*brofist*

Yeah, if evil wants to stand up, pick the fights you can win. And then let's see where we go from there.

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Yes plz. Moar plz. Like I said, evil needs to unify and realize they won't be able to outright curb stomp the guys who've established themselves for years over night. Even chaotic evil can plan.

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Gerald Edmund
Discord: Metal Viking Guy #5433

DC taxation is theft!

That's kind of a problem, everyone keeps saying the same thing that evil needs to be smarter but then most evil players are restricted to a few roles. You think every evil character out there wants to just spy on good or just be smart about avoiding them? Do you have any idea just how boring that can get and discouraging that you'll NEVER have a chance against them. Evil and Good should be on equal fighting grounds. Yes it has been up to the players to keep the whole good vs evil thing in check, but as the years have gone on and evil is put on the back burner while good factions continue to grow in power. You have to come to the conclusion that this doesn't work. The only place where evil is safe from paladins is the underdark and you shouldn't have to play a drow to be evil, you're still technically hiding in a cave. Even Tarkuul isn't really that great a place for evil to congregate because of the Voice that see's all and knows all that happens in it's borders. With the exception of the waves of undead it's more like Lawful Neutral, break any law you get in trouble and possibly banned, point being there's no way to NOT get caught because let's face it, evil is always up to no good. Even a properly RPed drunken brawl could end with you banished.

On the PVP note for good, those of you that don't get classes that well Paladins are by far the most overpowered class in the game. Saves, High BAB, Spells, and lets not forget Smite Evil. Before you say it Blackguard doesn't hold a candle to a Paladin. If we're going to discuss good versus evil you should consider all the variables. A lot of people like to play strong builds first and RP second, nothing is stronger than a Paladin. If you make a Paladin you already have a faction of Paladins you can team up with, RP with. You make a Blackguard not only do you have a weaker character but you don't automatically have a group of like minded players to team up with and RP with, in fact you're like ever other evil character trying to hide in plain sight.

I personally prefer the evil from the shadows despite my argument, but you have to realize that it's not for everyone. Not everyone wants to play the "spy", whether you realize it or not by even "spying" on good factions by having a character infiltrate them you are still providing entertainment for them. The more active members there are in a faction the more appealing it is to others in the faction, whether they know you're evil or not. There are a lot more OOC feelings surrounding this issue than IC, ICly many evildoers will try to fight the good fight or just move back to the mainland where everything makes more sense for evil. But OOCly it is incredibly discouraging to just lose time and again and we end up losing evil players so they can play with the other good PCs. I couldn't tell you how many people I liked played evil for a while and eventually turned to good because it was just so much simpler and easier and far less discouraging.

This server would need some major earth shattering event to set things right again, some devastating natural or man made disaster to cripple the numerous good cities and villages on the server. Earthquake, Hurricane, Hordes of Demons, SOMETHING to reset what has gone wrong over the years of letting players keep evil in check.

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~Draco Bloodcloak~ In the mind of a tielfing
~Xanhorn Dragonsbane~

+1

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Main Characters: Rosalind Karpovsky

For what it is worth I have found the DMs to be incredibly helpful in terms of doing Evil Stuff. That goes for both the UD and Surface.

I dunno if anyone has said anything to the contrary (I haven't read most of the thread), I just wanted to PSA my experience.

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Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming

I disagree that years of work should be undone by DM's through natural disasters.

Evil is kept in check by player actions not DM actions so I think evils rise should be through player actions as well. And that takes time and patience.

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Characters played:

Harold Kendry (Illusionist) -> see avatar
Elloanore (Travelling bard)

Not undone, all the progress that's been made happened, you got to RP it all out see your plans build up. But all good things must come to an end, as with life there are always set backs, sometimes those set backs can be crippling. I refuse to believe that you guys are content with just idle banter RP all day. Everyone needs something to strive for, whether it be rebuilding your city or retaking it. I'm talking about conflict, something this server desperately needs and it's not going to happen until evil gets some kind of foothold.



That is the exact line of thought that has kept us in this rut, it has become obvious that the system simply doesn't work. We can continue to cross our fingers and hope that the evil players will get their act together and make a real difference on this server but that's just wishful thinking. How many years have passed and that argument has been used yet things have only gotten worse.

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~Draco Bloodcloak~ In the mind of a tielfing
~Xanhorn Dragonsbane~

This discussion needs its own topic. There is a lot to be said about it and I think if we're going to do so properly we should so so there. The point has been made as its relevance to the topic dictates but it's clear the community has a lot to say on the subject, and I want to hear and converse on all of it. I have a couple of ideas on the topic I'd like to push as well, so I think I'll be making this thread personally.

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Gerald Edmund
Discord: Metal Viking Guy #5433

DC taxation is theft!

I am not sure what the system is but Amia is a rp server and not a pvp server where constant open conflict is manditory.

I think there has been a lot of conflict lately on the server with the happenings in Cordor with a lot of potential for more conflict and from what I see heaps of player involvement on several sides. Some of it obvious and some of it not so obvious. There was a great chance for LE types to join the Cordor guard for one as far as I can see.
It should still be quite doable to use the focus on Cordor now to dig in. I have a hunch some people are actively doing that.

I still maintain that evil shouldnt wait for a DM handout to establish itsself. I also think there is more to conflict then the rather old good-evil.
Thats why I like Bane's dogma, he's evil, yes but he is also very lawfull. That gives a whole new dimension to his worship (anti chaos anyone?)

Cordor for one might be receptive to some non Kohlingen anti chaos right now.

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Characters played:

Harold Kendry (Illusionist) -> see avatar
Elloanore (Travelling bard)

It could be because it's -critical- to the server's identity, where we are now, and where a lot of us would like it to go.

Is it ACelesti-mia? Or Amia? Is it boring or interesting? Does it bore the audience? Or leave them hanging on to the edge of their seats?

Conflict is mandatory in all games, but when I say conflict, pvp is a small part of the greater whole. Even if you're sitting there rolling dice, you're doing so representing the conflict.

Evil on the server in the past has tried to establish itself, even though always in smaller numbers, and then they are smashed by the overwhelming goodly hoard and we return to stagnation and dwindling player counts.

The conflict in Cordor in my view, has brought this up recently, and I applaud it.

The question is, should the only conflict in existence, be that the DM's generate? Or should players have an environment where they can generate it themselves? If so, what server environment better facilitates that?

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When good wins the day, and evil is destroyed, then the movie is over ...and you do something else.

Let's make it, not over.

TLDR

Exclusively
1/3 is Social RP
1/3 is PvP
1/3 is PvM

Identity depends on who/when you're watching.

Would like to see more traditional Forgotten Realms/D&D "good vs evil" conflict/drama. Not PvP or 'who's a lesbian now' drama, but 'so and so is attempting to take over the world again'.

My exact feelings on the questions of identity.

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Just lurking about!

Yes! More server wide conflicts!

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Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl
NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/
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I'm not sure I can agree that we need more big, server-wide conflicts, really. In the last seven years that I've been playing I've found that Amia is constantly attacked by powers that could "destroy the world" or at least take it over entirely should PC efforts fail. A question about server identity? This is the crazy place in the middle of nowhere where Chosen and gods and unbelievably powerful beings come to hang out or try their hand at starting world domination. It's tiring, to be honest. Older characters should not be to the point that they comment, "Oh, another Chosen come to send the world into darkness, starting here in the misfit capitol of the world? Meh."

I don't want to see even more catastrophic, unbelievable powers out to kill everyone and everything. I want to see more little stuff. Believable stuff that doesn't require the entire server to get together for massive events that only result in people feeling like they couldn't contribute as much as they wanted to because it's so frickin' huge that a DM can't give everyone the attention. We frankly don't have the DM activity (from enough DMs) to pull off huge plots that should only happen with multiple DMs so that there aren't so many people who end up being partially and unintentionally left behind.

We've had so many huge plots, so many big things that require a lot of time and effort and coordination and planning and delaying and drawing out and starting over from scratch when the DM gets too busy and another has to take over and people losing interest and then hurt feelings over the same characters stepping up to get things done so the world doesn't explode...

Let's try to do some little things. Let's make the server and its settlements actually feel like thriving communities and not handfuls of NPCs to be called upon when necessary but ignored otherwise. I'd love the server identity to shift from "Crazy shit happens here and all the big names and powers in Forgotten Realms just let it happen because they don't care anymore about the things they're supposed to protect and we all hate NPC powerhouse Deus Ex Machinas." to something more along the lines of "This island and its attached regions are filled with communities that interact and grow together, sometimes at odds with one another and sometimes as the staunchest of allies."

Stay away from Chosen and gods. Those are big deals that would logically draw the eye of FR lore-rich outside powers that never get involved and leave characters that do know their lore and history to logically wonder, "What the hell, Mystra?! Why don't you care if you're going to lose your Weave?!" or something like that.

And to me, that is more immersion-breaking than anything. I want to see little things. Numerous little plots and ongoing things from numerous DMs in numerous regions. Not one big god-Chosen-Orgy of Dhoom.

Additional Note to the DMs: Please don't take this as a criticism to any single plot that any of you have done. It's meant to envelop all the plots as a whole that have dealt with world-ending situations. And it's just my opinion, of course. I just want more...lasting story. Stuff that really has an impact on places but doesn't necessarily mean that established lore and FR characters/creatures (that we obviously don't want steamrolling PCs) suddenly quit their day jobs of protecting the very things that are threatened, as if they've lost their ability to notice. I do like political intrigue. I like seeing people interact with regular people, NPCs that aren't special. I like seeing real families and their reactions to the characters who have worked to establish themselves - and even to those who haven't! I would absolutely love regional/city plots that allow the players to interact more with the NPCs around them. ...Or even those that require them to interact with the regular NPCs.

Keep track of player involvement. I'm not sure how you have things set up behind the curtain so I'm sorry if you already have something like this. Keep regional/city/group/etc. threads or subforums so that you can explain and continuously develop the NPCs of a given place, as well as keep record of PC involvement with those NPCs, so that the NPCs themselves can grow and evolve with each meaningful and lasting contribution. The worst feeling a player has (in my opinion) is when their effort is forgotten or unrecorded and lost to the wind between DMs. And I don't want anyone to think I'm laying blame on them for any specific instance of this, but it's something that I should point out as I've felt it myself with some of Zelly's efforts with both very important NPCs and just regular NPCs.

Anyway, I hope this is coherent enough. I'm a little tired!

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But couldn't it be said that the only reason you hold those opinions is because you've been so heavily involved in these plots in the past, Jes? As a server, other players might want or enjoy this sort of thing.

Edit: What I mean is, new players or simply people who haven't been so involved in the past might want to see this sort of thing so that they can be.

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Just lurking about!

The question was about the server's identity and specifically asks for our opinions. >.> Even older players can offer their opinions, right?

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I havent been involved in the massive plots either. I, too, want to see them! And i have been here since ...2005

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Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl
NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/
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I do think there's a good point in making it so that not all threats are universal to the entire world. They should probably be more contained to effect only areas and peoples represented within the servers.

At the same time I'd be pretty annoyed if it was to ever be expected of me to play as something on the scale of the slightly grumpy town cobbler just because other people have gotten tired of slaying all those demons and mad wizards that I've never even seen (or heard of). I play video games to escape the daily grind, not to emulate it in a world without indoor plumbing.

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Player of:
Asya Goodmonsdottir - Knight of Lesser Gods.
-Winner of 2014's "Razored Tongue" Award, and Emcee's pick "Authoritarian of the year".
Jannah Vindle - Mistress of Coin.

As far as I've noticed most of the major events required a lot of magical, divine, uberpaladinsmite, chronomacy, cantomacy intervention. Apparently not all of the the characters happen to have those abilities to posses even minor powers, thus some of them - mostly the unexperienced players - have hard time to keep themselves in the front line of involvement, even if their character was the one who actually involved the listed superübernaturalpowerfull folks.

I would rather suggest less amount of magical solutions and more sweat and hard work type of solutions in the events. In this can you can give a little relief to p.e. Ulrik (since he is the favorite example nowadays ), thus there is a better chance to distribute the tasks in the case of a major event.

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Lord Hector Sylgerand
Glendil Fettian, the black bard

Events like these are horrible beceause they often loose momentum and then nothing happens. Remember guldorand? How long hasnt it taken to rebuild it ... And its not even rebuilt!

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Amia Minecraft Server Ip: vps1602.directvps.nl
NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/
NWN Build Calculator: http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=Other.Detail&id=856

That may also have something to do with the person in charge (twice: Artum and Herial) leaving the server, and Zelly withdrawing because Kohlingen + cordor so she had to

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Aly'dra Zau'ana: Priestessish Of Eilistraee
Danika Nefzen: Druid of the Earthmother
Delia Am'Anodel: Paladin of Torm

Also required a lot of dev work....

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Lord Hector Sylgerand
Glendil Fettian, the black bard

I've never really been much involved in the big stuff, but I'd rather focus on the smaller things. Regional things. Settlement things. The big, grand, end of the world stuff works for individual campaigns as you have one group up against whatever. On a server, it's not really like that. Not saying we should do away with the bigger stuff entirely, but I agree with most of what Jes says up there, even though I'm on the other end and haven't been involved with much of the bigger stuff.

I'm not really drawn to stuff like that. I prefer the smaller, more personal stuff. By which I don't mean the gossip relationship melodrama, but the city- or faction-centered things. Strange serial killer in Cordor. Talonan apple diseases in Bendir orchards. Some religion having to decide whether to incorporate a sect or cast it out in heresy. Not everything has to be big, sweeping plots to be interesting.

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Also, I did not mean about plotlines such as the Cordor plot but the fact that basically you can find everything with a random discern location or other type of divination spell then you realize that the storyline will suddenly become strange and also...there is the fact that we are used to that sort of solution. I kinda did that with Yaston every time (poor Ulrik and Tuomas).

What I am trying to say and this might be a not DnD example but at some point still fantasy or legendary:

When Arthur sent his knights out to find the Holy Grail then Merlin definitely did not cast a dicern location on the grail, but the knights had pretty hard time to find it. They had to go from A to B then from B to D because they were only able to get to C through D just to make the scenario harder.

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Lord Hector Sylgerand
Glendil Fettian, the black bard

Do you people actually do this everytime? Cast Legend lore, discern location and scry for stuff? Thats downright cheating

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NWN Damage Calculator: http://www.afterlifeguild.org/Thott/dnd/
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Not to mention the accidental "Deus Ex Machina"-s in the story..

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Lord Hector Sylgerand
Glendil Fettian, the black bard

Hardly. If it's available, use it.

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Aoth Nathandem - Wizard of house Tholaunt and chosen of Ma'at.

I'm not against the occasional big plot that encompasses the entire server. I'm only against there being three or four of them at the same time, or several major plots in a row being Chosen- or god-driven or something. It's good to mix things up with a big one every now and then. Just not all the time or exclusively. I long for little things to break up the monotony of hearing another disaster story. The little things don't have to involve just a "slightly grumpy town cobbler". They can be interesting, too.

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I haven't really been involved in many of them and it doesn't change the fact that Jes made some very valid points.

Amia is sadly a clusterfuck of uber bad ass evils that get trumped on a semi-annual basis. That doesn't happen anywhere else on Toril and it's boring after a while.



Using magic in a high magic world is cheating? >_>

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Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming

Slightly grumpy town cobbler who has attracted a fey who starts imbuing the shoes the cobbler repairs with Tasha's Irresistible Dance that triggers every day at noon.

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...I'm off to make a cobbler.

Edit: Admittedly THAT sounds good, but I stand by my original point of preferring to not be forced to play mundane life.

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Player of:
Asya Goodmonsdottir - Knight of Lesser Gods.
-Winner of 2014's "Razored Tongue" Award, and Emcee's pick "Authoritarian of the year".
Jannah Vindle - Mistress of Coin.

Faerun is a Moderate to High Magic world. Amia is set in Faerun. When you have people capable of achieving the ability of magic that allows for those magics, they are liable to be used by Wizards, Bards, Sorcerors, and the Clerics that have access to the particular spells.

Maybe not nescessarily for every little lost item or person, but if there's reason to believe that there is some measure of trouble going down? You bet your life that they're gonna use those spells at their disposal.

Legend Lore's not always going to be reliable: It has a caveat to it that limits it from being used on everything and anything.

Finally got some time to write, sooooo...


LORE - server really needs many things fleshed out. History of the places needs to be firmly set up, and current important figures for every location need to have their personalities and aims sorted out by DM team. While I played Malatril and tried to do some stuff in Wharftown, Mayor had serious mood swings whenever another DM took control of him - he sometimes had also serious memory losses ("who the heck are you?") and completely changed his opinions every couple of days. It was goddamn frustrating, to say the least.

EVENT IMPACT - many events wrought havoc though Amia, yet their impacts are barely felt. This really needs to have greater influence. If Guldorand was razed, why can you still buy lumber at merchants - or at least why prices haven't skyrocketed? I honestly expected some PC lumberjacks to try to profit from the situation, but I guess job system really flopped. Or why hasn't rust curse in Cordor increase price of anything related to metalwork, allowing miners/refiners gain some influence by offering their wares in time of need etc.

EVENT MAGNITUDE - less massive events would be definitely welcome. This doesn't mean big events shouldn't happen, just should be fairly rare. Most of them turn into mobs rushing like headless chicken while some already established figure of authority desperately tries to keep situation under control. It's also hard to have any serious character development if you are just another "brick in the wall" of army of steamrolling epic adventurers. It also forces DM to create ridiculously powerful monsters just to give an impression of "tough fight". And when such monster encounters smaller team of adventurers you just have reverse situation - they simply get steamrolled in return. So much about personal heroics.
And yes, less Chosen walking around like they are in Saturday Night Live World Destruction.

GOOD VS. EVIL - I am personally uninterested in this type of conflict, especially PC generated. So far I've witnessed two large events that ended with as total clusterfu*ks, leaving many folks in sour mood and many leaving the server. It's good in moderation but any type of large scale conflict like this won't work, and definitely shouldn't be overarching theme of the server. There's many other possible conflict types who are completely left on the margins, which should be explored or sparked again.

IDENTITY - back to adventuring. Really. I'm tired of epic plots of doom, political power plays and good vs. evil arguments. I want to go back to times where small group of folks set out into unknown and had ADVENTURE. I loved when a DM made regular Snowbeast run turn into fight for the life as we got beset by Enraged Snowbeast and buffed up ice wraiths. Generally, small events where usual grind gets spiced up by DM intervention is far more refreshing than server wide plot. Every situation where small group of folks has to deal with some local emergency, without additional two dozen fully spelled up adventurers rushing in, is a refreshing change of pace. Server shouts are only fine if there's logical reason rest of the server would know something's going on (like omnious storm over Amia forest, or magical conflagration over Tarkuul etc.).

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"A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away." - Antoine de Saint-Exupry

You should get a DM and do The Ring Thing. No, wait... you'd all end up in stitches about halfway through, that just won't do.

Back to adventuring..
thats what the core of the entire D&D is about, I found the whole "Game of Thrones" epic element, boring and long drawn when tried to be applied into the nwn amian context. When players have limited time they just wanna go and kill an orc boss thats been raiding caravans within a span of two hours and thats it. Make it interesting, fun, exciting and scary. After that next adventure please.


After going through the whole thread, Remals post is what really struck a cord about "sticking to the basics" which makes D&D great as a game and not running far from that.

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Currently starring:
Vinasis D'Magi- Calishite Merchant
Pantheros Sylvanight- Lycanlord of Malar
Artorious Godstrike- Paladin of Torm

I must say that I find the above statement absoutely invalid.

From the very basics of online role playing games, those who participate in playing online games seek an interaction with other players. For mindless PvE there are single player games (like my favourite brainwash Diablo), or things like Warhammer online and WoW. Do not take me wrong, I was playing both Warhammer AND Diablo and enjoyed both, but only until I have found that I am doing the same thing whole over and over again, which made me finally stop.

Not to mention that it is close to impossible to keep the gaming world up and running on PvE - sooner or later, but morelike sooner you will run out of areas and suprises, you know the world upside down and then it is over. And if you want ever-chaning world, then you'd have to hire a bunch of DM's, pay them for a full time job for running ever-chaning dungeons and melee quests (understand as bash'n'loot quests), which is also impossible.

You do not have to be a part of epic plots. If you are bored with politics and major conflicts, do not participate. Go out, kill mobs, loot mobs and have your way of fun with it. When the DM feels naughty and have time, they will surely spice it up with some adjusted mobs - but from an experience I know it soon, very soon turns as dull as it sounds fun now.

I am sorry if that sounds rought, but I would hate to see the server focus on PvE when there are other areas far more desperate for an attention. I am not elaborating as many have pointed what I agree with in previous posts.

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Daegan Van'Straaten - Duty to Helm is above all!

To be fair, since Vinasius does not have the ability to speak for all players and since this thread was Glim asking for individual opinions, what I am sure he meant is that killing orc bosses is what he likes to do. Does not make the statement absolutely invalid, just only valid for Vinasius or anyone who expresses agreement.

Very well, I apologize for using the word "invalid". I will re-state it as an opinion I disagree with.

I will only say that what I gathered from all the time I am playing on Amia is that some players lacks patience - they want immediate action with immediate results. That is why some are bored with long term and major plots, political stuff and so on. But I think that these are exactly the elements that makes the world appealing, as through politics and major plots player can change the server. And that is what I find the most inspirational. But it takes time.

I find inspirational the progression of my character - not build wise, equipment wise or level wise. But RP wise - building up the reputation, connections with other chraracters, participation in events that are changing the history and future of the World. But yet again - it takes time.

This world is set into a setting where every farmer or an orphan or war veteran can become an epic character in a matter of days and single handedly killing dragons and elder orbs. Which sure is fun, but for how long? Days? Weeks? Then you get bored as your guy is bigger than Jesus (see what I did there?) and create another toon, repeat the previous and it goes on and on until you get up and say "Hey, do something with the server, it's boring here!". It may be a little extreme, but hopefully you understand what I am trying to say.

If I was to really dig for an idea to make the server more interesting, it would be :

I would definately high point the idea of one character per player. For many reasons listed above.
I would definately high point the idea of more seriours death penalties, including possible equipment loss and attribute penalties, for obvious reasons.
And maybe, maybe I would give players a little more freedom, so I would not have to read many times per day things like "We have to wait for a DM confirmation/clarification." I realize it may be dangerous and open for an abuse, therefore I have used the word "Maybe".

Amia is a good world, I dare to say the best world that is currently to play. Not ideal, naturally, but you will never create a world where everyone is happy.

And once again to Vinasius, I apologize for the unappropriate interprentation of my opinion in my original post.

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Daegan Van'Straaten - Duty to Helm is above all!

As long as emaciated spooky white girl doesn't climb up from nearest well, I'm game! Wait...

Anyhow, I really love those "single" independent events that bring out adventuring side in me. I absolutely loved that standalone "magical cave" event in Khem some time ago. Or chasing flaming bats all over War Knight keep (no, it was not a weapon test!). I just prefer smaller events, I guess, or local stuff that doesn't involve at least half the server all the time.

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"A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away." - Antoine de Saint-Exupry

I find one-off adventures to be boring and trite. That's not a campaign, that's a...level. They also very rarely do anything to change the world or make PCs feel like they have a grander impact. They have a place promoting character development and interpersonal relations (I don't think the Tarkuul crew will every forget the Demigod in the abyss) but I don't think they should be the focus. I like my long-reaching story arcs, but I kinda don't trust the DMs to ever wrap them up. They get ADD. What happened to the lich ship? The obyrinths? The nightmare court? Anubis took far too long as we all know, only just now is Cordor getting attention. I don't know how the staff operates behind the curtain, but it feels haphazard. There needs to be event outlines before they are done, an estimated timeline for their duration, details as it progresses, and then some sort of consequence if the DM doesn't advance the plot consistently or gets bored and forgets it. Maybe these things are already being done, but it doesn't -feel- like it from the player's chair. It always feels improvised and the DMs are just casually winging it. This is meant as a critique, not a complaint, because I think a more unified, professional staff that's been trained to operate consistently will go a long way towards server identity. Or even just working on the presentation of those facets if the measures are already in place.

This is where my Khem plot fell down by the way. It was supposed to be a low key plot to remove an absolutely stupid area that everyone on the DM team at the time agreed needed to go, played irregularly at best, and I blew it up against the story arc that I'd written out in advance due to wanting to involve to many players in to many timezones and just getting irritated every day the plot went on, I ended up hating what was initially a clever story and in the end that, in hindsight, led me to quitting as a DM and a player. If I had my time over I would not have gone that way and the plot would have wound up a month or two after it started. The impact wouldn't have even been realms worthy, and the actual subtext of the plot would have barely rated a mention in Amia Canon. The whole idea of that plot was to give me insights into characters for more personalized quests based in Khem with a thematic tying those characters together for some of those irregular earth shattering deals Jes mentioned. Poor Judgement on my part, sorry.

Conversely Bilgar of Selune whom not a single one of you has probably heard of was a complete success, I ran him for nearly a year, using a modified Amia centric variant of the original Anubic plot, and barely a single DM even knew about him. Why? Because Bilgar didn't want well known Heroes, because well known Heroes draw attention.

I will say though that the best laid plans don't survive contact with the player-base, I know innumerable DM plots that got flogged because people had to involve their friends, and their friends of friends, and the friends of those friends of those friends and the plot becomes to big and to unwieldy. At the end of the day DM's can only react to the decisions the player base makes otherwise it looks like DM's are leading the players by the nose.

For me Amia right now is me going back and creating a character where my strengths are, which is with the Mulhorandi, I don't care if there isn't a DM around or another player to play with. I play with myself.

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I play: Gage le Gris
Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor

I am also a native English speaker, and should know better than this!

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I play: Gage le Gris
Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor

I think Jes made some excellent points in her post. I have a couple of general points to make and some specific suggestions. Please ignore the specifics if you don't like them - they're not really that important.

What will pull new people in, and keep people here, is community (in fact, didn't we refer to ourselves at one point as 'an online roleplaying community' or some such?). And so perhaps the communities on Amia should be the primary focus - make the 'RP hubs' richer and encourage people to get involved in them in small ways. While there will always be people who have been here for a long time and 'worked up through the ranks' to end up in positions of power (I guess I'm one of those myself, now...) and those people will continue to play their roles (if only because they've worked at it and continue to put in the effort), one shouldn't need to have their attention in order to interact with the world.

I agree with her points about earthshattering events as well, and this ties in with DM shouts where everyone flocks to the area in question hoping for DCs. There should certainly be occasional events of large-scale significance, but I'm wondering if it's better to shift emphasis down to the ground level, so to speak. More DMs as shop-keepers, citizens - even monsters. Especially monsters. Make players interact with the the world on a one-to-one or one-to-a-few basis. Let them feel that they know the people around town, that they're part of it. (From a practical point of view this probably requires more detailed info for the DMs on various PCs. I'd also suggest notice boards in cities that contain snippets of info culled from the forums and that are updated from time to time - like every few days or a week at least. More lore info in-game as well.) Perhaps more player-run shops/markets? Let the common people feel involved. Let them have a life. And I know it's generally anathema, but some small DC awards for time on the server might help people deal with the feeling that they're excluded from DCs - why would you play if you can't have the pretty toys everyone else seems to have?

I played briefly on Ravenloft and the sense of fear about going out at night was palpable. The fear of the unknown. The fear of death. Granted, once you've been on a server for ages, that tends to go away, and then we make low-level alts to try to experience that oh-so-delicious feeling again. Is there a way to recapture that in areas outside the cities? Make night and the unknown something to be afraid of? Again, this would strengthen 'community' as people band together rather than go galivanting about the server. More DM possession of monsters might help - toss the players a curveball every now and then and see if they aren't a little more careful when they venture out. Oh, and don't necessarily tell them you're there, DMs. Just do something slightly different than the AI would. You don't need the chief minotaur to suddenly spawn a horde of wraiths - maybe something as simple as having a relief force come up from behind the players and pin them.

With fewer mega-events, there should be fewer Good-vs-Evil smite-athon PvP lagfests. Slow, incremental evil is good - er, evil. Gaining control here or there. Blackmail. Bribery. Stuff like that. Ideally it would almost never break out into open warfare - the battles should be fought behind the scenes. There were certainly hints of this in the Arcanum plot but perhaps there should have been more PC involvement on the evil side (but Yoss, I still always loved your plots!). This might address the issue of 'months of work down the drain'.

If you've read any of the Sanctuary novels (ed. Asprin) - a shared fantasy world - there are cameo appearances by deities and powerful characters, but most of the emphasis is on regular people, more or less (the series got more ridiculous as it went on, but the first few books are good overall). Perhaps Amia should look more like that.

Limiting players to a few characters might also foster a sense of community, though I'm not really sure how to implement something like that. Maybe three PCs at a time, and to create a new one you have to ditch one? Then you can have a main, an alt and an experimental PC. I've also always been in favour of harsher death penalties.

Blah blah blah...

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~Sharess on AmiaWiki~
Priestess, politician, prostitute
"[They] were moving in on me like Sharessans on a new broad in the bath house" - Tracer Bolt
AmiaWiki mod (mostly inactive)

There's some good stuff in here folks, and if you haven't already provided your own perspective on the matter of Server Identity I definitely invite you to do so. In a few days (probably will wait till my days off) I'm going to start compiling some of the commonalities between different posts and see what things seem to be the most important to the most people, so that we can start giving them some serious consideration and work.

They do this on Ravenloft, and I actually really like it. It forces you all into one area, and you HAVE to RP. You HAVE to RP if you ever want to get anywhere at night.

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Aly'dra Zau'ana: Priestessish Of Eilistraee
Danika Nefzen: Druid of the Earthmother
Delia Am'Anodel: Paladin of Torm

I'm kind of tentative about this thread, the more I read it. It seems like the two main suggestions are 1.) server-wide plots should be more frequent, more responsive, or more inclusive, and 2.) server-wide plots should be less frequent or less far-reaching. That seems like a kind of irreconcilable gap.

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Winner of Amia's "Most Ethical Time Traveler" award 2026

Character Portraits!

And therein lies one point I had had my finger on for years, Liz. I want differences of opinion like that to not be irreconcilable. As a community we must be able to compromise to an extent, to forgive, to understand that we want different things and we can have our cake so long as we eat a little bit of someone else's, too.

Do you think that's especially likely though, Yoss? I mean... Amia is fairly sanguine, as online communities go, but this still is the internet. It's kind of one of the primal online truths that it's hard to think of people as people, when all they are to you is a cutesy pseudonym and a 100x100 jpeg. (Totally incidental... this is why I use my real name as my forum name: I hope it humanizes me.)

I don't like to think of myself as a cynic, but my main character is a diviner and a politician who tries to participate in the important issues of the world. So far in this thread, I've been told that diviners, politics, and server plots are all Big Bad. It's a little disheartening.

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Winner of Amia's "Most Ethical Time Traveler" award 2026

Character Portraits!

Liz's right, I am getting the same feeling. Although it feels more as disturbing than disheartening. But quite possibly both.

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Daegan Van'Straaten - Duty to Helm is above all!

*Cough, cough.*

But, to comment on this in brief. I think it is a matter of scope. I tend to err against world-ending plots, yet acknowledge I have been fortunate to have played a role in a few. I think we can look at the spectrum as more than, 'Dark Lord McEvilBaronChildeater Chosen of Lovabaneshar eats the souls of all Amia' and 'Disgruntled cobbler stubs his toe.' Small things are wonderful. I love small interactions with NPCs. They make my day.

But we can have events where something is at stake, to cater to those still trying to make a mark on the setting. That does not require the cursed and lamented all-stars rise into action. For if there is a world-ending event, they will be involved. It would be out-of-character for them not to be. And with their experience/clout/reputation, who will end up leading the charge? Those damned all-stars.

But a more recent example is a good one, and I will use that damnable Ulrik that keeps getting used in this thread as an example. The she-kats. Ulrik read reports. Sat in meetings (we all love those). Was well-briefed on the situation. It was an important matter, with serious repercussions to the isle. Yet it was still regional to the north of Amia. He let it in the hands of others, and only showed up at the last event - as support. He was actually stuck doing rear-guard duty away from all the action with two other all-star characters (Zelly and Sir Bob.) They commented on this rather amusedly in character. 'We were generals in the last war...'

At the end of the day, the matter was resolved and no all-stars were anywhere near the limelight. Much to their, and everyone elses', relief.

That is the sweet-spot, I think. Medium-scoped events. Food for thought, that I will take for myself as a DM.

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Playing:
Marcus Valis