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Dieu_Le_Fera
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 Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 6:37 AM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2009
Location: Philadelphia
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been musing lately of making a true spell thief... a wizard/thief with more then just one or two rogue levels... the problem is im wondering if would be in worth it since I would only be getting two attacks. Any ideas on this?
_________________  "It is by the holy beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning, it is by Java alone that I set my mind in motion."
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Jack O'Bannon
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 12:30 PM |
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Player
Joined: 02 Nov 2008
Location: Europe
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Dieu_Le_Fera wrote: been musing lately of making a true spell thief... a wizard/thief with more then just one or two rogue levels... the problem is im wondering if would be in worth it since I would only be getting two attacks. Any ideas on this? If you go 17Wizard/13rogue you could get lvl 9 spells, 3 attacks per round and epic dodge on top of that. Pick a race with bonus to intelligence and/or dexterity to get the best result. Elven, halflings and certain human subraces work best.
_________________
---
"Every time you play with fire, the fire plays with you.
and when you take the sword, the sword takes you, too."
Malle Malone
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 12:42 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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20 Wizard/10 SD with Epic Dodge! I want someone to do it.  It'd be feasible enough as an air genasi. _________________  "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Dieu_Le_Fera
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 13:57 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2009
Location: Philadelphia
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see the idea for the character is to be a knave Erevan Ilesere... they are the ones who go around and steal back lost elven artifacts the 20 wiz/10 sd would be nice... but would be a paaaain to level since I would have to go sd early to get that 3rd attack... or I could ranged and just use rapid shot + haste is 4 attacks minus what ever the AB for it... how does that sound?
_________________ "It is by the holy beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning, it is by Java alone that I set my mind in motion."
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 13:58 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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You'd only need to go 16 Wizard/4 SD pre-epic to get a third attack, though. Your damage would kind of suck either way, admittedly.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Dieu_Le_Fera
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 14:02 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2009
Location: Philadelphia
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yeah and no matter what I would be whoring tensers to hit anything.. hmm maybe 20 wizard/8 sd/2 AA to give a little more damage with my arcane arrows
_________________ "It is by the holy beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning, it is by Java alone that I set my mind in motion."
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Tomato Sword
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 14:41 PM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Aug 2011
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PaladinOfSune wrote: You'd only need to go 16 Wizard/4 SD pre-epic to get a third attack, though. Your damage would kind of suck either way, admittedly. This isn't possible, Paladin. You need 10 ranks in hide, the maximum you can cross class with pure wizard is 9 with Level 16 Wizard.
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 14:45 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Oh, you're one level off being able to. Lame. I still think Epic Dodge mage is a neat gimmick. _________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Tomato Sword
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 14:49 PM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Aug 2011
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For neat gimmicky sake, you can do Wiz 16 / Arcane Archer or Ranger 1/ SD 3 to get the third attack preepic and go Wiz 19 / Ranger 1 or Arcane Archer 1 / SD 10 for Epic Dodgeyness.
If you're really really desperate for a third attack but don't wanna go AA or Ranger route but Rogue for the ability to disable traps and what not... You can do 12 Wiz / 1 Rogue / 7 SD pre epic, though that makes you a squishy thing with no means to level but... Hey >.>! I did it.
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 15:39 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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PaladinOfSune wrote: Oh, you're one level off being able to. Lame. I still think Epic Dodge mage is a neat gimmick. Fake mage with epic dodge - Bard 20/10 Shadowdancer.
_________________
Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl
NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/
NWN Build Calculator: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=856
Last edited by Mobile_Svensk on Wed, Jan 25 2012, 18:56 PM, edited 1 time in total.
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Izzzt
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 18:40 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2008
Location: Rochester, New York, USA
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So. This is like, the first time I've seriously posted in this thread, asking for help. I never try to build strong characters on my own - makes things more fun, says I. But still! I'm trying to make a scimitar WM. Plain, ol' human.
Stats!:
Fighter 18/WM 7/Rogue 5
STR: 18 (26)
CON: 10
DEX: 13
INT: 13
WIS: 10
CHA: 8
L1: Fighter - Weapon Focus (Scimitar), Dodge, Mobility
L2: Fighter - Expertise
L3: Fighter - Power Attack
L4: Fighter - +Strength, Spring Attack
L5: Fighter
L6: Fighter - Whirlwind Attack, Weapon Specialization
L7: Weapon Master
L8: WM, +STR
L9: WM, Improved Critical
L10: WM
L11: WM
L12: WM, +STR, Cleave
L13: WM
L14: Rogue, little midbuild UMD
L15: Rogue, Great Cleave
L16: Rogue, +STR
L17: Fighter
L18: Fighter, Knockdown, Improved Knockdown
L19: Fighter
L20: Fighter, +STR, Blindfight
L21: Fighter, Epic Weapon Focus (Scimitar)
L22: Fighter, Epic Weapon Specialization (Scimitar)
L23: Fighter
L24: Fighter, +STR, Epic Prowess, Overwhelming Critical (Scimitar)
L25: Rogue
L26: Fighter
L27: Fighter, Great Strength I, Armorskin
L28: Rogue, +STR
L29: Fighter
L30: Fighter, Dev Crit, ESF Discipline
_________________
Plays as:
Richard Branno: Helmite Turnipfarmer
Herial Ghalen: The Merriest Man on Amia
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 19:20 PM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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Fighter20/Rogue3/WM7 is the standardized version of that, because it sacrifices a +1d6 sneak attack in favour of an epic feat. This is very plain ol', and the type Amian has adopted some time ago as the custom is Fighter12/WM16/Rogue2, because it sports a bigger AB, which is sort of the idea of going WM unless you want to reserve your Fighter's versatility with the pre-epic babies. Whichever way you choose to go (12/16/2 is better), do not take Rogue pre-epic. This decreases your endpoint AB by one, because Rogue is a "medium-BAB class". See here for more detailed info: http://nwn.wikia.com/wiki/Base_attackAlso I'll save Chris from posting by saying that you might also want to consider Fighter18/WM7/MS5. It's a great class and our most hated Aussie bastard has developed a perversion for it. _________________  UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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MoshingChris
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Posted: Wed, Jan 25 2012, 23:33 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Location: Down South and Bent Edge
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Wrong.
13 WM 12 Fighter 5 Master Scout Dual Wielding Finns.
_________________
I play: Gage le Gris
Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor
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Izzzt
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Posted: Thu, Jan 26 2012, 6:32 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2008
Location: Rochester, New York, USA
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Can 12 Fighter/16 WM/2 Rogue still take Imp KD and devastating critical? Or will I literally have next to no free feats?
_________________
Plays as:
Richard Branno: Helmite Turnipfarmer
Herial Ghalen: The Merriest Man on Amia
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Tri'Polar
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Posted: Thu, Jan 26 2012, 10:59 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Aug 2010
Location: Ova Dere
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Izzzt wrote: Can 12 Fighter/16 WM/2 Rogue still take Imp KD and devastating critical? Or will I literally have next to no free feats? My husband uses this build and I'm currently looking at it on a sheet of paper...so thought I'd chime in! You need six feats for Devastating Critical (Power Attack, Cleave, Great Cleave, Improved Critical, Overwhelming Critical, Devastating Critical). To have both Devastating Critical and Imp. KD you'd have to use eight feats. For WM you need Weapon Focus, Expertise, Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack and Whirlwind. That's a total of six feats. All together it would be 14 feats, to qualify for WM and take Dev. Crit along with Imp. KD I mean. 12 Fighter/16 WM/2 Rogue gets a total of 20 feats without human as a base race, 21 with human (11 base feats, 1 bonus feat from human, 7 bonus feats from fighter and 2 epic bonus feats from WM). If it was a human you'd have seven free feats if you took Dev. Crit AND Imp. KD. You could take Armor Skin, Epic Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization and Epic Weapon Specialization, Improved Expertise or whatever the heck you wanted. You decide if you would have next to no free feats or not. 
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Thu, Jan 26 2012, 11:08 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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You have exactly the right amount of feats for Dev Crit, IKD and Blind-Fight if you go with a human race.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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MoshingChris
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Posted: Thu, Jan 26 2012, 19:10 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Location: Down South and Bent Edge
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If you have an x3 (Base) Weapon I says yer wasting yer time wit Dev crit.
_________________
I play: Gage le Gris
Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor
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TeroSNS
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Posted: Sat, Jan 28 2012, 8:22 AM |
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Player
Joined: 26 Jan 2009
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I've been thinking of doing a tank...high ac, epic dodge... possibly dr? something similar like this http://nwnecbguild.44.forumer.com/dwd-e ... 15541.htmlI am having hard time to thinking that one into level 30 build... the dual wield I am going to ditch right away, but the knockdown can be fitted or removed if feats are required for something. _________________ My favourite sniper loadout: Huntsman, jarate, bushwacka. Team Fortress 2 is FREE TO PLAY! 
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Sat, Jan 28 2012, 8:36 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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16 Rogue/10 DwD/4 Fighter. Epic Dodge, epic damage reduction, tank everything ever. Just don't expect your ability scores to look pretty.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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TeroSNS
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Posted: Sat, Jan 28 2012, 14:21 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 Jan 2009
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PaladinOfSune wrote: 16 Rogue/10 DwD/4 Fighter. Epic Dodge, epic damage reduction, tank everything ever. Just don't expect your ability scores to look pretty. how should I start with con and dex, cos those are my main requirements? _________________ My favourite sniper loadout: Huntsman, jarate, bushwacka. Team Fortress 2 is FREE TO PLAY!
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Dergaii
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Posted: Tue, Jan 31 2012, 10:13 AM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jun 2007
Location: Waffles, Beer & Chocolate
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Moth wrote: I've noticed the Amia-custom monk abilities take a use of Stunning Fist and use the Stunning Fist DC, so I'm curious as to whether the epic feat Improved Stunning Fist adds to the DC of the Amia-custom abilities?
Thanks :3
Oh! Also I couldn't find it anywhere and didn't want to put it in its own thread, but since Dragon Disciples get +4 strength on Amia, I'm curious as to when they get it? Do they get +2 at 4 and +2 at 10 or is it the full +4 at 10?
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Remal
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Posted: Tue, Jan 31 2012, 11:48 AM |
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Player
Joined: 12 Feb 2011
Location: Elsewhen
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You get +4 str regularly, on 4th lvl.
_________________
"A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away." - Antoine de Saint-Exupry
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Moth
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Posted: Tue, Jan 31 2012, 12:31 PM |
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Player
Joined: 14 Sep 2011
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Thanks Dergaii & Remal :3 How about the Dragon Disciple AC? Is it +1 at level 5, then +1 more at 10, 15 and 20?
_________________    Zeskija Inalka - Catkin Meadowleaf - Xyme Thanas'ka
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Ulir
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Posted: Tue, Jan 31 2012, 17:54 PM |
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Player
Joined: 09 Mar 2009
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Moth wrote: Thanks Dergaii & Remal :3 How about the Dragon Disciple AC? Is it +1 at level 5, then +1 more at 10, 15 and 20? Yup. +1 at 5, +2 at 10, +3 at 15 and +4 at 20, as far as I recall. _________________ 
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TormakSaber
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Posted: Wed, Feb 01 2012, 2:08 AM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere
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Remal wrote: You get +4 str regularly, on 4th lvl. No. 2 at 2, 2 at 4.
_________________
Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds
Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
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wereguy2
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Posted: Wed, Feb 01 2012, 2:14 AM |
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Player
Joined: 07 Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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As far as I can remember, Improved Stunning Fist doesn't add to custom abilities. I have a Monk with 49 DC fists, and I'm preeeetty sure his other abilities weren't this high.
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TormakSaber
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Posted: Wed, Feb 01 2012, 6:18 AM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere
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Shame. It totally should. It's almost make that worthless feat worth taking.
_________________
Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds
Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
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wereguy2
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Posted: Wed, Feb 01 2012, 7:16 AM |
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Player
Joined: 07 Mar 2010
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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It's an awesome feat! Make it more awesome!
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Thu, Feb 02 2012, 19:03 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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Been wondering:
Number-wise which would be more beneficial, Armor Skin or EDR 3? Build is Barb 24/Fighter 4/Rogue 2 and will have EDR2, Mighty Rage, Terrifying Rage regardless. Just unsure if +2 AC is >= an additional 3/- DR
Char-wise, either works since I can see a Earth Gen barb amassing a bunch of DR (like a rock) and also toughening up their skin like armor (also like a rock), haha. Really, I think it's bonus points going with EDR3 given he's an Earth Gen. Also, not looking at PvP aspect he's for PvM (granted I'd like to be able to at least be worthy of PvP if he has to get into it).
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Thu, Feb 02 2012, 19:05 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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EDR 3.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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TormakSaber
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Posted: Thu, Feb 02 2012, 19:23 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere
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if you already have EDR2, go EDR3. All or none, you don't halfass it.
_________________
Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds
Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Thu, Feb 02 2012, 19:25 PM |
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Tester
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Another Barbarian question...
Does Thundering rage give the 1d8 sonic and on hit stun as per amia modifications in addition to the 2d6 critical hit bonus from vanilla nwn? Or just the 1d8 per each hit?
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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MoshingChris
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Posted: Thu, Feb 02 2012, 20:57 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Location: Down South and Bent Edge
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Just the 1d8 and stun.
_________________
I play: Gage le Gris
Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 2:06 AM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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So I've been wondering about a Fighter-heavy build. Essentially it's a way to buff STR a ton. I have made two possibilities:
Human Fighter 22/WM 7/Rogue 1 or Human Fighter 16/WM 13/Rogue 1
Same stats either way
STR: 15 (26)
DEX: 14
CON: 14
WIS: 10
INT: 14
CHA: 10
First build:
Knockdown, Weapon Focus, Dodge, Mobility, Weapon Specialization, Expertise, Spring Attack, Improved Critical, Improved Knockdown, Whirlwind Attack, Weapon of Choice, Blind Fight
Great Strength, Epic Weapon Focus, Great Strength, Epic Weapon Specialization, Great Strength, Armor Skin, Great Strength, Epic Prowess
Currently has a first level, three other pre-epic feats (one is a a Fighter bonus) and an epic feat free.
Second Build:
Knockdown, Weapon Focus, Dodge, Mobility, Weapon Specialization, Expertise, Spring Attack, Improved Critical, Improved Knockdown, Whirlwind Attack, Weapon of Choice, Blind Fight
Great Strength, Epic Weapon Focus, Great Strength, Epic Weapon Specialization, Great Strength, Armor Skin, Great Strength, Epic Prowess
Currently has a first level and two other pre-epic feats free. (Can you tell why this version has more WM levels?)
In the end, both appear to come out with the same AB after +12 STR items and a +5 weapon: 50
So, what I'm wondering is, does it really matter which one I go with. I could go 16 WM, but you can't take Great STR feats on Fighter/WM bonus levels, so it screws up the whole point of wanting high STR. I think the boosted STR augments the loss of the 3 WM levels completely, though?
Sort of at a loss for what to stick into the other feats. My first thought is to go for some weapon feats in a two hander (no WM bonus but nice for additional damage, but seems pointless considering the AC loss) or add some bow feats (mainly just Point Blank Shot).
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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Swallow the Stars
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 4:55 AM |
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Player
Joined: 12 Dec 2007
Location: Southeast (USA)
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Naivatkal wrote: So I've been wondering about a Fighter-heavy build. Essentially it's a way to buff STR a ton. I have made two possibilities:
Human Fighter 22/WM 7/Rogue 1 or Human Fighter 16/WM 13/Rogue 1
Same stats either way
STR: 15 (26)
DEX: 14
CON: 14
WIS: 10
INT: 14
CHA: 10
First build:
Knockdown, Weapon Focus, Dodge, Mobility, Weapon Specialization, Expertise, Spring Attack, Improved Critical, Improved Knockdown, Whirlwind Attack, Weapon of Choice, Blind Fight
Great Strength, Epic Weapon Focus, Great Strength, Epic Weapon Specialization, Great Strength, Armor Skin, Great Strength, Epic Prowess
Currently has a first level, three other pre-epic feats (one is a a Fighter bonus) and an epic feat free.
Second Build:
Knockdown, Weapon Focus, Dodge, Mobility, Weapon Specialization, Expertise, Spring Attack, Improved Critical, Improved Knockdown, Whirlwind Attack, Weapon of Choice, Blind Fight
Great Strength, Epic Weapon Focus, Great Strength, Epic Weapon Specialization, Great Strength, Armor Skin, Great Strength, Epic Prowess
Currently has a first level and two other pre-epic feats free. (Can you tell why this version has more WM levels?)
In the end, both appear to come out with the same AB after +12 STR items and a +5 weapon: 50
So, what I'm wondering is, does it really matter which one I go with. I could go 16 WM, but you can't take Great STR feats on Fighter/WM bonus levels, so it screws up the whole point of wanting high STR. I think the boosted STR augments the loss of the 3 WM levels completely, though?
Sort of at a loss for what to stick into the other feats. My first thought is to go for some weapon feats in a two hander (no WM bonus but nice for additional damage, but seems pointless considering the AC loss) or add some bow feats (mainly just Point Blank Shot). From a purely statistical standpoint, both builds would be unique in that you would be one of the only Fighter/WM build that didn't have a negative Charisma or Wisdom score. For more power - or effectiveness, or whatever else have you - it may be better to drop WIS and CHA down to 8's and boost strength with the points you gain. I would personally use points from CON, too, but that's just me. That, alone, would net you more STR, AB, Damage, Discipline, and whatever else. Also of note: You need Knockdown before Improved Knockdown (probably an oversight on your part) and Epic Fortitude/Epic Skill Focus: Discipline are both great epic feats. Called shot also ends up being fairly useful, I'm told. Personally, since you aren't going Devastating Critical, I would recommend Overwhelming Critical (for the damage boost) and a x3 weapon (battle axes are awfully nice). Just my two cents.
_________________
Espiel Callahan
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O'Raghailligh
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 5:12 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Location: NZ
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Overwhelming isn't worth it if you don't go for Dev Crit.
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 5:53 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Naivatkal wrote: Weapon Master Why go to all this trouble when 12 Fighter/16 WM/2 Rogue is far better than anything you've listed? 18 STR 13 DEX 10 CON 13 INT 8 WIS 10 CHA (or vice-versa for the last two stats) Taking a subrace that gives additional stat boosts will let you have both WIS and CHA at 10, if that's a deal breaker. Or go 17 STR and pick up an extra Great STR instead of Epic Prowess. Either way, far more viable than that weird stuff you've just posted! You should try to keep Great Ability feats to a minimum as they offer little in comparison to what you receive on a level 30-based server. _________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Swallow the Stars
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 7:12 AM |
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Player
Joined: 12 Dec 2007
Location: Southeast (USA)
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Just a quick question: What time increment does Purge Infidel last? It doesn't say in its description. I assume rounds, but I'm silently hoping turns.
_________________
Espiel Callahan
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 8:02 AM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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PaladinOfSune wrote: Naivatkal wrote: Weapon Master Why go to all this trouble when 12 Fighter/16 WM/2 Rogue is far better than anything you've listed? 18 STR 13 DEX 10 CON 13 INT 8 WIS 10 CHA (or vice-versa for the last two stats) Taking a subrace that gives additional stat boosts will let you have both WIS and CHA at 10, if that's a deal breaker. Or go 17 STR and pick up an extra Great STR instead of Epic Prowess. Either way, far more viable than that weird stuff you've just posted! You should try to keep Great Ability feats to a minimum as they offer little in comparison to what you receive on a level 30-based server. Could do 12/16/2 Tuigan with either 17 13 12 10 14 10 (with Great STR IV, Epic Prow, EWS/EWF) or Tuigan 18 13 10 10 13 10 (with Great STR III, Epic Prow, EWS/EWF, Armor Skin). I really like the thought of ending on 28 STR for some reason (probably because of the 40 buffed STR on a non-RDD hah). Also, 12 CON plus Toughness is pretty nice on the HP
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 10:35 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Except even with 28 STR you end up with fewer AB than the other build because of epic WM AB progression. And the lack of Overwhelming Critical means you're also weaker, too. So what was the point of 28 STR again?  Swallow the Stars wrote: Just a quick question: What time increment does Purge Infidel last? It doesn't say in its description. I assume rounds, but I'm silently hoping turns. If I had set that to turns, I would have banned myself afterward from ever making any balance suggestions again. It's rounds, of course. _________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 13:05 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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PaladinOfSune wrote: Except even with 28 STR you end up with fewer AB than the other build because of epic WM AB progression. And the lack of Overwhelming Critical means you're also weaker, too. So what was the point of 28 STR again? Do you mean because of the stats? Because a Tuigan Fighter 12/WM 16/Rogue 2 with 17 13 12 10 14 10 (or 18 13 10 10 13 10) can end with 52+ AB by my calculation (25 BAB + 3 WF/EWF + 3 SuperAB + 9 [28 STR mod] + 1 Epic Prow + 6 [+12 STR buffs] = 52). Granted, though, the build does then loose out on ESF: Disc and/or Epic Fort. With 48 buffed Disc (not counting items that might add, just points and STR), it's mostly immune to Knockdown, so Epic Fort is a much better choice between the two. Mostly, I'm curious on the AB. It seems like the boosted STR is pushing an extra 1 AB over trying it a different way (bumping CHA/WIS to 8 and STR to max at start means having to remove Epic Prow for Great STR, so you have the same AB and +1 dmg. Am I missing something in the numbers?
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 13:12 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Oh, I was talking about the first build you listed, with the minimum amount of WM levels. Thought that's what you were referring to with 28 STR!
I confess I haven't played a Weapon Master on Amia for several years now, but with the ease of the mythal system I wouldn't consider Epic Skill Focus: Discipline needed at all. I'd take Epic Spot instead.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 13:15 PM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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If you want Fort, Disc and Spot maxed on a WM, you'll need two separate sets for PvP. Or rather a few items you'll be swapping in combat whenever it's needed. That is pre-epic gear, of course. It's the case with most builds, if you want to play them properly. Totally worth the effort and you have lots of vacant quickslots to make it easier.
And I hate you for going STR 18 when you could start with 19. RP is not an excuse.
_________________ UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 13:23 PM |
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Joined: 26 May 2010
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To both of you: That's mostly what I was thinking (though I failed on the crafting portion haha). Multi-gear set are always fun, too! WAs considering sinking the available points into Craft Weapon 15(16), Discipline 33(42), Intimidate 4(4), Spot 33(35), Tumble 30(31), UMD 25(25) anyways. Might even drop the UMD to 5 and even out 10/10 for Craft Armor/Weapon. It pays to be handy. Maybe I'll drop Armor Skin for Epic Fort, too. Ja? Ohhhh yeah  Uncle-Opustus wrote: And I hate you for going STR 18 when you could start with 19. RP is not an excuse. Oh no! I have offended the Uce! lol
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 13:28 PM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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Naivatkal wrote: Maybe I'll drop Armor Skin for Epic Fort, too. Ja? Ohhhh yeah This had better be your understanding of a sick joke. But yarp, looks good, though Craft Weapon and Armour are doodoo, because there is so much gear to pimp dat bitches up. _________________ UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 13:35 PM |
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Joined: 26 May 2010
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Uncle-Opustus wrote: Naivatkal wrote: Maybe I'll drop Armor Skin for Epic Fort, too. Ja? Ohhhh yeah This had better be your understanding of a sick joke. But yarp, looks good, though Craft Weapon and Armour are doodoo, because there is so much gear to pimp dat bitches up. Joke?! I'd never joke about one of my precious builds! How dare you, sir!  (Yes I am) Craft A/W: I've always heard that, but I've never found a good amount of gear of it. Just rings and things here and there, really. Mostly, though, I was trying to figure the best place to put an errant 15 points haha.
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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davis114
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 17:52 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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Spot, spot, spot, spot, spot.
Spot.
Except make it more than an errant 15. Spot is Godly on WM builds. Unless you don't already have a UMD dump. In which case, bad you.
Also, Overwhelming critical is useless without DEV, EXCEPT for WM builds. Having that extra damage on an already buffed up crit is gnarly.
_________________  MoshingChris wrote: Dude makes like a drunk even when he's sober.
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 18:05 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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Not a bad idea on the OverCrit, have to think about it. If I ever make the char haha
Also, it has Spot! :3
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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davis114
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 18:19 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
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I'm curious about something, while I'm on here too. Are the Amia specific assassin feat DC's the same as the DC on an assassin's death attack? IE, 10 + int mod + assassin level? Or are the DC's set on something else? The description on the feats are a bit vague.
_________________ MoshingChris wrote: Dude makes like a drunk even when he's sober.
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Fri, Feb 03 2012, 19:08 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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It's the same calculation, yesh.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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