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Rogue/Monk/Fighter
https://amiaworld.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=143&t=89921		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Vortex [ Tue, Oct 24 2017, 2:02 AM ]
Post subject:  Rogue/Monk/Fighter
Been kicking around this concept for a long time, trying to figure out sweet spot of class levels.

13 Rogue / 9 Monk / 8 Fighter -> [more monk AC, extra epic fighter feat, less sneak dmg]

16 Rogue / 6 Monk / 8 Fighter

19 Rogue / 6 Monk / 5 Fighter -> [more sneak damage, crippling strike, less monk AC, use epic level feat for EWS]

Build requirements: Dual-wield kama, Epic Dodge, EWS

All of these builds will achieve the build requirements, just with different +/-. Any recommendations, suggestions?
Author:  Raua [ Tue, Oct 24 2017, 14:47 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
I'd say go with the 16/6/8 spread. You'll be ability score starved enough that you won't get a good monk AC bonus anyways! Also the more fighter will make the build less tight on feats, especially if you want to dual weild!
Author:  MightNMagic [ Wed, Oct 25 2017, 1:49 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
I've always ran 19/5/6 just fine. You have more than enough feats. However, consider using assassin. It works just fine and imo there's zero reason to ever use rogue when you can use assassin.

Some caveats though. Kama-sneaks are my usually favorite build, but I abandoned them on this server mostly because almost everything on the high end is immune to sneak. Most things that aren't immune to sneak are immune to knockdown (practically) having far too much discipline and strength for it to work. Ultimately the biggest nail in it's coffin is the fact that the few bosses you can sneak attack, won't let you sneak them (having Bioware default true sight), being immune to KD outright, etc. This is why choosing to use a Dex f/wm/r is a better option. The weapon master crits will at least let you beat bosses you can crit/sneak.
Author:  Vortex [ Wed, Oct 25 2017, 23:28 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
MightNMagic wrote:
I abandoned them on this server mostly because almost everything on the high end is immune to sneak. Most things that aren't immune to sneak are immune to knockdown (practically) having far too much discipline and strength for it to work...


Thanks Might, that's exactly the kind of feedback that's really helpful. I was wondering if sneak or crit damage would be most effective at epic. Sounds like you answered that. I'll trash this build and start over...I have no desire to make a WM build. I just don't get it, but I hear over and over it's the way to go. I'll try something else.

Now considering Fighter/SD dual wield kukri's, with a little Rogue thrown in to qualify for SD prereq's.
Author:  MightNMagic [ Thu, Oct 26 2017, 1:05 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
Well the reason why WM is simply because most of the sneak-able bosses won't let you sneak them. They have true sight, they can't be KD, etc. So the crit damage works fine. Also, races that have darkness at 1 round/level (tiefling, drow, etc) are very helpful at bossing as some bosses are vulnerable to it and lets you get off sneaks (like snowbeast).
Author:  robbi320 [ Thu, Oct 26 2017, 9:22 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
Yep. My Assassin could solo Snowbeast a bit, if I was careful (and even got there, without the snow spectres killing me) but any other boss killed me. (Well, apart from Braxat, lol) Not even FireGiants, simply because the have TS, are difficult (if it's even possible) to KD, and daggers and all meant I dealt like 5 damage per hit. And they regen...
Author:  Vortex [ Sun, Oct 29 2017, 4:13 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
Since sneak isn't that great at epic levels, but I still want a char that's Dex based with Epic Dodge and dual-wield, what about:

Rogue 10/ Monk 10/ Fighter 10

Just enough Rogue and Monk to get pre-req's for ED, and plenty of Fighter to get juicy feats. And Monk 10 gives a lot of extra AC, so my dual-wielder sans shield can survive.

Any thoughts?

p.s. I considered Shadow Dancer to get ED pre-reqs, but it's just not what I want for this build. Rouge/Monk combo fits concepts much better.
Author:  Mask and Riddle [ Sun, Oct 29 2017, 10:43 AM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
I'm presuming you'd go 8 fighter, 8x, 4y in pre epic for 17 bab by level 20.

Starting with a rogue level for max skill points.

So a heavier monk build would have more advantages, but if your character concept is more rogue, then I can't see much of a downside, other than having to wait until very late levels to get ED, maybe even level 30.

Realistically, with a starting wisdom of 14, and reaching a geared dex bonus of at least +14, you would have a decent AC. You would basically have the same AC as a rogue with a shield.
Author:  Vortex [ Sun, Oct 29 2017, 21:40 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
10 Monk / 10 Rogue / 10 Fighter

Key features: Dual-wield kamas, Epic Dodge, EWS

Pre-epic: 8 Monk / 8 Rogue / 4 Fighter

These are the stats I'm coming up with:

APR: 8 (10 w/ Haste & Flurry) 44/41/38/35/32/29/44/41
AB: 44 (42 w/ Flurry)
AC: 62 (66 w/ Haste)

Saves: (incl bonus from feats and maxed Ability Mods)
Fort: 28
Ref: 28
Will: 20

How does this stack up?

n.b.: 4 Ftr levels pre-epic instead of 8 simply due to lack of interesting feats. Lose 1 AB but would rather have 2 extra epic Ftr feats (will take E. Prowess to make up lost AB).
Author:  Raua [ Sun, Oct 29 2017, 22:41 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
Seems fine to me, tbh!

So long as you get enough pre-epic feats in, you should be fine.
Author:  Mask and Riddle [ Mon, Oct 30 2017, 15:36 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
agreed, 2 epic feats (given that you have enough pre epic feats) is worth the trade off of 1 bab.

That should cut through quite a bit.
Author:  Vortex [ Sat, Nov 04 2017, 22:10 PM ]
Post subject:  Re: Rogue/Monk/Fighter
Thanks for the feedback. I do have one feat choice to make:

Strong Soul (+1 Fort and +1 Will) or Toughness (30 HP)

Already taking Luck of Heroes and Grt+Epic Fort, so saves are decent. Toughness would bump HP from 450 -> 480.

What would you do?
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