https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ou76DXq57MI

I log on just to get out of the 'people aren't logging in so others won't' attitude, at least to help start a spiral reaction.

_________________
Rosary Doodlekins - Hin Candy Witch

Wow, a cancerous thread about a cancer that is causing people not to play. Why not just play if you want to? With that said I'm logging on.

_________________
Plays Yoweth'Ssissth Kelia

_________________


2015 Mr. AMIA with the Fabulous Estara ~ 2015 Best Developed SOB Character: Rith'tar

I didn't have any role in planning that event. My PC isn't Hin so I couldn't participate either, although she lives in Bendir Dale. What did I do about it? I took my little gnome who lives there and stood around while the Hin all had their fun and simply observed and commented. In other words, I respected their Roleplay.

Now, others are taking this OOC B.S. nicely but I'm not going to. This is a perfect example of the complaints heard on this very thread. OOC complaining about someone else's RP. You don't belong to the faction. In fact, you disparage the faction, which you know nothing about although you probably think you do. Yet you complain about a small player driven faction event, because they wanted it to be a small player driven faction event.

_________________
Tark Hammerfeast - Immovable Object
True Greenspan - Bendir's Boy Wonder

Honestly, what keeps me from logging on a lot of times is too many options, not enough time, and not enough will or resources to see them through. One of my main's things is to go around creating stuff(occasionally destroying too). Like myself, he enjoys much more planting the seeds of creativity and handing it over to others to do what they will. That doesn't work with fewer people and me having less time and less will than I should to help out with them.

I've got plenty of ideas for projects and characters. If I had the DCs, I would literally pitch them to people and pay for them to exist in the world. Not even to interact with my character, just to be there. But I don't. So I can't. So I'll instead wander around, bicker or talk with people as it comes up, and keep growing the list of "things I want to do, if I have time." It's nothing I can really pin on the DMs or players. I'll watch or read some fantasy fiction, play another game, and get really inspired and come back to Amia, but slowly over time something imperceptible just keeps me from bringing all that to bear. It's why I want to pick up scripting again, so I can create some of the mechanics and cool stuff that I'd love to see ingame and just hand it over for the server to use if it wants. But that again is an issue of RL time and resources.

_________________

I'm just going to make a quick note that Maglorine is absolutely right in this, and I pretty much have the same stance. An appropriate place for this to have come up, since this is exactly the attitude I was talking about when I suggested the way we treat each other is one of the reasons for the quietness of late.

If people could stop judging others' RP and OOC lambasting people for no reason (it happens all the time, in all parts of the forums), I know the numbers would increase. This attitude sticks to people. It makes them not want to log in or interact with anyone because they just don't feel the "magic" they once felt when they reached their character selection screen. I know this to be the case because it's exactly how I feel. I was going to log in this morning and was looking forward to it, but now I don't want to and I'd rather go spontaneously make breakfast for my parents after they helped me move yesterday. Because they're nice and smiley and helpful and don't ask for anything in return.

I'm not directing my commentary at any one person. It's not just one person who's perpetuated the bad feelings. Historically, the DMs haven't cracked down on it, which may have lent to the problem (I perceive) now. I've been here a good long time and plenty of people come to me to rant or ask for advice about OOC stuff. I've always tried to be the voice of reason to help them calm down and get back to playing. It doesn't always work, but I try. But lately I've been having trouble getting past all of the negativity, and I'm not even personally involved or targeted by any of it.

The first thing to remember about Amia is that this is a hobby. No one should feel negatively about their hobbies. Once it becomes a chore or you begin to resent even looking at these forums, it stops being a hobby. And then it stops being something you bother to do.

I kind of ranted a little bit, and I apologize, but I'm hoping that a little bit of perspective might help some others see or understand that we are a community and should start acting like we have common ground, at least. That'll help so many people get back to playing, myself included.

_________________

This is the crux of the situation.... Bendir Dale is home to hin, gnome, dwarf, and fey. The vast majority are hin, as we all know. With the current situation (being that there were threats made to Bendir Dale, before the event was announced), it was ICly decided to keep it closed to only hin and kept within our walls. As far as I know, only one person was actually offended by this, but perhaps if any others were, they just kept it quiet. Factions are allowed to have private events. In fact, I'd think that's why factions exist, in part... to offer something to their members that the entire rest of the population doesn't get? Wouldn't you think?

My hat is off to Maglorine for the way she handled this. In fact, she did it so flawlessly, that until this post went up, it hadn't occurred to me that she wouldn't have been involved. She watched, and in her own way, participated, but didn't interfere. That's a person I'll interact with ANY DAY. Whereas someone whose sole purpose was to undermine an event, I'll avoid.

In fact, that's my new attitude. Instead of bitching and moaning, I'll log in and play. I'm taking a cue from Guardian, and keeping OOC out of my gaming. Too many times, when things get to an OOC level, that's where everything falls apart. However, if you consistently do things that would annoy my character (or the player), prepare to be ignored IC.

I recently had a problem with another player, and found that by ignoring them ICly, my experience was drastically improved. I'd been nearly ready to quit over it, since at one time they were a friend, but now, I find that I enjoy my playtimes more because I don't have to worry about silly OOC bullshit and stresses.

So.... I know I'm rambling, and probably will be blasted for airing dirty laundry, which, in reality I did not do. I'm pointing out a trend and it's a very old saying, "Familiarity breeds contempt.". I personally do much better when I don't know the player, but immerse myself in the character. I'd think that's why we're all here really, to play a character who interacts with other characters.

Honestly I stopped playing because a lot of my old RP buddies left the server (and previous things that were mishandled back in the day with the WKs). Sure I could try to plow on, but Amia feels so finished to me after the main drive for the story ended and didn't seem to have much of a detrimental effect rather than a small description trigger when you jump off the boat. Might be missing a whole lot more, but at this point in time.. Eh. Maybe when Amia actually improves I might hop back on, but now it's only once in a blue moon. Kudos to the current DM team though and those who are trying to keep the dying fire lit.

Alternatively if you had a good pool of toolkit wizards, could always expand more areas of Amia rather than what happened with area culls back then. That shit was whack, yo. (And i'm fully expecting the "No one went there" arguements, not biting though).

_________________

YOU'RE ALIVE! ..I missed you.

_________________
I'm done. Goodbye.

Its a good point. Personally, I was not directly influenced by what happened to WK's, but indirectly and I saw it all play out in player side. It is not the first complaint heard over something that was poorly played out. I have placed few myself even on certain events and do stand by them. It just feels that DM team is quick to defend themselves rather than listen. However, when a plot manages to drive away over five players, I do think there is something that should be reconsidered. After the incident mentioned, it was so that only few had real impact, whereas others had nothing to do other than follow. While, other play supportive roles and other's play leading roles, the role itself has nothing to do with it, as long as the roleplay contributed has actual meaning instead of casted away by those who should consider it. Still, I feel to nobody's offence, that only few play a key role in order to a plot to be picked up.

_________________
http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/spells.htm

MuscleElf never dies.

_________________

So help an ignorant fucker out.

What happened to the WKs actually? Like I don't remember hearing about any permadeath events or something.

_________________


Playing: Tanar'i Shit Disturbers

Nothing to do with that. Those who are in position to reply, can do so and no need to further down the matter. You seem to enjoy the game so far so lets keep it so.

_________________
http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/spells.htm

We've talked more than enough, Tormak. If you don't understand what I mean, it's not important! If you want to know more, you know where to reach me. Those of you "defending" him... I wasn't attacking. It was a statement, an observation, not a debate. I am so happy things are going well with you all! I have always thought Tormak has outstanding moments as a DM, despite being close enough to him at times to comment on his personal flaws... even when he doesn't want me to.

As for you, CCL, I was not even talking about you! I'm sorry you think I'm upset about Caron and specific things there! I'm not. Though it seems you might be. I am and was happy to have whatever done to Caron, under proper parameters. One perspective has nothing to do with it. It has to do with losing the purpose of roleplaying, the STORY of it. RP has become a competition between most people rather than a mutual storytelling adventure. Often the blame for that competition and the horrible things to come out of it (bitching players, tired DMs, exhausting drama) falls back on the people who started the RP in the first place, who got IC and DID something. That is shameful.

It is, as I've said, that the story has been lost. Even RESPECT for the story has been lost. And with that, respect for each other.

I don't miss the Arcanum. I was glad it was gone. It needed to be finished sooner, better, more wholly, honestly. Not that many know most of the details and variables, because who could? It lasted way too long. Still, before that, there were things such as Robert's Count Morteguarde and Peeves's Monuments and (though I hated it, as my paladin was a partially disgraced one of Bahamut at the time) Tormak's Dragon War. Plots with depth, with DMs who were devoted to them, and not just because "omg my friends are playing" or "oh I said I would run this faction" or "hit me up, I'm a DM with nothing to do." Things that were inspired by creativity, that got people involved with one another! They were not things that were split off and focused and just... eh. I don't know what word to choose. Stagnant, pre-determined, offensive, competitive, maybe even lame... And none of those are targeted at any one of you. It's targeted at everything.

You all can say the new evil faction is so eager and fun and to get involved, but from someone watching from the outside, what has it done? Destroyed an evil place where no one was even active and pissed off a bunch of people in the process? (I'm not taking sides in that one.) You can claim, come look and see what they're doing! I tried! I logged in as my age-old drow just to try to witness the fun, and was told that they were off "in an event." Poo. Even if I hadn't missed them, there's not much of anyone on for them to do stuff TO so essentially what they're doing is being evil and awesome to nothing. I mean, the first time I logged on Caron in literally months some of them hunted him down within minutes. I fully understand it was an IC reason, and I don't begrudge anyone the IC. I do still have a problem with the rude commentary I received from multiple people, but whatever, it's gone with time.

I mostly found it amusing. Hunt down a character that hadn't been played in months. It was comical! And inspiring. I was happy to know Caron had such an effect...

Further, yes, I know that you're trying to revive more Dragon stuff with the Dragon Games, Tormak... and probably some other DMs are trying to bite into what their passion is! It's just not as creatively done. There's no pull. At least, I don't feel it. All I really see are these kinds of threads, over and over again, full of ranting and raving. I think you're all too stretched, too tired, too complacent. I don't see anyone passionately advocating their plots, jumping in and getting things going. This thread even talks about how many people are commenting but not playing. Personally, I have very rare moments of wanting to log in. When I feel like reminiscing. When I see an old friend. To finish things up. That's about it.

So, I repeat. The story is gone. You have all lost the fucking story. If you can't see it, it's because you're blind or you never saw it in the first place.

I'm sure some things are still fun, but by and large.. it's lost. You all have stifled yourselves, year after year, by infighting and getting caught up in players' petty arguments (as Jes explains) and focusing on drama or friends rather than the heart of what Amia was. A STORY. I mean, I'm fine bragging about myself and stating that I clearly know enough behind-the-scenes details to go on a full list of detailed events and people and places and times of shit gone wrong, but it's not worth it. Suffice to say, the playerbase and The Team have taken the wrong things seriously, instead of what should have been taken seriously. Not just this Team. Many Teams, many iterations. The backstabbing is not just among players. It's among everyone. Yes, I've witnessed it firsthand, even within said Teams.

So, when I say it's the Team's fault, I don't mean it's only their fault. It's obviously everyone's. You should be able to have fun without DMs. I certainly can! And shit happens. I've even had my fair share! I just mean it's the Team's responsibility to get back into creativity, and if they can't, they should quit. No DM should sit there. We shouldn't have "inactive" DM slots. It's ridiculous. Honestly. DMs should be the creative DRIVE. Every time this argument comes down to an argument to whether the onus should be on the DMs or on the players. I will, every time, say the Team. It's part of the shtick. You take up a volunteer role, you know what you're getting. Don't bitch. Just quit, if you've had enough. No one would blame you. I definitely won't.

Anyways. The story, the story, the story. Find it again and I may return actively, and not just for finishing things up. Except not that many of you would want that, at this point, I think. So who knows! I'm not even sure why I post here. Maybe it's part of my closure. <3

- Estara / Daniel

PS Rosary, I don't know how you deal with it. You have been the target of so much griping lately. Between messed up wall drama and faction events and being one of the only active IC leaders... well. Good luck to you! Sorry to see people rail on you so much.

PPS Commie, I always want to stuff a chill pill down your throat, though your tenacity is, as usual, inspiring. Glad to see you still have such a passion for making things better. I'd maybe focus on things other than Bendir's faction events, though. Maybe your own?!

PPPS Maze, so good to see you posting! Welcome back! You are right about Sammy. A DM that has put forth such positive efforts, time and again, only to watch as her Team members fall like flies. It's literally amazing that she's still up there hacking away. Hmm. I think that's enough postscripts.

_________________

Whew! Good. <3

The story is what you all as players make it. We DMs are here to support you so you can explore your own stories. PM any DM if you want help, PM multiple DMs at that, and be prepared to work for your goals. If you do the work, do the rp, involve others, and most importantly have fun then we will be there to offer you the support you need. Prepare to lose as much as you win and you will have fun.

Log in, have fun, and profit. Many of us have been playing on Amia for almost a decade now and I have seen the player base change, mold, and shift repeatedly. You know the biggest factor in that? Not the DMs, but the players themselves. The player lead groups, factions, and activities mark some of the biggest and most rewarding changes I have seen. Send us PMs and not just one DM, bug a few of us, because we get overworked and over loaded with requests.

_________________
Active
Levexal
Techsmith Tokas Tokersun - http://amiaworld.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=88661

Estara,

On behalf of my faction's part, I'm going to give you my most formal apologies. Wasn't trying to make you feel ignored, but I was quite simply actively preoccupied in something which I couldn't pull away from for you.


That said, I'm more than willing to try and let you give us down in the deep realms another chance -- if you're not already that jaded against us!

_________________


Playing: Tanar'i Shit Disturbers

Estara has said a good number of things that many of us, DM and player alike, should pay heed too.

Stay thirsty, friend.

_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming

TRIGGER WARNING: I'm not a nice person.

"You lost the story"

OK so what the fuck does "the story" mean?

Do you want a server plot made by DM's and progressed only by DM's, for the whole server to collectively take part in, like the Arcanum was? Is that what you mean?

Don't be vague when you're blasting people about shit (whether or not you realize that this is what you did.) What do you mean by "you lost the story"?

Personally in regards to this thread topic, I log on when I feel like it, and don't feel beholden to anything here, because it's a video game. Sorry if this contributes to the server being "quiet." (I know nobody was asking about me specifically, I am merely stating my personal view of activity on the server. I just log on when it fancies me. I am involved in actually important things IRL, so this video game takes the back burner indefinitely.)

Estara, if you logged on once to interact with a faction and we were caught up in something, then... Log on some other time and/or set up a time with the faction leader to RP because our leader is pretty busy sometimes. Denigrating all of us for what looks like no real reason at all, provokes emotional reactions that aren't helpful. Your statements here are melodramatic. It isn't helpful and as a result, it most obviously doesn't deserve "paying heed" to until it's specific and helpful.

I'd be lying if I said that this kind of faux profundity and drama wasn't a driving reason for me losing respect for the community overall and not wanting to log on more often. I have zero time for it. Just play your video game, people.



It feels like your major opinion is stuff about "the story." So elaborate on that in a specific way without beating around the bush or using fluffy rhetoric. What do you actually want out of the server? What did they lose that made you leave? Do you want stronger DM involvement in a central story for everybody to take part in, instead of lots of player-centered stories?

_________________
Osiris Masud

Flattered to get so many responses!

Maverick- Not sure you were talking just to me, but you said some points that exacerbate precisely where we disagree on things. It is not just up to players, it is up to you, too. If you bank on it being only up to players, you are not being creative enough and you are not doing your "job." Morteguarde, The Arcanum, Big Green Lake Monster, The Evil Dragons, even Burning's version of Caraigh and more all had their own goals and desires and the villains furthered them with and without player interaction at times. It may be this obsession with placing onus on the player action that has driven the Team and the playerbase into the ground, in part. Stories with depth have many facets, and do not need the players to constantly be up in arms begging you to do things with them.

As a sidenote, I hate how comfortable people have become with calling things in RP "work." (This is not you specifically, Mav, it's many people who do it.) It really had become work! Trying to write up massive requests that cover every little detail, trying to prove yourself to people, trying to manage OOC relationships so that people will be willing to even RP, trying to be a faction leader with a Team who says it's all on you to manage (except maybe this new evil group that is Tormak's little baby). Whew. Rough.

SOA- Thank you for apologizing! It's much appreciated, but I'm not upset! I'm just stating the facts. I have no desire to plan it. I actually hate planning RP in general, though I do see the necessity at times. This is not a necessary time. Maybe one time I'll try again. I simply felt it was proper to say I tried while stating my points. Anyways, you all were off doing private faction things, which I definitely do not begrudge, but furthering the point that it seemed confusing to me. I did not understand who you are being evil to... NPCs? I'm not sure. I didn't even see any other players besides you guys on.

MisterLich- I had no intention of provoking you emotionally. Frankly I'm very confused. You hardly know me and we have had almost no RP together! Regardless, I think the main part of my post stands for you. "If you can't see it, it's because you're blind or you never saw it in the first place." I think you have a good point calling it vague seeing as how I purposefully avoided specifics. I think it is clearer to those who have come face-to-face with what I'm talking about, who have seen RP "stories" corrupted by the obsession with things other than RP. I'm not sure you have, though, and if you haven't that's probably a good thing.

If you're looking for an exact definition of what I mean, it is something like this. A "story" on Amia used to mean, "A mutual story-telling experience involving character conflicts, faction investment and community effects where you Roll with the Punches." I stopped seeing most of these things. Character conflict? It results in OOC drama. Or people don't care much anymore. Faction investment? Results in Team/player drama. Or inter-faction drama. Or player drama. Or all of it. Community effects? The latest resulted in a 3-page diatribe where people were pissed. These are the latest facts. Not to say that didn't happen before, but they were certainly dealt with differently!

I even had experiences lately where DMs/players told me they would refuse to RP with people because they had personal problems! Oh MAN if that had happened back in the day... There used to be PRIDE. For the story. It was more important than being sensitive to things or being bitches to each other or competitive or controlling what direction Amia went in. It is so sad.

Either way, you pointing your finger at me and telling me my overdramatic statements (admittedly, I often tend to have an overdramatic air) about the current state of Amia are making you not want to log in really only emphasize that you may be focused on the wrong things. I don't even play at the moment! I'd hope that you'd see this as a long-time, mostly retired player posting in a thread that was asking for feedback on why no one plays- why I specifically don't play very much- not that you'd take it so personally. Especially seeing as I personally don't even know you. I assure you, I have nothing against you! And honestly? I really don't think you're that mean!

Alright. I think I've done the best I can answering for now. Cheers!

The reasons I'm gone have been stated in this thread, and then followed up by people flatly declaring "That reason does not exist, and the people who say they left for that reason are not being honest."

The place I'm playing now is not perfect, but it's not full of assholes.

_________________
Winner of Amia's "Most Ethical Time Traveler" award 2026

Character Portraits!

ESTARA! I miss you terribly. You and then next your amazing characters. It's actually comforting to know you're out there... lurking... you voyer you.

Yes, imagine my surprise when I had time to log in and there were 5 players... total... on both servers. i thought it was some holiday I was missing. So to answer the OP it's damn quiet.

So, here's the thing, I'll defend the Hin since they always have great events that most are allowed to participate in. Granted they didn't allow MY character in times past, the fiends... something about no blackguards or some such. The one time they do their own thing and player(s) get bent? Instead of doing something about it? Hell, Rith'tar would loiter in the road making remarks to everyone that passed by. It was great fun to get threatened by War Knights or joined by others of like mind.

I had been working on a plan to take out Nec'perya (sorry ebil drowsies!). It was hard to get traction for lots of reasons and now that I know how Team Dragon-kin did it I am so jealous! Kudo's to Naltyrr for creating an opportunity for himself and to that sneaky ghost of a drow that picked all the locks in Nec'perya. As for the complaints of lack of notice... it's been done this way for a long time as far as I know. Hint: If "shennanagans" is used, make sure to have all your potions stocked and epic gear on. Just saying.

I had the great pleasure of DM Mercedes making my characters life miserable. Now, this was a one time thing where they stopped in, did their dirty trick, then left. Oh and it was awesomely nasty. I didn't wait to see what else Merc would do, oh no. I went out and RP'd. Every once in awhile Merc would show up, throw a wrench in the works and it was marvelous!

All you who were at the Shrine when Rith'tar got the boot stomp? That was started by one little action by Merc that I ran with. Our goal had been to get as many other characters involved as possible and I think we were pretty successful. Granted I could grouse about the fact that my little team had built up the Shrine and in one event Rith'tar was killed and we lost everything. [By everything I mean several mod changes, additions, changes to the golems, dev designs that had to be thrown away etc. Ouch.] But do you know how many players were there?! RPing?! Doing something interesting and fun in Amia?! A lot. It was great.

There seem to be areas for improvement sure. For my part, I'm going to continue to find interesting things for my characters to do. I'm going to hope that some DM will jump in and do something interesting like dopleganger a kobold and read a priest the riot act for being bias against kobolds, or bring a skull faced lawful good knight into a tavern for a glass of milk, have a demon stop by and have a chat with their blackguard, or put a snowman placeable for characters who were building a snowman, or appear as a fey that leads characters to epic treasure... ok that last one is just wishful thinking on my part but you get the idea.

I think the best events are mysteries that aren't impossible to solve and don't take a year to conclude. We never did find that dobleganger did we? All the better if we didn't. Can players submit ideas to the DM team? Can players offer ideas on how to end events?

I'm not planning to leave while there's fun to be had. For those of you who left, can I have your stuff?

_________________


2015 Mr. AMIA with the Fabulous Estara ~ 2015 Best Developed SOB Character: Rith'tar

Amia was always about the players. We made each others' stories. That, for me, was always better than any sort of overarching DM plot. There was rich player conflict and intrigue, bumping and meeting new people, forging new stories with new characters. Good communities, even. I will always enjoy the memories of my characters and their interactions with other players: Haan, Aylomen, or even Ilasmirene with the elves.

Then I started to see there was a growing problem, and I wanted to be an active part of fixing that problem. I stopped playing for the sake of my own enjoyment, and started playing because I was trying to mend a community-- and that not only burned me out, but made me lose touch with my friends. I pursued this endeavor with too great a fervor, and became a douuuuche.

I don't know. I can't offer any kind of feedback as to why you guys are having a quiet period, a lull. It's silly for me to provide ideas, or even dive too far into why I stopped playing, because after I stopped playing you guys developed the server into what it is currently. It's very much your server, and I'm very much an old dog. I mean, Tarnus is a DM now (Whaaaaaaat, socool), factions and characters and players have taken the forefront in ways I wouldn't recognize.

But I will say that old players who stopped playing are still probably watching, just like myself. It probably isn't too hard to reach out, if there's a will. If there was some kind of old-player/new-character event that encouraged people to get back into it together, you might find modest support. I guess.. hrm.. most people aren't gone-gone-gone, they just need a nudge. They need to be inspired again. Good Rp, and I mean good rp, usually distracts people from being OOCly rude to each other.


It might seem too fundamentally simple--- but my most sincere advice is to not try to fix these problems by giving them more attention than the quality of your RP, and your enjoyment of the game.

So much this! I know I am in this boat right now. When I do log on, I just don't know what to do. Most of the times I just wander around aimlessly hoping to find someone to RP with. I have no idea what is going on on the server in terms of plots other than the dragonstuff. Lyraesel are scared of those thingies.

I suppose some people make new characters when they don't know what to do with their current ones. Maybe Lyraesel is just spent and I need to move on? Eggh... I have only had two characters in almost four years. But even if I make a new one, I have no idea what that would be.

*Lacks inspiration!*

Oh, and I do miss Ilasmirene Telynna.

Oh i agree here, tis the greatest evil when your not feeling inspired! I know some things that are happening but when it isn't happening or your not in the join the happening mood, you tend to end up wandering, wondering and feel the happening is happening when you not there!

_________________
When it rains, look for rainbows.
When it's dark, look for stars.

Took a break. Logged in to day. Have a necromancer summon Undead in-front of paladin pc. Just cause. Interrupts the conversation was having with other paladin pc. Tell them to get rid of it. They don't. PVP. Dead. Rp a lil but wait around dead still in good mood cause it was nice to talk to friend. Company comes over. Log out. Forum posts immediately passive aggressive over critique and simple statements of examined facts. Told it's nothing personal-but topic changes to personal with direct reference to one of my characters on a path that has nothing to do with the topic. Happens to be about my 'way' of playing paladin. On the same day. That I log in... after a break... and pvp a necro master.

Pleasure at the expense of others.
Interesting visit.

_________________

@PS-

I am really sorry that that was your first day "back" so to speak. I know you had company show up IRL and had to go, but, I can assure you the roleplay went on after you left and if you had been able to be there, you -may- have enjoyed it a bit more. Also, there will always be idiots that want to harm people for whatever reason. Some call it "conflict", in this case, I call it stupidity and childishness, based on my knowledge of the situation. Also, how you play your character is up to you, and the IC effects of that are something you as the player roll with or... your character changes and adapts to IC situations, but that's a whole other story. I hope you give Amia another visit, and I do hope it works out better.

The original intent of this post wasn't to drum up negativity, or have debates about why people are leaving. Why did I post it?

I wanted to bring awareness to all those lurkers and people not logging in "just because", that we need players in order to play. Amazingly, some good did come from this thread.

1) Commie and Mav seem to have hooked up to work on Pitt's stuff.
2) Maze of Thorns is back.
3) Some other names that we haven't seen ingame are showing signs of life here. Perhaps we can get them ingame too?

I learned something too, no matter what the topic, Amians will debate it to death. OOC is evil. Yes, evil I say. If we aspire to keep things IC, I think most of us are mature enough to deal with IC actions and consequences. I don't give a crap who gets the story going, DM or player, so long as there is something. Winning and losing? No such thing in D&D. Winning simply means you enjoyed the ride. Losing means you gave up. Even if your character has everything taken from them, and is an outcast from their society, how they react tells whether they won or lost. But you as a player only lose if you give up. I've done it myself. I can't tell you how many times I changed characters because, "The RP dried up.", when in truth, it went a direction I didn't want, I could have run with it, but I chose not to. I regret stabling so many characters, and constantly I'm reminded of good times with so many of my oldies. Most of the regret comes from not following through enough, not rolling with the IC punches and making something of the story. That's my fault. I'm trying really hard to not do that now, and simply act as my pc would, while keeping the OOC out of it.

Sure, I rambled a lot, and many of you likely will roll your eyes at what I wrote. Sure, there's issues on Amia, sure, it's an old game, but I'll tell you what... I've played on PW servers for nigh on 11 years now, and I've never seen so much OOC as I do here. Never have people who come together to play a game been so cruel and unreasonable to each other as I've witnessed here. Personally, I don't understand this unrelenting need to win at all costs, to break character and lore just to get a step ahead, and to criticize anyone who disagrees with you just for the sake of doing so.

Can't we all just try to get along? Look at the world around us... we're doing the same thing. So much hate, mistrust and backbiting. I think it'd be great if our little community here could just put all that shit away, play a game we all do for FUN, and just relax and enjoy the story.

_________________
I Am:
Derrin: 'Nothing to see here'
Beck: Hard working dwarf paladin.
Naela 'Widow': Wandering priestess.
Celinor Triellian: Paladin of Corellon.

_________________

Just an observation: The amian obsession to the whole alignment wheel and god system creates a competitive environment naturally, so it's not surprising that it resonates in the playerbase. I personally think some adjustments to the lore would fix problems in the playerbase, but I know how much everyone loves their pure lore.

_________________
a.k.a. Audrey Zinata

Well, no... we have many races being played here, and many people choosing races based on mechanics, rather than roleplay, even to the point of either denying they are that race or playing as a race they are not, so pure lore? I think on some level we have pure lore, but it's inconsistent.

This is so unfortunately true.

_________________
Mercadier - *sleeps six feet under the warm sands of Khem*
Alex - Life is adventure or nothing!
Eddie - Sex, drugs and rock'n... more sex.
=========
Obsidian (inactive)

Dude Guardian if you pollute the air with anymore smug I think we're gonna choke out. You aren't better than anyone about using classes and races that work well together, stop trying to play high ground and act like you're a better role player because of your class or race choices. This is a video game dude.

_________________

Gerald Edmund
Discord: Metal Viking Guy #5433

DC taxation is theft!

That's why I always keep banishes and word of faiths handy. Will vs death in an aoe! Catch a lot of people with it. Unexpected planetouched I call em.

Not that it's bad. But there are a lot of extraplanar pc's around!

_________________

ANT ALARM

ANT ALARM

_________________

Relative lack of consequences should violence ensue.

If I exclude short-timed characters I never played outside lvl 10, I had three in my history on Amia. All pure human, all pure classes with one exception of dual class that's hardly anyone consider a PB. Your post is irrelevant, Bobby, as That Guy stated what quite a few thinks. If it's a salt on your wounded consciousness, deal with it.

The fact many people build like mad and abuse races / classes to do so is a fact. Search posts I've made in 2012, even earlier, when I pointed out that building thread is a cancer. I still think it is, and I still think many people put character power before character development and RP. Again, if that bothers you, chew it and move on, because you're not changing my mind anytime soon.



You're not the first or the last one, CCL. At least two people I personally brought to Amia left for the same reason.

_________________
Mercadier - *sleeps six feet under the warm sands of Khem*
Alex - Life is adventure or nothing!
Eddie - Sex, drugs and rock'n... more sex.
=========
Obsidian (inactive)

I can certainly empathize with both sides of this, having been both, currently I'm aligned with CCL, but you can call me old. No video game really does anything for me anymore anyways. Would be interesting if there was a solution, but I haven't come up with one, granted I haven't tried hard; it's hard to make two opposite ideas intersect. So much developing over the 10 or so years has been focused around creating a mechanical sense of balance; but when you have players who care and players who don't, no numbers on any spreadsheet matter. To me it just seems like you'd have a losing scenario.

_________________
a.k.a. Audrey Zinata

PvP is really fun though. Making a good build and rolling out it seriously fun as hell.

I mean if you say your character is strong or a good fighter its good to be able to back it up.

Just my two cents.

_________________

ANT ALARM

ANT ALARM

_________________

on an rp server, pvp is part of rp. Unless this server is some sort of social server. D&D is traditionally about drama and conflict. If you don't want to make characters that are optimized, then don't get in peoples face or try to "fight evil". Unless you expect to loose. It is just a game after all.

_________________
Plays Yoweth'Ssissth Kelia

I don't think this it's the past few days, few weeks, months, it's the past few years. I'll preface this with:
"I've been planning on leaving Amia on my ten year anniversary there for the past year unless I started greatly enjoying it again"
That anniversary is this month. My decision to leave or stay has been pulled back and forth so many times that my doctor says the whiplash is now contagious. Since the Arcanum plot wrapped up, yeah, there's been a lot less to do in general. Things started slipping there when players with PC's, some of which existed solely as a result of the plot or had been involved from the get go, no longer knew what to do. Back then, I would go through class, go through work, all the while thinking "Oh shit, I have so much to do on Amia tonight, it's gonna be awesome". The past year it's become: "Whelp... I'm sure I'll find something to do or make something to do for people".
But people became less involved with everything in the server. Factions, some of which housed players that knew nothing on Amia -but- the arcanum plot, obviously fell apart. We all knew it would be a bitch when it ended and I think, I really think, we just weren't prepared player side or DM side for just how weird things were going to get.

Arcanum plot ends, pieces are kind of being picked up, things are kind of moving in generally decent directions. The good old mostly active DM's had some fun plots they were running; things were looking up... and then things got weird again. The persistence of this persistent world began dying down. We randomly had a Phane dropped into Central Cordor which had so much potential to be great and, instead, was abandoned when we lost a DM. Rather than find an excellent addition of a large quest or story, we are left with a buggy shell of something that serves only now to pump Elyon's magic bags full up with mythals (go get 'em, Elyon! Someone ought to). It's one example of something in game that is completely immersion and lore breaking as part of the persistent world and has left an entire section of a city even more dead than when most of it was hovering in the air with a demi god on top. Most of Cordor, to be fair, has kind of gone the way of Wharftown... which is empty almost entirely because three people left.

So we have this mess. We have post war loose ends wrapping up, strange occurrences on a grand scale where maybe two of twenty people involved have a clue what's going on. Can't get much worse, yeah? *insert buzzer noise denoted incorrectness*
Arelith started dying
PotM started dying
Cormyr started dying
And we were the next logical choice. These servers didn't die out because of natural causes, they were murdered. Most unintentionally but murdered nonetheless.
The cause of death is largely a mixture of children finding NWN on accident by playing NWO and seeing what it's about and, let's be real, children ruin servers, and DM's not being able to deal with this new brand of neophyte player in a game nearly two decades old.
Some of you only know of Amia, which is good. Amia was a good server for a long, loooong time. A bit hard to swallow and filled with some shit heads now and then but mainly really good. Let me give you a quick rundown:
Arelith- Amia was cloned from it back in the early 2000's. It was a shit hole then, it's a shit hole now. Our DM's and devs moved story, their DM's and devs pushed pretty mechanics with no plot and, oh yeah, there are confirmed eleven year olds. Started dying because the DM's can't deal with children and asshats and there you go.
PotM- A gothic entry into the serverscape. A DM team decent with storytelling and enough scripting to make you feel like you aren't in Amia. Used to be incredible until a bunch of children and asshats overtook the server and, in this RP rich environment, tried to make a bunch of powerbuilds until it was clear things were going nowhere so these children had to migrate as well.
Cormyr- It's been the same ten people playing this damned setting for the past five years but, hey, at least they are persistent... all ten.

These children and asshats found their way to Amia en masse starting about two years ago and -that- is what I think was the final nail in the coffin. There was a brief excitement logging one day and seeing there were -actually- a lot of people logged in... and then immense disappointment when, after five months off, the first bio I see is (close enough to verbatim)
"Hi, I'm Kelley! I'm new to nwn but not new to role playing so don't worry, I'm good! I'm 19 and from california and have been playing video games since I was a kid, so don't worry!
Okay, bio time (I know, lame)"

I saw this. I saw this and began praying to a god whom had, clearly, already failed that this was someone I knew being an asshole.
Nope. Messaged them. Brand new player.
I informed them of why that wasn't acceptable and they seemed to take heed but that was a serious indicator to me that the times, they were a'changin'. The brunt of these new players came in knowing next to nothing about Forgotten Realms lore and, ergo, even less about Amia. Most didn't read up on the forums before diving in, just dived in and figured they'd do fine. A lot of them still think they're doing fine. (they aren't and I don't know which one of you, if any, are 'Kelley' but... hope you found a good path)

After this, I couldn't help but see it everywhere I looked. A few familiar non Amian logs, immature behavior, PvP happenings that went OOC in half a second and stayed that way, people refusing to RP with other players because of IC reasons; I was seeing -new- behavior.
Or, rather, I was seeing 'familiar' behavior. Most of these people came from a dying server where they were taught habits that they'd bring to Amia, thinking it was okay and either change to fit, go against the grain and get animosity, or just quit because "you should be able to hellball yourself". And as the servers come closer to drawing their last breath, players flock to Amia. This is where things get really bad.

We lost the majority of our DM team. We had something we'd not had happen on Amia. We had outside server deaths combined with DM's dropping like flies and the DM's and players, straight up, could not keep up with one another. I know when Ash left, he put a lot on the shoulders of the DM team but it just isn't how it is. It's a numbers game right now and nothing is adding up proper. High amount of players with a low amount of years on their life thus far, low amount of DM's with high amounts of internal and external stress; this is a recipe for disaster and the current DM team can only push personal plot lines for so long before Amia is dead as well.

This is Amia. An Island on the Trackles Sea on the plane of Toril in the Forgotten Realms. No one has ever read a forgotten realms book that didn't have an overarching plot. Amia needs one to survive right now not only because "that's what Amia has always been", but because "DM's can focus on one big thing and a few smaller things a lot easier than they can a million smaller things".
I believe in my fellow Amians. I believe the people I've been playing with for a decade can keep this server alive if they really want to.
If you want to DM, submit an application. The worst thing you'll get is a "no". Best thing, you help change the server.
You wanna be a dev, do the same. You want to be a player forever? Perfect, most of us do but at least -make- story or, at least, try to.
DM's are not your only source of plot, as SoA has proven (luckily. because all of Kohlingen is gone). You -can- make a difference to these players around you simply by being a big enough pain in the ass and, most importantly, remaining persistent in a persistent world.

I still haven't made up my mind as to whether or not October 2016 will be the last month I ever log into my favorite video game and I am hoping things will get better, at least marginally, in the next four weeks.

Love you all, but I'm not wasting what little eyesight I have left on... nothing.

_________________
Hel'Vyst Be'tner
Veris Al'Rith

- "Fuck you, I'm from Waterdeep."



(OMGOSH OLIVE MADE A LIL' HEL'VYST)

Syrstalk folks, I actually say that folk wanting to be strong is less about their desire to force PvP upon anyone as it is quite simply this: people want to be strong.

Nobody wants to feel like they're playing something that can't do anything -- which is exactly the reason we don't see interesting stuff like Liches, level 20 Shadowdancers, Vampires, and the like around. You can play them, but it's massively annoying to work with and more effort than any one person ever wants to put into a game.

Wouldn't you agree that, RP or no, it's way more enjoyable to look at figures for a character that acts as a guard that look like 40 STR, 26 CON, 62 AC, and 30s saves across the board than it is to sit behind your desk staring at 14 to every stat? No, let's not draw builds into this; because ultimately the (probably small) minority that would disagree with what I just said can evade their issue by simply not confronting it: The forums are 100% optional, bar the IC section and the request forum glory hole.



That said the comments defending PvP don't need to exist either because PvP is neither the devil, nor an innately good thing; and I still don't actively enjoy it so much as I like to be ready if it comes.

If we're really going to solve issues with the leaving player base, we're going to want to stop looking like we argue about everything and start addressing the fact that comments like these:



-are presently being made vaguely, by people who haven't played in years.


Nobody's going to ask them why they feel the way they do, or why they keep looking in if they're so sold on the idea that it's never improving?



EDIT: Ninja'd. Nick's right. Some of his stuff makes good positive points. The DM team is open for anyone to apply, we should start looking at one another and aforementioned team way more positively, we should think about what will develop plot for more people, and we should start (between us and the DMs) piecing together a cohesive 'story' of our own.

_________________


Playing: Tanar'i Shit Disturbers

So, uh... If it's any help on the actual player count, I might be back? Maybe? Been thinking of playing again lately but have been uncertain. I'll admit a lot of the negativity on this thread alone is a bit off-putting. But I may still hop on again just to see how things are going around Wharf town and the like.

But yeah. Hey guys.

_________________

So I've read through most of this thread and I have to say... You're all prickly as hell. I swear to god. Oh sweet RNGesus you people need some conflict. I've been busy with work, marriage, and adulting in general, but I'll be back in the next day or two. I've been putting something together for you people, but I need some DM help. Is anyone available?

P.S.

I love you all even if you are ornery little honey badgers.

I always loved Krin-conflict. Who knows, maybe I'll pop my head in sometime.

Yes, we need more Krin!

_________________
Osiris Masud

Krinflict!
Bring plenty of soap.

_________________
Aernoud Van Brabant: Heir of the House. Proprietor of the Beer Wagon.
"Go to the Mayfields, have a pint, and wait for this to blow over."
Aurelius: Sunmaster of Amaunator. Contemplative. Aspirant to Transcendance.
"Sol Invictus"

Krin for DM!!! no.. not Krin the Player! -Krin the CHARACTER-! Cause we all know Krin is that awesome that he can easily break 4th Walls... 5th Walls.. and so on!

_________________
Wilfire Strongfeet (Tight pants)
Adela Griffonheart (Poke)
Hallvardr Erikson (Sexy Boy)
Emilly MacMillan (Happy)



Sprites by Raua!