AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic - The Official Teach a Man to Fish topic (Build topic):

Fair enough. Although I do still need to be concerned about whether or not I can come up with what is being asked for (I'm sure I'll figure it out eventually though!)

serbiris wrote:

Help needed! Working on a Tiefling weaponmaster. A plethora of special requests is in the works for him, not the least of which is one or two custom epic feats. Unfortunately, level adjustment and the loss of certain feats means I have to make some difficult choices.

Weapon: I kinda wanted to go bastard sword or a greatsword. Bastard sword costs a precious feat, but I'm not fond of two-handers because I like having actual AC, though. What I could do is take Monkeygrip, except apparently DMs only want it to be transmitted through training by PCs. This is difficult for me, because I have few hours for Amia and a dodgy timezone. Also, there are probably less than ten PCs with Monkeygrip that have been active in the past year or so. At least three of them are permanently gone, most of the rest aren't very likely to help a tiefer - if I could even find the time to meet with them. Going greatsword and then being unable to get monkey grip would be a huge problem.

Giving up Weapon spec - No matter what weapon I choose, if I get two custom feats instead of just one, Epic Weapon Spec is the first to go (prowess is already out for the first custom feat). Is there something else I should be dropping instead? (Out of: Great Str1 (starts on 18 str), Overcrit/Devcrit, EWF)

Going bastard sword costs a precious pre-epic feat, though - which should I drop? The only really expendable feats are Improved Knockdown or Weapon Specialisation. Almost everything else is a necessary prereq except knockdown and imp crit.

So yeah... any suggestions, answers to those questions? I've got the build plan basically worked out, so do ask if more information is needed.

On Amia, with the current changes to Devastating Critical, I personally wouldn't go that route -- even on a Weapon Master. You're more likely to kill your opponents with massive damage, anyway. Overwhelming Critical is still nice, however; so perhaps forgoing Devastating Critical could save you all the feats you need, and net you Epic Prowess and Epic Weapon Specialization (as well as your custom feats)?

I'm sure there are twenty people in this thread who will disagree with me. Then again, even if Devastating Critical was an automatic killstroke I wouldn't go for it. I like big numbers.

I would be inclined to agree, but devcrit on a 19-20 weapon is still two rounds of disable, which seems fairly useful and against someone who would otherwise take me out or have too many hit points, seems useful.

Also, it's just really fun. I had it on my Dragon Disciple. Hit giant >>> *POW, screenshake, takedown!*

It amused me far too much... bah, I've only maxed a few characters on this game ever, leave me be!

My suggestion is the same. Epic Prowess and EWS are more valuable than Dev Crit.

exquisitelyme wrote:

It doesnt. As soon as you use Animal Empathy succesfully, the Dominated animal is freed. And in case one is wondering I just tested it. You can have Companion, Summon, and ONE of Dominated OR Animal Empthy.

So one basic character could have potentially, 1 Familiar, 1 Companion, 1 Summoned, and 1 Dominated or Empathized, for a total of 4 summons plus themself for 5 total party members. Pretty spectacular really.

Yeah, in theory =) If you have a Familiar and an Animal Companion you must split your classes between Sorc/Wiz + Ranger/Druid, lessening the power of both. Your summons will not be top notch as well if you want to balance your Arcane + Divine levels.

That said if you dont much care for power, and want a large entourage, yes, it is LOTS of fun, feels like playing a PnP Summoner a bit.

For the best balance in quality and quantity, IMHO Druid is the way to go. 9th Circle summons, Elemental Swarm, Animal Companion and if you can spare the Skill Points ignore Dominate Animal and use Animal Empathy. Doesnt cost you a spell slot, lasts just as long, and its much cooler RP wise (not to mention withthe items available to increase AE you can invest 1 SP, and get a score around 40 in early levels, even with negative CHA).

The Ice Manticores make for particularly nice ranged support, even tho their DC is higher as with all magical beasts.

He could also have 3 spiders following him from the Job system. And a couple Deep Rothe, too. It was a working concept for one of my swarm-master, Evolutionist characters.

I'm trying to think up a Sorcerer/Master Scout build (for an Elf), and here's what I came up with:

24 sorc/5 MS/1 Bard.
To get 3 APR, I took 16 sorc/4 MS before epic.

Pre epic feats are the following: Extend spell, Maximize spell, Skill focus: Spot, Skill focus: Listen, Weapon focus, Improved critical, Blind-fight and Great fortitude on the MS level.
Epic feats (1 MS bonus, 1 sorc bonus): Mummy dust, Epic mage armour, Greater ruin, Great STR 1, Epic weapon focus and Armour skin.

Anything that needs adjusting?

Seems legit.

Trying to pick between Wolf and Dire Wolf for a druid who's taking 28 druid levels. What are the key differences between each, and what are they most suitable for?

Fairly sure the team doesnt want us discussing Animal Companion's stats in the forum.

They all have pretty damn good AB at that level, if you buff them up. The wolf has a howl to go alongside it, at least. I personally don't like the Dire wolf skin, so always the other wolf for me

That's alright. I'm not looking for direct stats, just advice like Rig provided.

And it's a choice directly between those two wolves. Is one more defensive or offensive than the other?

No idea bout the dire wolf, but the wolf is rather offensive minded from I can tell. Both will serve well and with reasonable support will tear through most things with ease.

Well, in that case... Dire Wolf has probably the best AI of all summons, coupled with the Boar, rarely gets stuck even when they chase casters (which causes most animal companions to get stuck in the complicated tilesets of Amia). Dire Wolf deals more damage, and IIRC a little less AC (all of them are pretty low at top levels tho). Wolf will always be one level higher than the summoner too, meaning your druid 28's wolf will be effectivelly lvl 29 (like the Panther).

If/When Mosh does critters..... They will be the same critter if I believe.

Alright, will stick to my Dire Wolf then. Thanks for the advice!

Do the skill bonuses from Cleric partywide prayers count towards the +50 cap?

maglorine wrote:

Do the skill bonuses from Cleric partywide prayers count towards the +50 cap?

yes

Looking at what a perfect mythral can add to items.

In game is SR 20 considered high?

SR 20 would help a toon level, but past lvl 10 or so, most things that cast nasty stuff at you will beat it.

Edit: Rigela hit the nail on the head. With a Keen Hammer.

Keen is generally the only thing a perfect mythal is good for from what I know.

Rigela wrote:

Keen is generally the only thing a perfect mythal is good for from what I know.

Seems about true as far as I can tell. 20 Spell Resistance has an effect on anything with a Caster Level lower than 20. I suspect almost all epic areas have mobs with higher caster levels than that.

Arguably it can be used by casters to compliment their bonus spell slots from items. I think the highest slots are 7'th [maybe 8'th for druids] so it's not like you're able to get double the casts/day of Wail, but that's always something.

The 5/+5 DR is also something worth considering if you're not a caster.

Righteous Anger wrote:

Rigela wrote:

Keen is generally the only thing a perfect mythal is good for from what I know.

Seems about true as far as I can tell. 20 Spell Resistance has an effect on anything with a Caster Level lower than 20. I suspect almost all epic areas have mobs with higher caster levels than that.

SR 25 from the cleric spell sometimes is bypassed by the casters in FoD =(

To penetrate SR, a caster rolls 1d20 + caster level + penetration feats. As such, a level 1 caster can still beat SR 20 with a lucky roll.

Ok... I think I'm finally ready to try a dwarf for a bit. That being said I'm looking to make a build that simply maximisez the use of the Dwarven defender class.

I Know Ill need 13 dex for the dodge feat.

Im not sure how to prioritize stats with this class. do I go STR or CON?

Also I suppose Fighter is a good base to move into dwarven defender, do I just take fighter till I can move into it or how should I do it?

Oh yeah, and any Dwarves play EST nights?

i was thinking of making a new dwarf aswell, 14 fighter 14 dwarven defender works nice and you have 2 levels left over, those two classes give enough feats to go the dev route by str or epic damage reduction by con.

10 ftr 10 DwD pre epic, 4, 4 in epic, plenty of feats, i tested myne on con based and it ended up 22 base con, 34 maxed through items/potion etc his HP was well over 700, 45ish ab with just the maxed strength and +4 weapon, 51 ac with +4 gear 55 in stance feat, 18 physical damage reduction.

when you add some buffs to that the end result is one awesome dwarf, however you choose to do it, either less fighter levels etc just make sure to keep your pre epic levels for the high attack progression classes.

Hrothmus wrote:

Ok... I think I'm finally ready to try a dwarf for a bit. That being said I'm looking to make a build that simply maximisez the use of the Dwarven defender class.

I Know Ill need 13 dex for the dodge feat.

Im not sure how to prioritize stats with this class. do I go STR or CON?

Also I suppose Fighter is a good base to move into dwarven defender, do I just take fighter till I can move into it or how should I do it?

Oh yeah, and any Dwarves play EST nights?

I personally like the idea of a Monk/Fighter/Dwarven Defender.

So I am finally trying to put together my verdant lord/forest master. Basically plant focused druid. Now my problem is since there aren't a lot of plant based spells (only 4 really) for offense I figured I would go melee druid. I am planning on using KC to represent a lot of the abilities and plant powers so it would be 25 druid/ 5 KC. I started putting it together and realized that it is really feat starved (seems like it anyway) and I am at a loss of how to maximize it to the best of my skills.

So the only requirements are SF: Discipline, Toughness, Transmutation(SF, GSF, ESF), Brew Potion, EMD.

So most are going to requirements, Epic Spell, and RP Feat. What 5 melee feats would best maximize my melee abilities. Might also only have 4 as my concept might benefit best from a +1 ECL class.

Thanks for thoughts.

If you're going with 30 levels, you might want to sneak in a fighter level to make it 24 Druid / 1 Fighter / 5 KC for an extra (epic) feat.

Kepaaalix wrote:

If you're going with 30 levels, you might want to sneak in a fighter level to make it 24 Druid / 1 Fighter / 5 KC for an extra (epic) feat.

This sounds good at first, and might still be (if you want that sort of thing). However, 25 Druid nets your animal companion +5 Enhancement Claws. That's more than a big deal, if you ask me.

I made this build, actually. I can send you a PM if you'd like with my interpretation of it.

How many ranks in UMD is "enough"? 10? 25? Feel free here to specify any definition of "enough" that you have a useful answer for.

I've been given various conflicting opinions on this question; I'd be super appreciative of a bit of discussion / elaboration.

There are differing schools of thought. Very few people would advocate more than 30. 25 is mostly sufficient, unless maybe you have a cha penalty. 20 is okay if you're strapped for points. Apparently some go for 10. I like 25 though.

You might need 30 in some cases, for some of the more obscure items (I know I did with one weapon anyway, not that I'd have considered really using it regardless) but 25 is generally enough for pretty much most things. Just need to make sure its a multiple of 5, whatever!

Righteous Anger wrote:

I personally like the idea of a Monk/Fighter/Dwarven Defender.

21/4/5 nets you all the good stuff, which counterbalances the lack of epic feats. I think Uce mentioned it all the way back on page 1 as well. This would definitely go along the lines of a strength build (or at least that's what I settled for).

Not putting into con hurts, but if you don't mind losing out on Devastating Critical and 1 AB/damage, feel free to get an easy chunk of con.

Righteous Anger wrote:

However, 25 Druid nets your animal companion +5 Enhancement Claws.

Which, unless I'm mistaken, you can get anyway with the Greater Magic Fang spell after level 14. The +2 bonus to the animal companion's AB is pretty good, but I would argue it's not worth an epic feat.

In lieu of what was said about Greater Magic Fang I decided to try the build with 1 fighter level. Take a look and see what you think.

Sun Elf
Str 16 -> 18
Dex 8
Con 8
Wis 15 -> 20
Int 14
Cha 14

Level Class Feats
1 Druid 1 Toughness
2 Druid 2
3 Druid 3 SF: Discipline
4 Druid 4
5 Druid 5
6 Druid 6 Extend
7 Druid 7
8 Druid 8
9 Druid 9 Brew Potion
10 Druid 10
11 Druid 11
12 Druid 12 SF: Tran
13 Druid 13
14 KC1
15 KC2 Wpn Focus: Morningstar
16 KC3
17 KC4
18 KC5 GSF: Tran
19 Druid 14
20 Druid 15
21 Druid 16 EMD
22 Druid 17
23 Druid 18
24 Druid 19 ESF: Tran
25 Druid 20
26 Druid 21
27 Druid 22 Improved Critical
28 Druid 23
29 Druid 24 Epic Wpn Focus
30 Fighter1 Epic Prowess, Armor Skin

Also quick question, is the spider companion a viable/good choice for occasional soloing or is it a bit too squishy?

Does anyone know if the sneak attack bonus you can get from items stacks with the sneak attack you get as rogue?

For example. If i got 5 lvls of rogue (3d6 sneak attack) and then equip gloves of cyric (+1d6 sneak attack) will that give me 4d6 sneak attack?

They do not. They do stack with Death Attack (and I believe they stack with Blackguard Sneak Attack), though.

I just want to double check this.

10 pm / 19 wiz gets:

Animate dead: Dread Wraith
Create undead: Greater Mummy
Create Greater Undead: Winterwight

?

Yes because it is the sum of your caster and pale master levels +# depending on which one you are casting.

Which is better war hammer or morningstar? Or stated in another way is the dual damage type worth the lack of x3?

treant13 wrote:

Yes because it is the sum of your caster and pale master levels +# depending on which one you are casting.

Which is better war hammer or morningstar? Or stated in another way is the dual damage type worth the lack of x3?

Warhammers are better by far. A x3 Critical weapon on a flat 20 roll will surpass a x2 weapon on a flat 20 roll no matter the damage type(s).

DerkDerkistan wrote:

They do not. They do stack with Death Attack (and I believe they stack with Blackguard Sneak Attack), though.

This is why a 13/16/1 rogue, blackgusrd, ranger is so damn deadly.
Ac/damage from dicine might and shield.
Saves from charisma
Cool spells
Rogue sneal + blackguard sneak
Epic dodge
Superior ac
Awesome demon/devil companion

Piss poor hp and no con.

build question from a new player...

for the build below, looking for a couple of general hints:

1. is this a reasonable build here on Amia, particularly for a new player unfamiliar with the world and gear?
2. I can also go elf instead of halfling, but would incur a multi-class penalty. I wasn't sure what the xp rate was like, so didn't know if that would really slow anything down. It would give me better KDs, use of Rapier, etc..
3. I jammed all the rogue levels in so I could get Epic Dodge at 27 instead of 30, but it leaves me 3 pts short on rogue skills in terms of max. Is that a big deal?
4. Not knowing the skills generally helpful here (e.g. is there plenty of healing, or is taking Heal for heal kits really required), I have ~ 2.5 full skills left to take. My thoughts without any input were full disable trap and discipline and half search. Also, I can forgo 2 Great Dex for ESFs or Epic save feats....
5. I've read through some of the forums and it seems to recommend a 42-45 AB for melee. Does that include the +4/ or +5 weapon and capped attack stat (is capping stats even viable here)? Just curious...

anywhere here's the rough sketch (I've played lvl40 versions of this on various servers)

NOTE - the +1 AB and AC for small stature are NOT included in the calc below.

Rogue(13), Fighter(10), Weapon Master(7), Halfling

STR: 10
DEX: 20 (30)
CON: 12
WIS: 8
INT: 14
CHA: 8

Halfling: (Fearless, Good Aim, Lucky, Skill Affinity: Listen, Skill Affinity: Move Silently, Small Stature)
01: Rogue(1): Expertise
02: Fighter(1): Weapon Finesse
03: Fighter(2): Dodge, Weapon Focus: Shortsword
04: Fighter(3): DEX+1, (DEX=21)
05: Fighter(4): Weapon Specialization: Shortsword
06: Fighter(5): Mobility
07: Fighter(6): Spring Attack
08: Rogue(2): DEX+1, {Evasion}, (DEX=22)
09: Fighter(7): Whirlwind Attack
10: Weapon Master(1): Weapon of Choice: Shortsword
11: Weapon Master(2)
12: Rogue(3): DEX+1, Knockdown, {Uncanny Dodge I}, (DEX=23)
13: Weapon Master(3)
14: Weapon Master(4)
15: Weapon Master(5): Blind Fight
16: Weapon Master(6): DEX+1, (DEX=24)
17: Weapon Master(7)
18: Rogue(4): Improved Critical: Shortsword
19: Rogue(5)
20: Rogue(6): DEX+1, (DEX=25)
21: Rogue(7): Great Dexterity I, (DEX=26)
22: Rogue(8)
23: Rogue(9)
24: Rogue(10): DEX+1, Great Dexterity II, Improved Evasion, (DEX=28)
25: Rogue(11)
26: Rogue(12)
27: Rogue(13): Epic Dodge, Defensive Roll
28: Fighter(8): DEX+1, Epic Weapon Focus: Shortsword, (DEX=29)
29: Fighter(9)
30: Fighter(10): Great Dexterity III, Epic Prowess, (DEX=30)

Hitpoints: 278
Skillpoints: 228
Saving Throws (Fortitude/Will/Reflex): 16/11/28
Saving Throw bonuses: Traps: +2, Fear: +2
BAB: 23
AB (max, naked): 39 (melee), 36 (ranged)
AC (naked/mundane armor/shield only): 27/29
Spell Casting:
Alignment Changes: 0

Hide 30(44), Intimidate 4(3), Move Silently 30(46), Open Lock 3(13), Spot 30(33), Tumble 30(40), UMD 26(25), remaining skillpoints 75

thanks in advance and looking forward to trying out the server!

Dante

It's a solid build, but I would drop my dexterity by 2 to get an Epic Skill Focus: Discipline and/or an Epic Fortitude, but that's just me. You're ending up with 14 base fortitude at the end, plus Lucky, your constitution and gear... It's manageable with sufficient mythal crafting, but I'm just a whore about defense and since you got plenty of AC, I'd sacrifice those 2 Dexterity to remedy two of your biggest weaknesses.

Just do what your roleplay dictates, I suppose. Skills are largely flavor, but I recommend Set Trap. Armor Skin is also a more worthy investment than Epic Prowess, in most cases.

thanks Sphynx, but due to the skills, I had to push the rogue level to 30 or I would have had a bunch of FTR pts and long periods of really low discipline.

In terms of feats, I have 3 slots for ESF: Discipline, Epic Fortitude, Armor Skin, and EWS. I'm inclined to leave EWS off, though I hate to leave off the extra 12 pts on crits...

Don't lose EWS. You're a dexer, you need it more than anything else. And yeah, I'm an advocate of taking your final rogue level at 30, too.

Sphinx wrote:

Don't lose EWS. You're a dexer, you need it more than anything else. And yeah, I'm an advocate of taking your final rogue level at 30, too.

,

Ok,then ESF: Discipline seems like the choice.

thanks..

Hello.

I'm looking to create either a human 5 bard 25 rogue or a human 5 rogue 25 bard.
Are either of these combinations viable, and if not why?

Thanks for any replies.

The Official Teach a Man to Fish topic (Build topic):

Who is online