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I would like you to address a problem that seems to run rampant with players who play druids on this server. Druids on this server tend to randomly attack people with undead pets. This hurts RP. Don't do it.
This is a warning to ALL druids. Don't be surprised if the next level 3 cleric with a death domain summons that you attack without appropriate role-play is me. I will report you. I will then continue to walk the SAME path as if NOTHING happened, since the PVP you started and finished is illegal, thus out of character, and anything out of character does not happen. That way, your aggressive friends can get frustrated because I am ignoring you, attack me too, and get reported as well.
Re-address your role-play, druids. If you think that druids walk up to non-aggressive people that are practicing necromancy and kill them, then you are wrong.
Here's the second most aggressive, yet legal, exchange I can imagine:
A druid sees someone with an undead pet and says, "This vileness must be stopped. Destroy this unnatural creature and lay it to rest, or I will." After this is said, it is then acceptable to attack the UNDEAD. If the druid attacks the player with the undead pet, that is illegal pvp, unless you include the character in your threat. If the player with the undead pet attacks the druid or their pet because you attacked their undead, then it is completely legal for the druid fill their lungs with water and watch them drown.
Here is the MOST aggressive, yet legal, exchange I can imagine:
A druid sees someone with an undead pet and says, "Put this creature to rest, or I will kill you." Pretty out of character for a druid, but I'll go along with it since it's legal. If the character responds with anything other than begging for mercy, then, put your hostile on and go for it.
Illegal interactions include saying, "Is that an undead?" Then attacking before a response. Another illegal interaction is saying, "Is this your undead?" Then attacking when they respond, "yes." Another illegal interaction would be making an out of character comment like "|<insert druid's name here> is totally undead police|" then attacking the owner of the undead pet. A threat is not a question. If you think it is, please refer to your dictionary. By the rules an in character threat MUST occur before pvp is innitiated. Also, a threat out-of-character is not a threat in-character.
I know this is verbose, but this is a big problem with druids in particular. Druids are awesome characters. Why destroy the character by tainting them with stupid illegal actions that can get you kicked off the server then noone can play with you anymore? Lame... Now if you are having a bad day and just don't feel like coming up with a good story, just come up to someone with an undead, say, "I will kill you, now," then put your hostile on and go at it. Sure, you might get reported, but at least you followed the rules and probably won't get banned. But to be safe, just role-play with people you want to kill, for the love of all rp-pvp!

Thank you for reading.
Joe

No. Druids are basically the Undead-police, Worse than Kelemvorites really. You do -NOT- defile the dead, and rise them from the earths vomb to fight for you.

If you did it once, you're bound to do it again. Hence - Die die die

The Main Rules of Amia wrote:

1. Amia is a role-playing server, not a PvP arena server.

2. All PvP must have a role-playing reason. PvP without a sensible reason is not allowed. Your character's alignment is not a valid reason for PvP. Summons, such as undead, are a valid reason but do not excuse you from the below protocol.

3. You must give the other party a reasonable chance to back down from the PvP In Character.

4. IC Actions lead to IC Consequences. If you initiate a conflict (by insults or thievery, for example), you can't expect to get away with it. You cannot ignore other players' RP or declare it null.

Quote:

I will then continue to walk the SAME path as if NOTHING happened, since the PVP you started and finished is illegal, thus out of character, and anything out of character does not happen.

Ghnnnnnnnnn... No. What happens, HAPPENS. Hell, if the druid is to trigger happy, he might get fallen - but the RP? Yeah, it happened

See...the above is completely related to what's being discussed...lol.

Chaotic stupid is stupid whether they're evil, neutral, or good.

Difference is it's illegal for evil to do the onething they should be doing...being chaotic stupid.

Very_Svensk wrote:

No. Druids are basically the Undead-police, Worse than Kelemvorites really.

*SLAP!* Take off that black'n'white tabard at once! You're not worthy of wearing it any longer. Shame on you, your name and your dog!

The solution: Do not walk around with undead out in the Amia Forest, or other hotbed places for undead-killers. I am sorry, but this is perfectly legitimate. That your character insists on travelling with an undead out and about with him is Ic, as is the response of the other character,s up to and including violence on your own PC.

Heh, you and me herra... Your kelly vs my druid, we'll debate who's the biggest police!

Edit: Yeah. Soz. Solution - Do not walk with .- .. .. Goddamnit. Ninjaed

Very_Svensk wrote:

No. Druids are basically the Undead-police, Worse than Kelemvorites really. You do -NOT- defile the dead, and rise them from the earths vomb to fight for you.

If you did it once, you're bound to do it again. Hence - Die die die

Hmm, if this is an acceptable reason for PvP, I've got some other things that should be perfectly fine.

Drow killing... *coughs, and rolls out a list*

Yeah, somehow I don't see that happening. The point is that it is illegal for evil to attack its preferred victims by virtue of being evil, but it is apparantly perfectly okay for everyone else to attack evil just for being evil. There's an unbalance there, and it pisses a lot of people off...

The PvP rules state that there must be RP to back up PvP. That means that you do not get to attack a character on sight regardless of what summon he is running around with. If you do, do not bitch when those same characters start pre-emptively attacking YOU on sight. (And you'll be happy to be on this server, where a PvP death does not cost you a respawn penalty)

Look look look.

They want to BITE YOU. EAT YOU. and anybody who summon the dead to BITE OTHERS and EAT and rip their flesh of, is a goddamn evil man.

Basically - Would you want your mother to be raised from the dead to eat you? It pretty much goes down to that.

:EDIT:

Above post said wrote:

The PvP rules state that there must be RP to back up PvP. That means that you do not get to attack a character on sight regardless of what summon he is running around with. If you do, do not bitch when those same characters start pre-emptively attacking YOU on sight. (And you'll be happy to be on this server, where a PvP death does not cost you a respawn penalty)

None is against this. This is not the subject. The subject was - Undead out = An out to pvp your sorry A**

Actually, if druids ignore undead they Fall pretty fast I'd imagine.

Yes, Exactly!

I'm curious as to why undead give grounds to automatically pvp someone without RP?

MoshingChris wrote:

I'm curious as to why undead give grounds to automatically pvp someone without RP?

They don't. RP is there. He is complaining about being attached, period, because he is walking around with undead near Druids. the solution is obvious: Do not walk around with undead. Undead are one of the most polarly charged forces in DnD along with celestials and evil outsiders and their presence immediately changes a situation. The player of a necromancer should undertand this and ot be angry OOCly if the expected reaction occurs and people are willing to attack him over having undead. Indeed, why kill the undead and let the source escape? No, you take down the creator and halt the flow at its source.

MoshingChris wrote:

I'm curious as to why undead give grounds to automatically pvp someone without RP?

Me too. Because if it does, I am so going to stand around somewhere with my zombie out...

...and my weapon already at the ready, grinning maliciously while waiting for some idiot to twitch. It'll be awesome.

Two wrongs do not make a right and if you're baiting people like that to try and force a rule breaking I'm more likely to slap you than the guy who attacked in the first place.

TormakSaber wrote:

They don't. RP is there. He is complaining about being attached, period, because he is walking around with undead near Druids. the solution is obvious: Do not walk around with undead. Undead are one of the most polarly charged forces in DnD along with celestials and evil outsiders and their presence immediately changes a situation. The player of a necromancer should undertand this and ot be angry OOCly if the expected reaction occurs and people are willing to attack him over having undead. Indeed, why kill the undead and let the source escape? No, you take down the creator and halt the flow at its source.

Tormak, the OP is specifically talking about people who see Undead and automatically attack it without giving the IC out. His examples clearly illustrate that.

A good Response wrote:

A druid sees someone with an undead pet and says, "This vileness must be stopped. Destroy this unnatural creature and lay it to rest, or I will." After this is said, it is then acceptable to attack the UNDEAD. If the druid attacks the player with the undead pet, that is illegal pvp, unless you include the character in your threat.

An Illegal Response wrote:

Illegal interactions include saying, "Is that an undead?" Then attacking before a response.

Etc.

Remember - As i pointed out, and Tormak emphasized.

It's better to F**k up the source, than the Dead walking. That way - No more dead walking! ever!

Hoo-raah!

Question... is my druid required by oath to stop the "source" of the undead? I can definitely see putting an end to extant undead, but the source thing is a little unclear. Is that expected, or is it acceptable?

The point the OP wanted to make, Svensk, is that you cannot attack before giving an IC out, as you quoted in your own post. It's number 3.

Yes Yes, Duly noted. Thank you! :wink:

Logicality wrote:

Question... is my druid required by oath to stop the "source" of the undead? I can definitely see putting an end to extant undead, but the source thing is a little unclear. Is that expected, or is it acceptable?

Well... I guess it's up to each Individual character to determine the situation. And based upon experience, and/or lore/Dogma/morale decide what action is best to take.
Basically - wisdom

Well, then the player is complaining about illegal PvP in general, and so it has very little to do with Druids, Paladins, Undea,d or demons or anything of the sort so you're down to demonizing a group simply for attacking your character, when the issue is a rule, not that they are a druid and you are summoning undead. I still think all of my posts ring true though. If you get attacked for having undead out, next time you will know to not have undead out.

Quote:

Question... is my druid required by oath to stop the "source" of the undead? I can definitely see putting an end to extant undead, but the source thing is a little unclear. Is that expected, or is it acceptable?

It is not necessary to kill the summoner but I think a reasonably wise druid understands that no river was dammed by throwing a single stick into the river.

Quote:

Don't be surprised if the next level 3 cleric with a death domain summons that you attack without appropriate role-play is me. I will report you. I will then continue to walk the SAME path as if NOTHING happened, since the PVP you started and finished is illegal, thus out of character, and anything out of character does not happen. That way, your aggressive friends can get frustrated because I am ignoring you, attack me too, and get reported as well.

btw, making passive aggressive threats like this is not a great way to make friends on the server...

Right, but I'd doubt a reasonably wise but physically weak druid would attempt to kill a significantly powerful necromancer, when, if he/she doesn't, he/she might instead live to protect nature in other ways. :-)

TormakSaber wrote:

Two wrongs do not make a right and if you're baiting people like that to try and force a rule breaking I'm more likely to slap you than the guy who attacked in the first place.

No offence Tormak, but that just reeks.

So if an evil character gets attacked for acting evil, it's fine.
If the evil character continues to act evil in the exact same way, but learns from his mistake and starts killing off his attackers, that's not fine.

I like to think of it as a sting operation to weed out the trigger happy folks who obviously graduated from the "More Dakka!" school of problem solving. I'm not saying they shouldn't attack, I'm saying they should RP their way up to the attack just like everyone else. If there's IC threats made, and hostile moves taken leading up to the attack, that's fine. If I go afk and return to find that I'm dead, that's not fine.

In fact, I tend to take offence if that happens.

Very_Svensk wrote:

Quote:

I will then continue to walk the SAME path as if NOTHING happened, since the PVP you started and finished is illegal, thus out of character, and anything out of character does not happen.

Ghnnnnnnnnn... No. What happens, HAPPENS. Hell, if the druid is to trigger happy, he might get fallen - but the RP? Yeah, it happened

Bumped for Emphasis.

edit:Weylyn_SotW - This is not the "Evil vs Good thread", thats in the other topic. This is Druids vs Dead Things walking and eating our moms.

Logicality wrote:

Right, but I'd doubt a reasonably wise but physically weak druid would attempt to kill a significantly powerful necromancer, when, if he/she doesn't, he/she might instead live to protect nature in other ways. :-)

*Repeats*
Well... I guess it's up to each Individual character to determine the situation. And based upon experience, and/or lore/Dogma/morale decide what action is best to take.
Basically - Wisdom.

I had a post typed up, but I don't see the point. This is not a "Druids vs. Dead Things walking and eating our moms" thread, Svensk. The OP has no problem with being attacked for having Undead out. He has a problem with being attacked without warning or the rule-necessary IC out. I fail to see how this has been construed as a post by someone who can't take PvP. If anything, he encourages it.

Weylyn_SotW wrote:

TormakSaber wrote:

Two wrongs do not make a right and if you're baiting people like that to try and force a rule breaking I'm more likely to slap you than the guy who attacked in the first place.

No offence Tormak, but that just reeks.

So if an evil character gets attacked for acting evil, it's fine.
If the evil character continues to act evil in the exact same way, but learns from his mistake and starts killing off his attackers, that's not fine.

I like to think of it as a sting operation to weed out the trigger happy folks who obviously graduated from the "More Dakka!" school of problem solving. I'm not saying they shouldn't attack, I'm saying they should RP their way up to the attack just like everyone else. If there's IC threats made, and hostile moves taken leading up to the attack, that's fine. If I go afk and return to find that I'm dead, that's not fine.

In fact, I tend to take offence if that happens.

Leave the "Sting operations" to the DM, and don't try and play big shot by purposefully goading people into breaking the rules. Just roleplay. Take offense all you want.

Hmm... I think you're right, Koragi.

It's one of my faults - I get trigger-happy with posts when i'm riled up.
-----
Either way, Pvp is valid if RP happens BEFORE The pvp, giving an out, and everything.

But i am personally not happy with his reaction if he get's punted for having a dead guy walking about.

Quote:

I will then continue to walk the SAME path as if NOTHING happened, since the PVP you started and finished is illegal, thus out of character, and anything out of character does not happen.

^
This. Is not good. At all.

MoshingChris wrote:

I'm curious as to why undead give grounds to automatically pvp someone without RP?

They don't.

What an undead summone does however is give an opportunity for escallation of conflict RP. What you see is what you get. Having the undead for all to see is an invitation for conflict. It could be as simple as "Unsommon that of I kill you", or fairly involved RP that takes several minutes. The point being is that, just like having OOC information in your bio, it would be OOC metagamming for a PC to ignore your undead summon in areas where they are not allowed.

Very_Svensk wrote:

Hmm... I think you're right, Koragi.

It's one of my faults - I get trigger-happy with posts when i'm riled up.
-----
Either way, Pvp is valid if RP happens BEFORE The pvp, giving an out, and everything.

But i am personally not happy with his reaction if he get's punted for having a dead guy walking about.

[What OP said]
^
This. Is not good. At all.

I agree that's not the best way to handle it. Rather, OP, I would suggest that you screenshot the encounter so you can report them if they insist on breaking the rules of PvP. I'd probably stay dead and wait for them to get bored with staring at my corpse, then leave after they did. I wouldn't want to RP with someone who intentionally breaks the rules, either. Since, y'know, you're told to review the rules the moment you join and I'm supposed to assume you know them.

"You" is used as a general whoever-did-it term, of course.

Bravo21 wrote:

MoshingChris wrote:

I'm curious as to why undead give grounds to automatically pvp someone without RP?

They don't.

What an undead summone does however is give an opportunity for escallation of conflict RP. What you see is what you get. Having the undead for all to see is an invitation for conflict. It could be as simple as "Unsommon that of I kill you", or fairly involved RP that takes several minutes. The point being is that, just like having OOC information in your bio, it would be OOC metagamming for a PC to ignore your undead summon in areas where they are not allowed.

No its not, you can't detect magic link or whatever. You don't know who summoned the undead that happens to be following that character. If i say, "No I don't know whose it is but it keeps following me" theres no grounds for pvp, just kill the summon and let me on my way. If i'm correct this is just another line in the epic comedy. Its a running joke OOCly and at least three people who have posted in this thread know the running Joke I'm talking about.

I don't. Enlighten me please

I have to agree.

If there's absolutely no RP occuring between initial spotting of Undead, and conflict, there's a breach of rules.

However, suitable time to be made aware of the situation and be given a choice would be sufficient.

There's an interesting and kinda fuzzy ground regarding ambushes and surprise attacks, but I'll take that to a seperate post to keep the topic on track.

The problem is, what people consider sufficient oppritunity to make a choice can be put up for debate until the cows come home.

I believe that multiple warnings should be given, especially if the personal is only being verbally reticient and not doing anything else harmful.

If however, they make a credible threat, or brandish a weapon or begin casting any augmenting spells after you've given warning? That would be sufficient cause in my opinion to be engaged.

This isn't as relevant if the only reason a person is being engaged is their Undead summon, but there are options around that, that allow a primary attempt solely to remove the Undead summon first.

I agree with Very_Svensk, my example of walking around with a level 3 death domain cleric to bait the trigger happy is not my job. I apologize for crossing the line there.
But I am very happy that I posted the rest of what I did, because I think it brought up some issues that seems to come up rather often, and it's not just with druids:

1)Players tend to believe that they can create characters that are exceptions to the servers pvp rules, so they don't have to follow them.

2)Players also tend to try to create characters that won't follow server's pvp rules because it would be out of character for them to do so.

I am very happy that we have some more clarification on the rules, thanks to Koragi Mydnite. I hope that this post helped enrich the pvp on this server, particularly between people with undead pets and druids.

Ya.. you need to relax for a few minutes Svensk.

The rules for PvP require you to give an 'Out'. Just becouse someone has an undead dosnt mean you can just up and attack them. You need to tell them to leave first, or dismiss the pet. As far as im concerned the OP is fine, if im walking along with an undead out and someone randomly rolls up and kills me, reported and ignored. That didnt happen. Just becouse as far as Lore goes it makes sence dosnt mean its okay to do. Server Rules before Lore. Drow dont get to kill elves on sight, elves dont get to kill drow on sight. Paladins dont get to smite evil on sigh, so on so forth.

You must offer a resonable IC out.

Which makes me laugh now that im thinking about it..
Paladin: Stop being evil at once of ill smite thee!
Evil Dude: uh. uh.. *gives his sweetest smile*
Paladin: *smite smite smite!*

While amusing, its not a resonable out. This kinda shit should be common sence by now, just becouse you deal with 100 undead a day dosnt mean you can start killing the 101st that walks through. Sometimes its becouse their stupid, sometimes its becouse they want attention, sometimes they actually just want to RP out the conflect that such a summon generates.

Its pretty simple:

1) Undead are probably the one type of creature that everyone except those who summon them can agree should not exist, good or evil. This is rather universal; no one likes the idea of someone defiling the dead, possibly your friends, or even yourself when its your time to go. Zero tolerance of undead should not be a surprise to anyone. Heck, my non-tree hugging AA will fill any undead he sees with his lovely corpsekiller arrows.

2) No, you can ofcourse not know if that particular undead is summoned by that particular person. It is a rather safe to assume that the skull-mask wearing, black-robed, wizard staff carrying PC might have something to do with the undead that follows in his steps however. High wisdom characters aren't stupid after all.

3) Ofcourse you give an IC out: Unsummon it, or suffer the consequences. If the accused pulls the "Uh, sorry officer, but I have no idea why that skeleton is following me", you are free to attack the summon. After all, no one owns it who will admit it. This should mean that the summoner forfeits his ooc right to engage in PvP when his non-acknowledged summon is attacked ofourse.

Before anything, I want to clear up a misconception of Druids that was stated here and is this idea that Druids can't be killers. Druids can very much so be heartless murderers. If you summon an undead and you refuse to unsummon it, that Druid can very much so kill you and be fine in the eyes of nature gods. It's also totally fine in the PvP rules. Druids aren't simply life cradling huggle bears, they're many things: cradling huggle bears, blood lusting murderers, zero-tolerance hammering beasts, patient and internal, wise and pacifist, etc. etc. Don't judge a Druid PC based on a warped idea you have of what a Druid is. Druids can be many many things.

On to the topic at hand: Of course no one (not just Druids) should simply attack you without going through the proper steps set forth by the rules. Report them if they do. Still, it's unfair to generalize the whole Druid player base as rule breaking PvP happy monsters. That's simply unfair and untrue. Next time something like that happens, just screenie it and send it to DM's. There's no need to drag a whole player base through dirt.

Also, if someone pulls the whole "I didn't summon it, it's following me", that's cool and all, and even if it's true, be a sport and take what comes at you. The other PC has a perfectly legit reason to knock your teeth in. Put yourself in their shoes and you'll see their side. Be a good sport and just have fun with it.

+1 Guns...

Can I say a Blight Bringer of Talona.... or perhaps an Elven Druid pushed over the edge and turned to Eldreeth Veluuthra *talk about a "manhunt"*? Even the most nature loving druid pacifist can be pushed over the edge if circumstances arise. A city begins to expand and roads become busy... one that happens to go through a forest protected by a circle of druids. The expansion moves onto their lands and the druids have to act...

MoshingChris wrote:

Bravo21 wrote:

MoshingChris wrote:

I'm curious as to why undead give grounds to automatically pvp someone without RP?

They don't.

What an undead summone does however is give an opportunity for escallation of conflict RP. What you see is what you get. Having the undead for all to see is an invitation for conflict. It could be as simple as "Unsommon that of I kill you", or fairly involved RP that takes several minutes. The point being is that, just like having OOC information in your bio, it would be OOC metagamming for a PC to ignore your undead summon in areas where they are not allowed.

No its not, you can't detect magic link or whatever. You don't know who summoned the undead that happens to be following that character. If i say, "No I don't know whose it is but it keeps following me" theres no grounds for pvp, just kill the summon and let me on my way. If i'm correct this is just another line in the epic comedy. Its a running joke OOCly and at least three people who have posted in this thread know the running Joke I'm talking about.

Huh? You do read before responding, right? At what point did I declare a link between summoner and summoned? The issue was PvP due to OOC knowledge. In this case, seeing the necro waltz through the forrest being followed by an undead summon. My point was that one cannot simply take the OOC information and PvP. The rules require at least a minimum of RP, and through that RP the direction of potential PvP be established.

At no point did I contradict your statement, simply confirmed that it was against the rules to do so. And if this is just a joke, why perpetuate it?

As long as the sword is double-edged, I'm okay with it.

Meaning, as long as having a celestial summons is enough grounds for my evil whatever-class to attack the goodie, then I have no problem with them attacking my undead. The problem arises when the goodie attacks my evil character for having an undead out and then bitches when I attack them for having a celestial summons out. If things are as black and white as you have an undead summons and my character is aligned against them, therefore I can attack you with no RP involved. Then it's only fair that an evil character can do the same thing to someone who has summoned a celestial to assist them.

You can't have it both ways and unfortunately, it seems that players who are playing certain alignments are being given the green light to "have their cake and eat it, too" by the lack of mention that it is, indeed, a double-edged sword.

Last edited by Yurell on Wed, May 05 2010, 23:53 PM, edited 1 time in total.

Koragi Mydnite wrote:

TormakSaber wrote:

They don't. RP is there. He is complaining about being attached, period, because he is walking around with undead near Druids. the solution is obvious: Do not walk around with undead. Undead are one of the most polarly charged forces in DnD along with celestials and evil outsiders and their presence immediately changes a situation. The player of a necromancer should undertand this and ot be angry OOCly if the expected reaction occurs and people are willing to attack him over having undead. Indeed, why kill the undead and let the source escape? No, you take down the creator and halt the flow at its source.

Tormak, the OP is specifically talking about people who see Undead and automatically attack it without giving the IC out. His examples clearly illustrate that.

A good Response wrote:

A druid sees someone with an undead pet and says, "This vileness must be stopped. Destroy this unnatural creature and lay it to rest, or I will." After this is said, it is then acceptable to attack the UNDEAD. If the druid attacks the player with the undead pet, that is illegal pvp, unless you include the character in your threat.

I highlighted in red - there was an IC out. Unsummoning the undead is a valid out AFAIK.

As for the rest of the OP ... yeah. You're baiting the druids with the undead in the first place, ignoring the out given by the druids because it's inconvenient, complaining when they attack you for perfectly good IC reasons, making groundless threats, and then threatening to break the rules yourself.

Ainjyll, as far as I know, there is no such thing as legal PvP with "no RP involved"--as outlined by others, the druid would still have to offer an out.

Yurell wrote:

I highlighted in red - there was an IC out. Unsummoning the undead is a valid out AFAIK.

Yurell, those two responses were marked with what the OP was stating as a difference between a good response and an illegal PvP attack. I know it's an IC out. I marked it with "A good response" and the one without the IC out as an "illegal response".

Edit: Editted out my response to Ainjyll. I thought he was saying that celestials could be treated the same way as undead, not that there should be PvP without RP.

Koragi Mydnite wrote:

Yurell wrote:

I highlighted in red - there was an IC out. Unsummoning the undead is a valid out AFAIK.

Yurell, those two responses were marked with what the OP was stating as a difference between a good response and an illegal PvP attack. I know it's an IC out. I marked it with "A good response" and the one without the IC out as an "illegal response".

Ah, my apologies then, I seem to have misunderstood the OP. Yes, random PvP without RP is bad.

Logicality wrote:

Ainjyll, as far as I know, there is no such thing as legal PvP with "no RP involved"--as outlined by others, the druid would still have to offer an out.

TormakSaber wrote:

They don't. RP is there. He is complaining about being attached, period, because he is walking around with undead near Druids. the solution is obvious: Do not walk around with undead. Undead are one of the most polarly charged forces in DnD along with celestials and evil outsiders and their presence immediately changes a situation. The player of a necromancer should undertand this and ot be angry OOCly if the expected reaction occurs and people are willing to attack him over having undead. Indeed, why kill the undead and let the source escape? No, you take down the creator and halt the flow at its source.

Tormak's quote pretty much says it all. A druid can attack someone with no "RP" involved. Having that undead summon is "RP" enough to warrant the attack.

Which, in my mind, is fine as long as it works both ways. Good can attack Evil for having evil summons and Evil can attack Good for having good summons.

If that quote is only the stance by Tormak alone and not the DM team as a whole, then please, by all means, correct me. However, it reads as the stance of the team.

Logicality wrote:

Right, but I'd doubt a reasonably wise but physically weak druid would attempt to kill a significantly powerful necromancer, when, if he/she doesn't, he/she might instead live to protect nature in other ways. :-)

A good time for that druid to go get the others to deal with the more powerful necros; as they are chewy and good with ketchup. Teamwork is important, kids! ;-)

Ainjyll wrote:

Tormak's quote pretty much says it all. A druid can attack someone with no "RP" involved. Having that undead summon is "RP" enough to warrant the attack.

Which, in my mind, is fine as long as it works both ways. Good can attack Evil for having evil summons and Evil can attack Good for having good summons.

If that quote is only the stance by Tormak alone and not the DM team as a whole, then please, by all means, correct me. However, it reads as the stance of the team.

From my perspective, you still need to give them an out. Even if it's just "Release/Dismiss the undead/angel/demon/devil/etc., or you're in for a beating. You've got 10 seconds." I'd think that's enough time to type a response, even if it's just "//hostiling" or "//typing 1 moment." 'Course, casting a buff on yourself (or the summon, in this case) voids the out and gives the other party carte-blanche to attack immediately.

Druids and PVP

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