AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic

Last edited by Dead on Sun, May 03 2015, 20:03 PM, edited 1 time in total.

Richard_Edmund wrote:

http://www.mylivesignature.com/mls_wizard1_1.php

Or you can use this, it's pretty cool. But you might need to edit the image in an editor or something.

It is pretty cool I must admit. And now I'm torn. >.>

The first one for readability.

For someone with high intelligence, he sure has messy handwriting.

Richard_Edmund wrote:

For someone with high intelligence, he sure has messy handwriting.

Have some Nikola Tesla handwriting.

Okay once and for all:

If you are building a shifter and you take 6 levels in druid, even if you are not using any druid spells, animal companions, whatever druidish, just need that lvl 6 to make the rest of the build fit, do you have to either:

1) RP a druid
2) Request a Shaman

It's level 5 druid that is the shifter requirement.

Casvenx wrote:

It's level 5 druid that is the shifter requirement.

Oh I am quite aware, but that's not what I'm asking.

Dead wrote:

Okay once and for all:

If you are building a shifter and you take 6 levels in druid, even if you are not using any druid spells, animal companions, whatever druidish, just need that lvl 6 to make the rest of the build fit, do you have to either:

1) RP a druid
2) Request a Shaman

No, you don't have to RP being the druid or take said levels as a shaman ((assuming you are not using spells, companions...ect druid stuff))

Quote:

DC Calculations and Spells:
DCs on Shifter abilities are calculated from a unique formula: 10 + 1/2 of Shifter Level + Wisdom Modifier. In cases where an ability has a duration, it is calculated as Druid + Shifter level. For abilities which have a scaling damage amount, the amount is again calculated as Druid + Shifter level

Our powers scale off the druid class, you can take them as a empty class all the way up to druid 10 because you cant take more then 10 shifter before epic, so your forced to take 5 levels of something else ((classes that otherwise would not improve your abilities damage or duration)) and a pure shifter would gain everything a druid would get up to level 10 expect venom immunity at druid 9 ((and balance wise, that's nothing even worth noting))

Dead wrote:

Oh I am quite aware, but that's not what I'm asking.

Oh I figured, I was just getting that clarification out of the way quickly. I've understood the current rule to mean that, yes, levels 6+ need to be accounted for as an actual druid (or shaman). A non-druid shifter needs to take a 3rd class pre-epic (barring special requests maybe). Of course I'm in no position to make the official call, which I'd guess is what you're going for here.

Thanks!

Search vs Spot:

I'm curious to see a DM's perspective on the difference between these two when used in an event.

Mechanically speaking, Spot is Wisdom-based and used to see hidden creatures, provided they are not invisible. In events, it is generally used for all manner of things, like seeing things way off in the distance or noticing things up close. Search on the other hand is Intelligence based and used to find traps, hidden doors, and hidden objects. But from my own experience, it doesn't get much play; anything that needs to be "seen" usually gets Spot rolled against it.

So my question is what would Search be used for in one of your events as a DM? Does it not get asked for because it is figured most people haven't invested in it? What's the difference in Spotting something and Searching for it? Maybe with one you're actively looking for something(Search & Intelligence) but with the other, you happen to notice it from your surroundings(Spot & Wisdom)?

Dark Immolation:

I like to think of Spot as brief, a scan with the eyes that can find things that may be visually indistinct, but present in line of sight. Whereas Search is a tactile and visual skill in which something is actively sought out. For example, if there was a key to be found in the debris of a room, I'd allow Spot or Search to discover it. Spot might be noticing a glint of metal reflecting off light in the room, thus finding the key, while Search would be methodically piecing through the room to discover the key. A situation where Spot would be the only appropriate one might be a situation where a patch of wall out of reach of the PCs has symbols on them with mold covering them. Spot could be used to decipher what the symbols are, but Search wouldn't be viable because the patch is too far up for the PCs to closely inspect it with eyes and hands. If they could get up there to reach it, Search would become viable. A situation where only Search is viable may be a situation in which there's a hidden access panel in the room that is visually identical to the rest of the wall. Search would perhaps have the PCs run their hands across the walls, seek out likely spots, check for structural flaws or such to find the panel. Spot wouldn't work because there's nothing to 'see'.

I think Spot is a more instinctive "Oh look, there it is!" skill while Search is a methodical "If I try this...maybe this...Aha!" kinda deal. There are definitely situations where only Search would work, or only Spot.

Is there any lore that's written for the KC class or a mechanical description of their abilities as far as if they are extraordinary, supernatural and so on, and how they are ICly activated, persist etc? Or is that being left for people to fit to their chars on their own? for instance, difference between a purely martial character with KC levels and a spell based character with KC levels?

Gravemaskin:

The KC abilities are mundane in nature (I can't remember the category for that), and function based on the presence of the KC. It's implied that they activate and function through the KC actively leading or directing those around them in combat. Previous rulings on the nature of the auras have been that they cannot be RPed as magical effects (presumably unless requested, but nobody has done that yet). So the Barricade of Swords aura might be the KC directing their party into a formation that lets them retaliate to blows swiftly, or the KC pointing out incoming attacks to be countered, but it couldn't be the KC causing the party to sprout blades from their armour through magic or a blessing from their god causing painful feedback to their attackers, etc.

There isn't any specific lore written up for it that I'm aware of, so as long as the abilities are RPed as mundane, it's largely up to the KC player to determine how they want to express the use of their auras. Throwing out commands in combat, RPing the use of particular stances and formations, inspiring their group with particular songs/tales, whatever you feel is appropriate and fits your character.

It's rather confusing to hear that KC abilities are "Ex." (Extraordinary), since some of latter effects, especially regeneration and immunities in granted form fall, traditionally, into "Su." (Supernatural) category.

I'm aware of at least one occurrence of KC abilities being re-fluffed, after request, into inherently supernatural effects, but due to mechanics of such, each case is likely to be one of a kind.

That's because it's not really regen, it's mundane treatment/triage, first aid and so forth. Unnervingly fast? Perhaps, but still slower than supposedly mundane bandages...

Yea, that's why I was curious as to it all. I'm not sure how trough mundane means, you can for instance lower teh fire resistance of a fire giant enough to burn him, unless it's with some sort of preperation or ointment or.. something, but then it doesnt' make sense for an aura. All in all, I've found it difficult to reason or even roleplay out the auras and I think getting a full description that goes beyond what's described in the feats and that explain how they work mechanically, similarly to standard classes in sourcebooks, would really help solve this issue. As it is now, I'm finding it difficult to RP out my character's KC abilities in the same way I do the bard part.

Like when someone walks around with the Vehement Charge aura all the time.. does that mean they're constantly charging everywhere?

I know I'm being a bit difficult, but I think having it all written in stone would make it much clearer and easier to RP the class.

Hey man you are not being difficult at all, I've had the same issues. KC RP basically boils down to, at present, RPing a leader of some sort (or even just a headstrong presence, like with a bard/KC). I'd love more fluff lore given to explain things like the Ordnance Support and others.

Amarice-Elaraliel wrote:

Update

Added Alter Self and Skinchanger:
viewtopic.php?f=151&t=81958

Added VFX Widgets:
viewtopic.php?f=151&t=81959

Started "what to expect when I make a special chara/race/nobility/homebrew request" on the DM forum.

To be added the next days:
The PLC Widget
The Item Spawner

RE: Alter Self

1.Is this treated like the spell for requests or is it a widget that can be requested without the actual spell being in a spell book?

2. If it is treated like a spell, are the DC costs, RP requirements, etc. associated with a custom spell also associated with this widget?

I also find it a little difficult to know how to RP my KC auras. If you'd like, I'm happy to try and come up with some ideas with you for how your auras can be RPed and presented. One example I could think of for how Ordnance Support might work would be directing your party into a different combat formation in order to force enemies into exposing weak points in their armour/hide/whatever, letting spells hit with greater effect.

Krin:

1. Alter Self is mechanically a widget, and thus doesn't require any spells to use, nor does it take any slots in a spellbook.

2. The RP with which you request Alter Self can be that you're requesting the spell version, but you can also request it even if you're not a spellcaster. You do, of course, require appropriate RP for the ability so if you're not requesting it as the spell Alter Self, you'll have to think of other RP for it. If you request it as the spell, you'll still just be paying for the widget, not a custom scripted spell. RP requirements of you learning the spell will of course still be in effect.

Thanks!

Does the elven "subrace" feytouched require a special request to play? Their entry in the racial topic makes no mention of it.

Pony:

The feytouched subrace does not require a request.

Dead wrote:

I find this one more compelling.
Because you /can't/ read that

And also I think the other one was used by Hashim Hoios, though I guess he's not around anymore anyway.

EDIT: Sorry for necroposting

Does Bardic Knoweledge and Lore stack?

Aka, if I have 29 bard levels and 32 lore skill points, will my lore rolls be 32 or 61?

Does NWN treat the lore bonus from Bardic Knowledge as actual ranks in the skill instead of a bonus to the skill? I was certain that was the case though someone recently suggested it was otherwise.

According to NWNwiki it doesn't count towards the +50 skill bonus cap. But, I'm not sure if that counts as actually having the ranks for things like Prestige Class requirements.

It doesn't count towards the skill cap, and it doesn't count towards feat requirements. You actually need 20 base lore to qualify for epic skill focus: lore for instance.

As such a level 30 bard with 33 base lore and no int mod has "base" 63 lore before any skill focuses or the +50 skill cap begins to be added. Just be careful you don't end up over the engine max or you get -127 lore.

What is the engine max? >.>

127. If you raise it to 128 you go to -127.

And it seems that it doesn't go into the minus range anymore either, if you go beyond it. It stays at 127.

Not sure if that's from 1.69 or one of the hak files, as I haven't tested it since before 1.69.

This includes anything that raises the skill point modifier, except for d20 rolls.

example:
If I had picked both epic and normal skill focus lore, my bards lore would end up at
33+25+10+3+8+50 = 129 lore BUT since I mistakingly thought it'd put him at -127, I avoided picking it... Which I now regret because he only reaches 126 not 127 >_> This must be remedied somehow in the future.

Last edited by Pony on Fri, May 08 2015, 9:39 AM, edited 1 time in total.

Already at exactly 128 without any buffs to raise the intelligence score. *cough*

Just can explain it ic with a mental breakdown because the human mind cant handle skill like that.

Also found this :

NwN Wikia wrote:

The theoretical maximum for a skill level is 168 (in lore, for a bard), but the game is designed with an assumption that skill levels (and the DCs for skill checks) will not exceed 127. A cap enforces this assumption on skill levels in most cases, and incorrect numbers are displayed for DCs that exceed this limit. Fortunately, this is usually not an issue. A more typical maximum skill level is 70 without bonuses from items and effects (coming from 43 ranks, plus 14 from an ability, plus 13 from epic and regular skill focus), or 126 with bonuses (+50 from direct bonuses and +6 indirectly from ability bonuses). Thus the game's limit would only come into play in extreme cases when there is another factor involved, such as a racial bonus to the relevant ability or a bonus from a feat other than epic and regular skill focus.

I realize NWN is an entirely different beast than D&D, but.... A DC of 40 is supposed to be the 'impossible' range. What in the world would you ever need ~130 lore for? I'm not sure the gods (or at least their avatars) would score that high.

I almost want to see a 150 DC on something just to say it's officially 'impossible'.

The most an amian character could get to with really lore-max built is 143 lore, that would make the amia impossible range 164 points, as 163 is the max with a natural 20 roll. That is a 30 bard sun elf, with 33 ranks in lore, +50 items/spells, with the feat courteous mageocracy, skill focus and epic skill focus lore, and six epic great intelligence feats +12 int gear to raise his int score to 40 for a +15int modifier.

But yes, even 127 is already pure and absolute ludicrousness by pen and paper standards. I expect any character with 143 Lore would become the next Alaundo, and begin spewing prophecies. :wink:

Edit: I actually looked Oghma up for the heck of it. He has various knowledge skills at 99 base skill. +20 Bardic Knoweledge from his 20 bard levels. +15 int modifier with his base 40int, so if he had +12gear that would be, +21int modifier. Toss on about 50 skills modifier from equipment - and a fully nwn geared up avatar of Oghma would actually have: 190 knowledge, bumping up the realms unobtainable limit to a juicy 211.

Ok... current year is 1383 and the Spellplague has not occurred, right?

That Guy wrote:

Ok... current year is 1383 and the Spellplague has not occurred, right?

Correct! Our "world" would look a bit different had the spellplague hit. I personally detest the Spellplague and anything related to it as it mucks up the lore big time.

Lore beyond 3.5e is pretty shitty, really. Spellplague and all the gods dying. Ick.

We're not using spellplague, etc.

Pony wrote:

Edit: I actually looked Oghma up for the heck of it. He has various knowledge skills at 99 base skill. +20 Bardic Knoweledge from his 20 bard levels. +15 int modifier with his base 40int, so if he had +12gear that would be, +21int modifier. Toss on about 50 skills modifier from equipment - and a fully nwn geared up avatar of Oghma would actually have: 190 knowledge, bumping up the realms unobtainable limit to a juicy 211.

But does Oghma know why kids love the taste of Cinnamon Toast Crunch?

Regarding skills for gods, while I always disliked having PCs come directly up against them and not some aspect or avatar of them, I'm pretty sure you can assume they succeed at anything they try, barring a higher power preventing them. Once you get into the creation of artifacts and long-standing affects, maybe you break out the rolls. Trying to interpret the whole of godhood never really worked wells with rolls for me in campaigns. Even with the "no fail on 1's" thing gods get from Divine Ranks. Much better to use them as a frame narrative and let their pawns, knights, bishops, and maybe even queens roll the bones against the players. Because really. What does making a 211 lore roll even mean at that point over 128?

Is Greater Sanctuary supposed to dispell on losing all the bonus HP?

Despite being classified as 'bosses', are the Skeletal Knights and Ghostly Witches of Caraigh supposed to drop from the tier 4 loot bin? (The witches also have a 25% drop rate)

Ok, this may sound silly or even wrong to ask on an RP server... buuuuut....

Attack Bonus.... without Aid and Bless and other trinkets (but counting long term buffs if you're a caster), what AB is the minimum you'd consider "effective"?

Example.... I seem to always think 45 and above is really the minimum if you plan to be a fighter type at all. However.... many builds I see on the "Teach a man to fish" forum can't possibly get there, and some are muuuuuch higher.

Any thoughts?

I assume you are talking about pvp then? Usually 40-42 is the bare minimum, though you do suffer at that level. This is sometimes overcome depending on if you use HIPS, spells, etc. It is all relative.

Sure, I know, it's a very situation dependent question, but... thank you! 40-42 answers what I needed.

Blackguard Pacts.

I know an FAQ was started but... I can't find it. If anyone can point me to it, that would be most appreciated!

My question is this:

Can a person perform a summoning ritual to bring forth a servant of Hoar, selling their soul in exchange for the powers of a Blackguard? Do I need a DM to do this with me? Do I need to write out the details of this pact and get approval from the team?

There's just not a lot of information on becoming a BG around, and the Amian rule of "friendly contact with an evil outsider" makes it complicated. I assume if the person was so inclined to the dogma of Hoar, the servant might show up thinking they can collect an easy soul in exchange for a bit of power.

Now... what kind of servant? Erinyes? I thought them since they are fallen angels, in other words, beings that might want revenge, so... serving Hoar makes some sense?

So confused..... Thanks for any advice!

You don't necessarily have to play a BG as someone with a demonic pact or bargain. There's very little FR canon lore to support that, and the "friendly contact with an evil outsider" is entirely open to your imagination on how it plays into the class. Most NPCs in Forgotten Realms with the blackguard class are actually divinely powered (Scylla Darkhope, Champion of Bane being the big one I can remember off hand.)

The whole Faustian blackguard just seems to be a predominant style choice in Amia, but unless I missed something somewhere, it isn't required.

I suspect, from what you've said, that a divine blackguard might make more sense. Play it like an anti-paladin, and perhaps the "friendly contact" would simply be an Erinyes messenger from Hoar giving your character a divine quest or mission. That satisfies every requirement and would seem to make more sense in this circumstance.

Blackguard are however wholly evil and work to spread that evil and corruption based on their beliefs. Hoar does support both good and evil and works on both sides of the spectrum (which annoys both Tyr and Bane) but he seems strange for a BG Patron. A Grey Guard or Divine Champion would fit him really well if you wanted to take vengeance to the extreme, but ... if you're an evil bastard who follows the dogma of Hoar I don't see why you couldn't bargain for power with one of his more evil - inclined underlings, in a pact or something more along the lines of what NC posted.

This brings up an interesting question about BGs and Neutral gods who support evil followers. Would a BG in Oghma's service go around slaying and purging the ignorant?

Great, thanks NC!

Last edited by That Guy on Thu, May 14 2015, 18:06 PM, edited 1 time in total.

I have spoken with a few DM's.... and it was agreed that Hoar would support BGs.... I thought that part was settled. I'm thinking a pact, rather than just contact. Erinyes are devils of vengeance so, it makes sense for them to be the middleman, right?

I'd think it's kind of like Paladins... not all deities would want them, even if the alignment "works". For a blackguard? Ohgma I would think wouldn't make sense.... Neither would say... Helm. But Hoar? Dark vengeance.

Helm wouldn't work? Why not? He has an Order of paladins called the Vigilant Eyes of the Deity and has a fairly strong friendship with Torm.

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