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Have Kitsunes actually been intoduced to the FR settings?

This is what i found when i googled Kitsune :shock:

I don't think so.

Yeah I know what Kitsunes are

But I don't know if they were every introduced to FR.

The best place to look would be any source containing Wa and Kozakura - which is most likely Oriental Adventures. They're each based off Japan, just different eras. Wa revolves around the history and lore of Tokugawa Shogunate Era of Japan, while Kozakura honestly strikes me as the Sengoku Era.

If you go searching around on the internet, beware of the homebrew Kitsune stuff. There's quite a lot.

The only thing I could personally find was a race listed in Oriental Adventures named Hengeyokai. For your case, a fox Hengeyokai would work well.

Kitsune have been introduced to the world of Golarion in the game system Pathfinder by Paizo. While not officially part of Forgotten Realms, several groups of people like to associate Golarion as a continent far east of Faerun, basically on the other side of the globe. This, of course, is unofficial.

Kitsune names hint towards an oriental place of origin in Pathfinder, but they're said to roam far and wide because they want to be known for great deeds.

Kitsune-info, Pathfinder still;
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/races/other-rac ... rg-kitsune
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/adva ... tsune.html

And just because I strongly disagree Svensk's picture, with many tails and wolf-like features, here is a picture of a Kitsune used in PF rulebook;

They haven't been introduced in any of the books I've read. Pathfinder is pathfinder and has few lore ties with FR.

Honestly, anthropomorphic animals have no place in FR, or just about any setting.

Gets into Magical Realm territory real fast for many who play them too.

Silvarus wrote:

Honestly, anthropomorphic animals have no place in FR, or just about any setting.

Lizardfolk? Gnoll? Kenku? Kuo-toa? Rakshasa? All over the line?

Liz wrote:

Silvarus wrote:

Honestly, anthropomorphic animals have no place in FR, or just about any setting.

Lizardfolk? Gnoll? Kenku? Kuo-toa? Rakshasa? All over the line?

Not the same kind of anthropomorphism as these kinds of foxmen or the pandaren of WoW and the like. All of the ones you mentioned were proper monsters, not inserts of fursonas.

Don't forget lycanthropes!

I have similar dislikes but for different reasons (and covering different things) mostly because of my heritage. In fact, the spelling of this thread title agitates me.

Also, kenku shouldn't be birdmen, they should be long-nosed mountain demons! RRRRRRRGH.

Silvarus wrote:

Liz wrote:

Silvarus wrote:

Honestly, anthropomorphic animals have no place in FR, or just about any setting.

Lizardfolk? Gnoll? Kenku? Kuo-toa? Rakshasa? All over the line?

Not the same kind of anthropomorphism as these kinds of foxmen or the pandaren of WoW and the like. All of the ones you mentioned were proper monsters, not inserts of fursonas.

But the only thing that makes them "proper monsters" is the weight of precedent, is what I'm saying. There's no fundamental difference in kind between a human-shaped dog and a human-shaped fox, other than just "we've always had anthropomorphic dogs, so they're okay, but anthropomorphic foxes, now, that's just outside."

It's all in the presentation, Liz. This one triggers all the warning signs in the name already.

I'm gonna side with Liz on this one, since your argument would apply to werewolves but you don't seem to have an issue with lycanthropes (even though, Core-wise, you can put any animal you want through the lycanthrope template, legitimately yielding fox-men, panda-men and so forth... Not that pandas get a statblock).

I once played on a site where someone played an anthropomorphic dolphin with tits. Hyooge tits.

serbiris wrote:

I'm gonna side with Liz on this one, since your argument would apply to werewolves but you don't seem to have an issue with lycanthropes (even though, Core-wise, you can put any animal you want through the lycanthrope template, legitimately yielding fox-men, panda-men and so forth... Not that pandas get a statblock).

It's because Lyrantrophes are part of our folklore. Kitsunes and ... Anime ... Characters are a relatively new concept; which doesn't fit anywhere in mankind's stories, myths and legends..

Svensk, I love you dearly, but I may very well have never heard a weirder statement than "kitsunes don't fit anywhere in mankind's myths and legends." There's this place called Japan, you might have heard of it?

Fox-spirits would work in a Japan-inspired setting like legend of the five rings. Shoehorning them into FR is just painful, especially when the examples tend to be more about Wapanese than Japanese culture. I have seen too much of both shoehorned anime-inserts and furries bringing their fetishes into games already.

Btw. I have seen a character named Nekomusume (lit. Catgirl) in game. This falls in the same category.

Liz wrote:

Svensk, I love you dearly, but I may very well have never heard a weirder statement than "kitsunes don't fit anywhere in mankind's myths and legends." There's this place called Japan, you might have heard of it?

Yes and I love you too..

But , Gah ... We're playing in the forgotten realms. Our server is based on kings and queens, Paladins and knights, Soldiers and that stuff.

Our setting is more akin to The lord of the Rings - Would't it be odd to throw in a japanese cat-girl alongside legolas?

Edit - O.o

Folks, this is the Lore forum. Not the "discuss the cultures and traditions, myths and legends of various peoples of the word" forum. So, unless someone has relevant information pertaining to the question asked, please take these discussions to PMs and/or the Off Topic forum. Thank you.

slkNihilus wrote:

Folks, this is the Lore forum. Not the "discuss the cultures and traditions, myths and legends of various peoples of the word" forum. So, unless someone has relevant information pertaining to the question asked, please take these discussions to PMs and/or the Off Topic forum. Thank you.

Splitting the thread might not be a bad idea, since setting integrity is an interesting topic.

But parts of the Forgotten Realms *are* a Japan-inspired setting. We've had lots and lots of characters from Wa and Kozakura before.

Nihilus, I'm not seeing how this discussion is out of place. We're talking about whether X creature fits well into FR lore. This seems like the perfect forum for that conversation.

I think Nihilus was basically suggesting the rest of you should at least match my level of maturity and interest in the topic (anthropomorphs with boobs.) :wink:

Yossarin wrote:

I think Nihilus was basically suggesting the rest of you should at least match my level of maturity and interest in the topic (anthropomorphs with boobs.) :wink:

... you're the reason we can't have nice things. :wink:

Well, in essence what Yoss said.

But also the problem is that people were discussing real-world myths and legends of Japan, not a lore aspect of the FR setting, Kara-Tur or otherwise. Kitsunes were not introduced in any of the books dedicated to that part of the FR universe, so it's unlikely they were introduced at all. So while I see no problem with the discussion in and of itself, it's not something pertaining to the lore of the game world, hence, its place isn't here.

Liz wrote:

We've had lots and lots of characters from Wa and Kozakura before..

Maybe one in ten of those have failed to make me cringe. Turning them into fox-people probably won't improve that one bit.

I can only assume that TEEN WOLF brought us here.

Let's not troll ...

Quote:
since setting integrity is an interesting topic.
'

Setting integrity is what it is all about. While we are holding the leash tighter nowadays then we did previously, We still have quite the leeway for people to play celestials, demons, devils, genasi (I play one) and all manner of outsiders. There are around five Werewolves (I used to play one) on the server and various other creatures like Kenku (Haven't seem them in a while?) gnoll , half dragons and drow.

This is my personal opinion, and it's harsh, but here goes:

We have already stepped over the line what is immersion breaking (We did that years ago), and while we try to rein back on that we aren't doing it fast enough.
I want to see less special races and less monsters on the servers. They should be portrayed by DM's who have the proper TOOLS, (Notice how i say tools here) to portray them properly.

Take my werewolf for for instance. While i did an excellent job at portraying him he was still depending on heavy gear and the usual balance-stuff like high fortitude, AC, AB and other things to be portrayed as a proper 'Monster!'.
But since i did not have the TOOLS to give him that he just came off as a puny puppy - Which resulted in me removing him from the setting.

Players, given the current tools of the module, does not have what it takes to properly portray a monster race. (Maybe half-dragons because we do have a serious shitton of dragon related things?)

Stuff like Kitsunes and werewolves should not even be request only; They should be DM only.

Eternal-Vortex wrote:

Have Kitsunes actually been intoduced to the FR settings?

No.

But there are Hengeyokai (Oriental Adventures, p.10) which are similar and not limited to foxes.

From what I gathered from the topic and those who have read the books on these particular eastern kingdoms is:

1. Boobs are fun to Yoss
2. Kitsune was not introduced in 3.5
3. The eastern lands have Chinese and Japanese settings but should not be seen as complete copies of the nations (E.g: Language etc)

Nope and we don't plan on adding them any time soon (to Amia), sorry! Locked.

Kitsunes

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