert his superiority on the streets of L'Obsul.

_________________
NWN Account Name: KnightProtector


 
      
RaveN
 
PostPosted: Wed, Sep 09 2015, 15:46 PM 

User avatar

Administrative Developer

Joined: 08 Jun 2010

It all boils down to where your drow/underdarker is, really. It's difficult to even consider playing a priestess in L'Obsul, simply for the merit that the place is obviously not Llothite influenced, thus you're fighting against the flow of normal society there.

I just hope that if someone does encounter a priestess in Nec'perya, that you consider your tact, locale and demeanor as a drow and don't complain OOCly with what happens, no matter what that might be. If you want to cut her off mid-sentence, don't be upset OOCly when she whips you for it. If you do decide to kill her, because she upset your feelings after you acted like an idiot, or maybe even she is an idiot, just remember that's why there aren't any.

It's an extremely difficult thing to roleplay, mostly tiring, and being a priestess means that you are expected to deliver roleplay all of the time.

Lastly, the best thing you can possibly do if you find a priestess, is find roleplay that you can report to her about, get involved in things that you can involve her in. That player will always be going out of their way to generate unique and dynamic roleplay for you, and that is extremely tiring if it's one-way. Be ambitious, and don't rely on someone else to keep you interested or occupied, and you can truly have a lasting impact and create an excellent story. One of the reasons I melted down before, was purely because it felt like everyone waited for me to log on, then came by to hold my leg and waited for mommy to give them something to do. That kind of thing feels, and is a job, so please be ambitious and make your own way. You will be a much more valuable drow in the end.

_________________
a.k.a. Audrey Zinata


 
      
Mercedes
 
PostPosted: Sat, Sep 19 2015, 1:31 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 14 Dec 2011

I have never had this problem because my Drow is perfectly nice and subordinate with nothing weird going on ever at all.


 
      
Liz
 
PostPosted: Sat, Sep 19 2015, 2:56 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 28 May 2010
Location: Smallville

Faded Wings wrote:
It's [playing a drow priestess] an extremely difficult thing to roleplay, mostly tiring, and being a priestess means that you are expected to deliver roleplay all of the time.

Omg, so very this. I've only just started playing a Lolthite, and even though she's maybe too young yet to really be a full-on priestess in all her glory, it's (Right now i am fuming, so my words got changed to a rhyme so soothing. I am huffing and puffing and let IT all out, so give me a hug while i sit here and pout) exhausting. Every interaction, every sentence, has to be calculated, weighed against who you're speaking to, how far you can push them, how far you suspect they can push back, who else is watching, how far they can be pushed, who else around you can be reasonably expected to have your back, whether those people can take what the other people can dish out if you push anyone too far, and just omg and on and on, and it Just. Doesn't. Ever. Let. Up. It's simultaneously the awesomest fun ever and just constant burying the stress needle in the red. I'm both loving it and quickly understanding how it can leave you wrecked for any RP purpose deeper than playing Fatarse with the Dale hooligans, and I have more sympathy than ever for those people who just spend a few months making a go of it and then just wake up one morning and be utterly drained and just completely dreading the NWN icon on their desktop, and move on to playing something capable of having an idle conversation with an actual friend.

_________________
Winner of Amia's "Most Ethical Time Traveler" award 2019
Image
Character Portraits!


 
      
Mahtan Tasadur
 
PostPosted: Sat, Sep 19 2015, 11:08 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 28 May 2006
Location: That place with the green grass and that blue sky.

Ala gave you a bunch of undercoke, that's got to mean something. :P

_________________
Image


 
      
Liz
 
PostPosted: Sat, Sep 19 2015, 21:08 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 28 May 2010
Location: Smallville

Mahtan Tasadur wrote:
Ala gave you a bunch of undercoke, that's got to mean something. :P

... but *why* did he give it to me? Is it part of some sort of scheme? Is he trying to get me hooked on smack to weaken my House? Is he trying to ingratiate himself to me with gifts so he'll be seen as a suitable boy toy? Gaahhh! It never ends! *tears out her hair*

_________________
Winner of Amia's "Most Ethical Time Traveler" award 2019
Image
Character Portraits!


 
      
Rigela
 
PostPosted: Sat, Sep 19 2015, 21:17 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 16 Sep 2010
Location: Grimy Old England

It's the drow equivalent of flowers.

_________________
Image
Signature by Maryn! <3 I am also seen as DM Snuffles.


 
      
Bravo21
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 21 2015, 5:40 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 11 Nov 2008
Location: In the land of liquid sunshine and coffee

It's a complex issue to be sure. But the cycle I've seen is that a clever player will gain prestige and power through RP means, not necessarily through combat or PvP. After a time, as other players who don't spend the same amount of time and effort to gain such a position of power themselves, find that it's faster and easier to simply grab a powerbuild and take what they want. The resulting RP of such a character lacks depth by nature and then when the RP in the crumbles and everyone leaves for a while it all goes to waste. Rinse and repeat.

The one character that was both most successful and the most fun to play was the weakest wizard in drow history. That it was mostly because I can't PvP to save my life, which caused me to find new and inventive ways to manipulating people and events. Maneuvering a First House Matron into giving a lowly male her authority and playing females off each other by implying the Ul'yathtallar needed to be consulted for anything I didn't want to do was particularly humorous.

It doesn't have to be a UD full of Drizzt's, but in the end, that's where it will lead anyway. And that is the hard lesson that made me give up on the UD completely. I like that a new crew is running with it and wish them all the luck in the world, but it always comes full circle, unless someone has found a way to break that cycle I'd love to know what it is.

_________________
Thine taste in horrid footwear not withstanding, I did not say that thou were in fact an idiot, I merely implied that such things were self evident.

-Krrja


 
      
DustSpray101
 
PostPosted: Sun, Sep 27 2015, 3:44 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 27 Jun 2008
Location: Night Vale

Something to keep in mind, from my perspective as an observer and story teller in the UD, is that we don't have a standard setting UD.

We've had to adjust it in a fashion to fit a PW where death is next to meaningless. This means balancing being inclusive with the natural exclusivity of many of our typically xenophobic playable UD races. Keep some of that in mind with how your character may perceive the world or want to be perceived in it.

_________________
Eli Hodgewall <{/,~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~X
Sven <=={o===========>
Qeelak \ | / ,


 
      
Rosencrantz
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 28 2015, 8:06 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 28 Apr 2007

Agree with Dusty here and had a discussion relating to this and it really crystallized my thoughts on the matter. The "Drizzt attitude" is more a result of Amia's attitude than any one player's actions. Amia is a server without real consequences. PCs can basically do whatever they want and they'll get to live free another day. It's not just Drow. I remember quite a few years ago some Sharran burned down Amia Forest and then like six months later was standing around in Amia Forest regaling the tale to a dozen PCs like some kind of anti-hero to be swooned. Hah! Amia is a very open, social server, where people can generally play the PC they want and where another player trying to punish that PC commonly results in OOC drama where that player feels like they're being personally attacked or something. Really, the "drizzt attitude" isn't born from a much different seed than all the personalities that can sometimes color Bendir Dale. The appeal to Drow RP on Amia has always been, to me, that it /is/ more hardcore than the rest of Amia. That's why I came to love it at first and have spent half a decade RPing Drow here, but the reality of the matter is that Amia is a light-hearted PW. Rated PG. It's for adventures and randomness, and that's a theme that's only grown more with time as the game has aged. It's the vision that makes it the first or second most played PW (excluding the Social servers o__o) in NWN1. I think that's the general aim and direction the Devs want to go with, and so it's really the server's culture that causes the Drizzt Attitude to be so prevalent. I'm not saying it should change; the server should be what it wants to be, and clearly its thriving under the direction it has taken.

But no, it's not the best environment for the most hardcore RP, and so, as Dusty says, we have to adapt that into our expectations. We can certainly encourage new Drow players and try to give pointers on Drow culture and etiquette, but we can't change the environment. What we can do, and what I hope to try initiating more of soon, is to encourage proper Drow culture through Drowish player-run events. Temple gatherings, public sacrifices (even if they're NPCs), pleasure house events, house quarrels, staged spars, ect. Dusty is creating for us an awesome backdrop with Abolethe and collective conflict, but it's up to us to fill in the gaps of the story with Drow culture. The DM can't create that. We can't give the server real, meaningful consequences that will make players think more deeply about their character's actions, but we can hope to weave an environment in Nec'perya that encapsulates Drow and encourages other, new and old players to take part and get their Drow game on. That's really the only constructive solution to this problem that doesn't involve bashing people (speaking of, apologies to my above comments on Bendir Dale, I'm sure some of the RP that goes down there is plenty rad).

_________________
Main: Riz'rae Faerfyn
Others: Aelron Rilynrae, Aeronor Tel'vyr


 
      
RaveN
 
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 28 2015, 17:35 PM 

User avatar

Administrative Developer

Joined: 08 Jun 2010

Definitely agree with Rosencrantz's post.

Personally, I'd like if some of the drow RP came back, since now it feels like we're perpetually distracted by this adventure, or that one, that we kind of numb out the politics, and conflict it thrived on the times past.

In the past, we've definitely had players who take full advantage of the system... that is to say, killing spiders, ignoring priestesses, logging off to avoid consequences and ultimately receiving no punishment nor by the DM's events they logged out of, nor the player, because of super-skiddish behavior and the lack of desire to try and discipline a immature player.

It would be great if every one of the drow would treat their lives as if it was their last one. I don't mean to say you should permadeath if you die, because I don't want that. But I want people to at least pretend like it matters. It's probably one of the most important things for me, in amia. Without it, I just can't get invested and don't feel immersed. But the good news is that the change starts with you. You are the dream that becomes reality. The more I see people playing like this, the more likely I think the Underdark will be a special place, and not just Bendir Dale in the basement.

_________________
a.k.a. Audrey Zinata


 
      
Mercedes
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 02 2015, 2:54 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 14 Dec 2011

I will concur with these sentiments. It was the fact that everyone pretended like their death had meaning and their actions had consequences that lured me to the Underdark. Not everyone is going to do it, and most aren't going to do it in the same way. If you need a solid consequence to step in line with Drow values or be more careful while scheming the downfall of the haughty matron, consider it the health of the UD community, the integrity of what we're building down there, and ultimately the satisfaction we're all looking for playing with one another.

Worse than a true death for any individual character would be the death of the UD on Amia.


 
      
Genar_Detkasa
 
PostPosted: Tue, Oct 13 2015, 10:23 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Location: Melbourne, Australia [GMT +10]

Well I’ve been meaning to make a post about this, mostly in response to the posts here about activity, but alas procrastination, and given what I've written, seems better to post it here.

Concerning DM and player activity.
I’ve been playing around Nec’perya since it first started (and before then, but not as involved with Edonil) and nearly none of the drow players from then still remain.
We’ve had various Matron and other proactive PCs who have come in, have a promising start with a good burst of energy but disappear. Not because of IC drow politics, but many of them get burnt out, decide they can’t effect any changes, get fed up and leave. Sometimes there's quite a bit of OOC stress, lack of meaningful RP, progress or things just gets plain boring when we're in a period where the UD is empty.

It might be easy to blame the lack of DM activity but really that’s hardly unique for Amia since it happens to every group. It just hurts the drow/underdark scene more because the RP here is so segregated from the rest of server. It doesn't help the lore can be so full on here and that not all DMs feel up for it.

We also get our highs and lows of activity, but that sort of thing is typically beyond a single person’s control. Drow RP after all can be a bit of a fad, sometimes we’re popular, sometimes we’re not. I don’t really see this changing in the foreseeable future. All I can say is don't get too hung up on activity, if things are slow, then that's that. It's good to take a break from drow every now and then to recharge your batteries, if you are playing a Matron or someone with influence, don't feel you should always be around.

I really have to agree with Rosencrantz about putting more effort into RPing drow culture, I think a lot of the difficulty is our own fault for orienting our RP too much around city-building and responding to the DM plot when we should we be focusing on our fun. In that respect, I think we should have gone back to the Sorcere and Melee-Magthere sooner as well as the more traditional drow stuff.

_________________
NWN Account Name: KnightProtector


 
      
Galenson
 
PostPosted: Sun, Oct 18 2015, 1:47 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 26 May 2006
Location: Down Under, calculating your demise with blunt expressions.

"Drow" roleplay has always been dependent on a central figure acting as the driving force behind it, be that a DM or player. For example, every time didi logged in (who played Veh'dra Qos'Yutsu), twenty Qos'Yutsu players crawled out of the holes in the wall like rats. But, when this central figure has to leave or can't maintain their drive either because they have burnt out or other parts of life take over, their following playerbase tends to leave with them. The rise and fall of Matrons is a common, repetitive form of this.


That's not to say that the Drow are the only group that are like this: many of the surface factions such as the Banites and War Knights were the same. But, when things fall through in the surface factions, those characters have options. When things go bust for the Drow, the options are more limited because the playerbase over a decade has made it that way. Let me explain how:


Isolation.


Its no secret that Drow role play is extremely isolated. The Underdark setting, the Lolthite focus... as much as I hate to admit it because it shouldn't be that way, the Drow are a server within a server because that's how the players wanted it to be. I can totally understand why: Lolthite role play compatibility is a niche market limited to a minority of the playerbase and the greater the emulation of a Menzo'beranzan styled environment, the harder it is to interact with the rest of the server who don't share the same tastes. But, that isolation is a two way street: the playerbase is left alone to conduct its Lolthite business, but at the same time it severs the link with the greater whole that is Amia thus limiting opportunities when things go wrong. As great as it is to say "well, I'm going to L'Obsul," the sad reality is that most players can't sustain role playing by themselves for long because the Underdark playerbase isn't big enough for two role play hubs this day and age. With that in mind, players come to making one of three choices: 1) Retire the character, 2) Go full heretic or 3) find a way to persevere. This rolls into the next point:


Lack of Character.


90% of Drow characters, more so amongst the male Drow then the female characters, are sheep. They were either created on purpose to serve a mate's female character, or lack the depth of character to stand on their own two feet thus becoming dependent on another character to shepherd them along. When that shepherd disappears, these sheep characters tend to go with them. Very few Drow characters have stood the test of time and those who have done so (Krrja, Naltyrr, Miz'ri) have persevered because they possess enough depth and ambition to become a force of character who can see beyond the Drow sphere. Some refer to this as "the Drizz't factor." As far as I'm concerned, they've earned their right to be this way: they are the wolves amongst the sheep.


So, how do we improve this?


I still think that Amia was never designed to support a textbook Lolthite Drow setting... but what we have today came to be because the playerbase wanted this. The environment and isolated setting as a result is not going to change, so it is us that needs to change. There needs to be more wolves and less sheep. Stop pretending you need a DM in order to role play and create a character with enough force to make role play happen.

_________________
Plays:

- Jhaeliria D'Vilrath: The Twisting Witch. Noble Daughter of House Vilrath, and gifted Illusionist

- The Scholar: Malignancy of the mind, corrupter of the spirit. The Great Game Changer

- Jack Galenson: House MD of Amia, but grumpier


 
      
Bravo21
 
PostPosted: Mon, Oct 19 2015, 0:28 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 11 Nov 2008
Location: In the land of liquid sunshine and coffee

Very good points and spot on for the most part. Though my own view of the underdark and playerbase in general are somewhat different.

In my experience the depth of a character is for my own benefit only as the majority of players will never be bothered to even attempt to scratch the surface of anything interesting I can come up with. With that in mind, what payoff do I actually have in making anything more than skin deep, another Drizzt? Once my own excitement of a really good character concept runs it's course, there's no reason to keep it going. So a player is then stuck trying to find a nitch, all alone. If anyone wants to know why there are few notable characters in the Underdark, or anywhere for that matter, look in the mirror. It is the reactions and interaction between characters that spur more vibrant characters, don't leave it to one person to do that work for you.

The isolation I would agree is a huge problem. It seemed that general drow RP and house politics was far easier and seemed more natural back in Ultrinin. Then there was the move. Things settled down, then there was the destruction of Edonil. Now many of the players who have and might play drow, only do so with trepidation and rightly so. I for one contested and argued with both these events as they were a dues-ex-machina at best and would only serve to curtail RP. And frankly, there's no reason for a player like myself to invest any time and effort to simply have it washed away, yet again.

So, what now? You say all we need is a few players to be the wolf and more will gravitate to that activity. I'd like to counter by asking what reason would they want to? I really hate being so pessimistic, I'm normally a rant for a few minutes and move on kind of guy. It just really pisses me off that I'm all out of perseverance to carry on and have had to find something else to do with my time. This is the point where I normally give some encouragement for people to try and maybe things will pick up again, but I've seen where that leads too many times already, wasted effort.

_________________
Thine taste in horrid footwear not withstanding, I did not say that thou were in fact an idiot, I merely implied that such things were self evident.

-Krrja


 
      
Galenson
 
PostPosted: Mon, Oct 19 2015, 15:21 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 26 May 2006
Location: Down Under, calculating your demise with blunt expressions.

Bravo21 wrote:
So, what now? You say all we need is a few players to be the wolf and more will gravitate to that activity. I'd like to counter by asking what reason would they want to?



Mate, I get it. I've witnessed the Drow build and destruction cycle three times now. The only player whose seen it more times then I have is that Pony we call Phearnun who was around when Udos Dro'xun still existed on Amia.


At the end of the day though, the player base time and time again still insists on the concept of having the Lolthite-centric setting. Even when I took a pragmatic approach and simplified everything for sustainability, when I stepped down to become a DM it reverted back to that Drow-centric setting it always has been.


That in itself tells me that there is something of value in this setting for you lot. If you need a reason, that would be it.

_________________
Plays:

- Jhaeliria D'Vilrath: The Twisting Witch. Noble Daughter of House Vilrath, and gifted Illusionist

- The Scholar: Malignancy of the mind, corrupter of the spirit. The Great Game Changer

- Jack Galenson: House MD of Amia, but grumpier


 
      
RaveN
 
PostPosted: Mon, Oct 19 2015, 16:04 PM 

User avatar

Administrative Developer

Joined: 08 Jun 2010

Status quo really.

I would prefer if the boat was rocked, but at this point, since I've spent years building what I currently have because of how Amia's turned into more of a building game it's almost grating to think what would happen with all those hours in just a few short days of a regime change.

I would personally love to see a silence of Lloth, a time of tribulation, Vhaeraun could start his own agenda.

One of the major problems is that we've had so much stuff blow up, that we've been encouraged to sink hundreds of hours into building, and have to start over that it makes me nauseous thinking about it happening again. The healthier approach to RP in general, is to not let people get attached to city, and make its development a passive growth without our direct care. But we all know that's not happening, because of how amia has evolved away from conflict, and into minecraft-y.

So I'm just not really sure where to go from here. I love playing a drow. I'll admit, I'm really lost with what's going on now anyways. Haven't had the perseverance, as Bravo puts it. Why is that? Probably because I don't expect there to be anything different going on than what's already been done.

I will just say that if the boat was rocked, whats to say that the RP will improve? Wouldn't we just have the same problem but in reverse?

_________________
a.k.a. Audrey Zinata


 
      
MazeOfThorns
 
PostPosted: Mon, Oct 19 2015, 19:04 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 17 Dec 2013
Location: Just arrived from Korriban by Fury class Imperial Interceptor

All right, I'll chime in. I miss the UD Lolthite RP. It was excellent when my character was involved in Nec'perya. Due to IC stuff I'm not down there anymore :( And have fought the urge to make another character to stop in for some cool RP since my main is banished and it didn't seem right to be down there and seen as snooping around.

I think the reason property gets destroyed is because it's easier to do that than to kill off the characters. It means a little more when you can destroy property, be it a building or golems or what have you. And it hurts the PC owner of the property. There is the more subtle approach but it's hard to be patient.

My suggestion would be to make Nec'perya more open to spies. Course this makes it possible for property destruction but perhaps a little sabotage isn't a bad thing. I mean the whole point of capturing surfacers would be to allow the small chance that they would be rescued. More RP for everyone -- And no the rescue doesn't have to be PVP, negotiation works if you're creative. (The raid in Frozenfar proved that. The rescuers negotiated to get the captured back.) Right now, there's no way to have interaction with outside forces since Nec'perya is impossible to get into if you're not a drow and no way to get a message for negotiation to them. :( (My understanding is that the farezz keeps any scying at bay?)

I would also suggest that if you are interested in making an Eilistraeen drow or half drow or whatever to be in the shrine... that you consider starting in the UD then escape!

I confess I've been attempting to draw the UD drow out into RP and will continue to do so. The UD Drow players have a lot to offer.

_________________
Image

2015 Mr. AMIA with the Fabulous Estara ~ 2015 Best Developed SOB Character: Rith'tar


 
      
RaveN
 
PostPosted: Mon, Oct 19 2015, 20:14 PM 

User avatar

Administrative Developer

Joined: 08 Jun 2010

Under the current regime, they might be more interested in letting people play both sides. Admittedly, I personally hated surface-going-spies; it was always a huge source of frustration, as it often times detracts from what I enjoyed about the setting, aside from being utterly unrealistic; and people tend to do it poorly and then complain when things hit the fan. Though seeing how I'm pretty inactive, whatever works.

If everyone could escape the underdark there wouldn't be.... every book ever writing about how difficult it is to do. And when people pop from Tarkuul in the day, to Underdark at night, sorry but I can't take you seriously. That does make me an elitist, but at least here's me being honest about it. It's one of the primary reasons I think drow should be a platinum/request only race. Because I feel like every story needs to be well thought out. Having it go whatever direction the RP is coming from just removes the genuine drow RP from the RP.

As I side note, I've committed my character to a linear story without compromising detours, and while I'm not allowed to tell other people how to play, I will just say it's less enjoyable when people just pop up whenever you're around and leave to play the other side (surface, not UD) when you're not. The underdark was always special place to me, because it had a high-learning cap for lore, and forced people to think on their toes to survive, and provide quality RP. I would fight against having it become Bendir Dale in the basement, or at least voice my discontent.

_________________
a.k.a. Audrey Zinata


 
      
The Great Equalizer
 
PostPosted: Tue, Oct 20 2015, 3:22 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada

Galenson wrote:
Mate, I get it. I've witnessed the Drow build and destruction cycle three times now. The only player whose seen it more times then I have is that Pony we call Phearnun who was around when Udos Dro'xun still existed on Amia.


Plenty of others have seen it, myself included, From the fall of Udos, Ultrinnan, Edonil. Of these Ultrinnan was the worst mistake in destroying, against anything any player really wanted and basically made up as a means to place Drow onto the newly created Amia B, which secluded Drow and UD RP in general immensely from what it had been.
Edonil's destruction just made it all even worse.


Faded Wings wrote:
I would personally love to see a silence of Lloth, a time of tribulation...


Actually an IC and IG silence of Lolth occurred on Amia during Ultrinnan's time, there was some interesting RP from it. Although I would not myself frown upon even the most shameless of stealing of some of the events from that time, house parties, gladiatorial competitions with captured monsters (always a classic), a Grand Games for Drow and their houses to gain the favour of Lolth. All good for encouraging activity within the UD as well as beyond it as well as giving some actual goals and reasons to drive RP that even if basic can still lead to greater activity.


Platinum requests make more sense for really rare things, Drow (on Amia certainly) are not really that. Further a large number of drow players I've seen over the years have come into it with little lore knowledge, many of whome went on to become great Drow players. Mostly through a sharp RP learning curve, with OOC support and knowledge and through having characters do things like offer second chances or the like. Since its one thing to punish the character, but don't punish the player due to lack of knowledge.


 
      
DustSpray101
 
PostPosted: Tue, Nov 03 2015, 2:35 AM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 27 Jun 2008
Location: Night Vale

Once again, (in remarkably semi-annual fashion) the topic of the Silence of Lolth has arisen around October. :lol:

Here is the official Amia stance on it and its fallout:

Taken from here...
DustSpray101 wrote:
Wrapped up and had a chat with the rest of the Team. Amia-verse Lore is as follows:

  • There was a brief Silence due to Lolth shifting the Demon Web Pits out of the Abyss.
  • The Lichdrow Dyrr perished before the Silence even begun as a result of jealous students overcoming his golem's wards. As a result, the events leading to the Lady Penitent Series (and much of the War of the Spider Queen) never occurred.
  • Selvetarm and Eilistrae are both alive and well.

The following cities were directly effected:
  • Maerimydra: It is firmly in under the control of Drow faithful to Kiaransalee.
  • Ched Nasad: Lolth was silent just long enough for rebel Drow to sack it, as is described in the WotSQ.
  • Eryndlyn: Lolth's Silence was not long enough for those faithful to her rivals to unite and lay waste to her followers. Lolthites are still there, and still largely balanced in numbers to the followers of the rest of the Dark Seldarine.
  • Chaulssin: The city is firmly Vhaerunite. What resistance against them had existed was squashed (sometimes literally).
  • Menzoberranzan: Events on Amia play out pretty much the same. They came out ahead slightly due to the shorter length of Lolth's Silence.

**Slight update on Chaulssin in our setting: Menzoberranzan is presently massing forces to take on this 'affront to Lolth.' **

As for the destruction cycle stuff...

I wasn't around for Drowville MK 1 and 2. I was present for Edonil though, both as a player and a DM.

:arrow: As a player, I saw real potential in the player base. However, I witnessed the struggle of you guys trying to adapt house vs house stuff to a world like Amia (where death is meaningless). Long story short, it led to immersion breaking open warfare with way too many survivors. While the people were fun, I thought that things down there got wonky a bit easily. Then I got to see it from a new point of view.

:arrow: As a DM, I still saw the same potential in the player base, but I started to see some limitations caused by Edonil's expansive feeling. It allowed for all sorts of armies to be made for houses to march on one another. That didn't seem to help any body stay immersed or happy when houses shifted every week. Yes it was chaotic, but that missed the point of Lolthite society where chaos is meant to be the subtext and not the text itself. After all, on paper, Drow look very -very- lawful.

I was really wondering what to do about reigning that in, when folks came to me with an idea. That idea was to destroy Edonil and they wanted to play the 'bad guy.' So, I let them. In typical form of my Sandbox DM style, I let you guys play against one another in a massively wonderful shadowy game. The villains, in this case, won. Both sides really had a shot in this. As for the villains, I won't out them as that secret is part of what made them successful, but I will say that they play some great Drow in a very non-Drizzt way.

In any case, as the plot progressed, I worked with our team on options to nurture an environment that supports the subtlety. As the villains' efforts neared their end and they remained overwhelmingly unthwarted, the writing was on the wall that Edonil was on its way out. So, we zoned in on producing an environment that could offer a heck of a lot better defenses than Edonil had with regard to surfacers running amuck in it as 'Justice' (pronounced 'Vengeance') for every raid on random adventurers in Amia Forest, all while offering a setting where outwardly 'peaceful' transitions of power were going to need to be the norm in order to keep the look of a strong, unified defense against enemies that lurk in overwhelming numbers not too far away.

Defense wise, with Nec'perya's coming into being, Lolthite Drow are provided a home that is now buffered from the Surface, a bit, without sacrificing a lot in way of accessibility. For starters: Of the UD locations, Nec'perya alone presently has the means to approach both L'Obsul and Shadowscape via boat. Even has the means to transport cargo and turn that into lucrative trade agreements should they so choose. Shadowscape has a plethora of links directly to the surface world, and not having a ground route to L'Obsul helps to severely slow down any surfacers that may want to come in and try to tank you all to prove a point or whatever silly reason would be given for Surfacers to try to raid an outpost in the Deeper Dark. Additionally there is the protection offered by the Faerzress, making folks damn hard to scry (if possible at all) thanks to its effects on Divination and Conjuration.

That's is mostly just the environment alone. You guys have done some marvelous things on your own initiative: That dome protecting the Ley Node, finding clever ways to produce some awesome golems...(list goes on with some items that should remain discrete in a public setting like this, just in case)... and last but certainly not least, you guys figured out a way to make powered iron-clad ships! From an achievement standpoint, you're doing awesome stuff and you are the driving force down there!

:arrow: DM hours:
Some of you guys may know the reason, others of you may not, but to be blunt: RL is kicking me pretty hard, and square in the groin. Hopefully once its done, I'll have the time that I used to have, as I absolutely would not trade DMing for you all for the world. I love it down here, and you guys are largely to thank for that. Until that time though, don't fear reaching out to the rest of the team. They're all there if you need them, and while I don't think any of them has the time to fully take the reigns, I do know that they're very interested in how things have been going in the UD and have even picked up running a few minor events themselves every now and then.

_________________
Eli Hodgewall <{/,~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~X
Sven <=={o===========>
Qeelak \ | / ,


 
      
angst360
 
PostPosted: Mon, Nov 09 2015, 16:56 PM 



Player

Joined: 10 Jul 2014

Faded Wings wrote:
If everyone could escape the underdark there wouldn't be.... every book ever writing about how difficult it is to do. And when people pop from Tarkuul in the day, to Underdark at night, sorry but I can't take you seriously. That does make me an elitist, but at least here's me being honest about it. It's one of the primary reasons I think drow should be a platinum/request only race. Because I feel like every story needs to be well thought out. Having it go whatever direction the RP is coming from just removes the genuine drow RP from the RP.


I find a lot of flaws in the above statement, aside from the tone.

1.) If the UD is supposed to be so hard to escape, why are there numerous UD areas that take you to some part of the surface? I can think of five off the top of my head. And have you ever noticed the large drow ex-pat community in the abyss? Speaking of the Abyss... If the UD is hard to escape, I would think venturing into the Abyss would be a heartbreaker, no? Wait, a lot of characters go there frequently! Can you summon the same level of scorn for them as well?

B.) To further your elitist education so you can truly be up to spec for your Platinum Request/Certification... I suggest you check out the current adventures of Jarlaxle, who flits back and forth between Luskan and Menzoberranzan using psionic portals to work his plots whenever he chooses. As it is, I am finding your qualifications to continue on as a drow to be suspect... :)


III.) This thread is named after the wrong drow rebel. Now, 'The Jarlaxle attitude' has a much better ring to it... and is closer to the truth.


Faded Wings wrote:
As I side note, I've committed my character to a linear story without compromising detours, and while I'm not allowed to tell other people how to play, I will just say it's less enjoyable when people just pop up whenever you're around and leave to play the other side (surface, not UD) when you're not. The underdark was always special place to me, because it had a high-learning cap for lore, and forced people to think on their toes to survive, and provide quality RP. I would fight against having it become Bendir Dale in the basement, or at least voice my discontent.


At last we can agree, sort of. The fact is, every UD Lothite drow enclave is going to follow the lead of its Matron Mothers... When there is no one to crack the whip for extended periods of time, the male drow get out of line and create frustrations... It's no wonder there are more Vhaeraunites than Lothites down there...

In fact, it would probably make a lot of sense if Lothites and Vhaeraunites switched places. Set up L'Obsul as a Vhaeraunite stronghold for plotting against the surface... and force the Lothites to come and get it if they can ever come to terms with each other and organize. Yeah, fat chance of that... what with Nec'perya being out of Loth's favor (obviously).


 
      
RaveN
 
PostPosted: Mon, Nov 09 2015, 17:20 PM 

User avatar

Administrative Developer

Joined: 08 Jun 2010

I just want to clarify that my assumption that the underdark was difficult to escape is a thematic consistency that you can take from any Forgotten Realms lore (Drow of the Underdark, is a good example), but Amia is special in that it has high magic, high travel high-everything, and while escaping the underdark might be a joke on amia itself, it doesn't mean I have to like it..

Quote:
As it is, I am finding your qualifications to continue on as a drow to be suspect... :)

Heh, I'm not familiar with any lore beyond 3.5e, but even if one drow has a ring that portals him places, it doesn't set the precedent that everyone should act like its commonplace. Otherwise the entire society would collapse on itself.

_________________
a.k.a. Audrey Zinata


 
      
angst360
 
PostPosted: Mon, Nov 09 2015, 17:46 PM 



Player

Joined: 10 Jul 2014

To follow up my previous post... with a bit of whimsy.

Wanna make the UD interesting? Change the religious focus of the drow of Amia B from being primarily Loth in nature to that of another member of the drow pantheon of deities. Yeah, there is actually more than one drow deity... shocker. Through turmoil and tragedy, turn the Lothites into the disenfranchised minority and they will once again have tangible desires and dreams. The problem the Lothites currently have is pretty simple: They have the bulk of the power and not much left to gain in the Amia UD. They are fat and lazy. No wonder its boring being one. No one to plot against but themselves? Pssh. Sure, every now and then a rebel comes along that needs to be put in his place... wait, bad example as they can't even seem to accomplished that! Seriously. Nec'preya is blatantly out of Loths favor, we joke about it at our Vhaeraunite meetings...

Anyways, I think it would be interesting to have one of the OTHER drow societies to delve into and explore. One that isn't bent to the service of the spider queen. To me, it would be a place with license to create a new and distinct branch of lore. And then, well... the Lothites could really have enemies to plot against instead of sitting around waiting for doom to crawl out of the sea and devour them with psionic energies or impotently shaking their fists at rebels they seem powerless to stop...


 
      
The Great Equalizer
 
PostPosted: Mon, Nov 09 2015, 17:52 PM 

User avatar

Player

Joined: 29 Aug 2006
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada

Forgotten Realms as a setting is in the mid-high magic range and further the physical aspect was never what made leaving the UD hard, especially with Drow living primarily in the Upper Dark and with even hardcore Lolthites venturing to the surface on regular enough occasions for raids and the like and with many less devout and non Lolthite sorts going even further in dealings with surface groups.

The "Difficult to escape" aspect does exist in lore but that has far more to do with the Social and Societal constraints, the fact that any "escaping" Drow rarely has anything better to be escaping to. For most Drow better their society with their rules where they have a chance at luxury and power rather than "freedom" where you will likely have nothing and end up hated and attacked at best.



As for your suggestion angst, while Vhaeraunite, Ghaunadaurite, Kiaransaleeans etc. societies are all interesting and should be explored Lolthite Societies Objectively are the Predominant ones for Drow in FR, The changes required to "Disenfranchise" Lolthite Drow would need to be fairly massive in scale and hard to justify in setting.


 
      
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 55 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group