AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic

Last edited by Eighty-One on Sun, Feb 15 2009, 13:51 PM, edited 1 time in total.

Guns wrote:

I read that Jergal, AKA The Lord of the End of Everything, sanctions Undead to some of his followers. In other words, he allows some of his followers to raise undead under his authority and as long as it advances death.

Is this true?

Since Kelemvor became the Lord of the Dead, the creation of additional undead by Jergal's clergy is discouraged.

(From here)

Guns wrote:

If so, is Kelemvor okay with this? How would Kelemvorites typically react to seeing a Jergalite (or whatever they're called) with a summoned undead?

"I khill you!!" ? (Or however they react to other people with less-than-alive hang-arounds)

Guns wrote:

Lastly, I would assume druids wouldn't give a damn about a god sanctioning undead and would destroy it any way, right?

You would assume right.

Does anyone have a link to Blackguard lore? I am quite interested in reading more about the class while not wanting to buy any books.

Thank you.

There's no particular Blackguard "lore", it's just a generic Prestige Class. It can either be someone who's made a deal with an outsider capable of granting divine powers, someone who worships them (Graz'zt, Orcus, Mephistopheles etc., or lesser powers), or someone who is simply a divine champion to a deity. Scullya Darkhope of Bane is an example of the latter. I guess they're similar to Warlocks, and looking into Pact Magic (Tome of Magic) might be interesting.

What you'll want is lore on the fiend cult, evil outsider or religion that gives you your Blackguard abilities.

I don't trust info on the net, generally. You know my MSN, though.

What is the relationship of the celestials/angels/whatsits to the Deities?.. is there any or is "good" just another plane of existance..percieved simply as an energy like Fire/Water/etc

Also.. which titles should I sift through for further information specifically on the lore of the celestial/angel/brightandshinybeingofgood?

danke

There's a difference between Realmsian and core cosmologies. In Realmspace, beings of the planes generally live in a god's realm, since the planes are the gods' realms. I suppose you could say your typical beacons of light live on the planes of the goodly gods, though. House of Justice, perhaps, or Arvandor for more chaotic beings.

Solars are powerful outsiders, specific examples of such being the Shards of Selûne. I guess there's lots of lore on celestial beings, but I've never been particularly interested so I don't know where to look. Some core D&D source, that's for sure.

not FR specific - Book of Exalted Deeds is a pretty darn good place to look.

....pardon the pun.

also you might want to check some of the old planescape books, they are great at detialing the planes IMO.

Book of Exalted Deeds and the Manuel to the Planes.

Both books have celestial based information galore. The Manuel of the Planes is specfically excellent because it has information on all the planes as well, so not just Celestia. Since, you know, there are way more goodly planes then just Celestia.

In other news, this guy is in the book of exalted deeds!

Flying dwarf of dooooooooooooooooooooooommmmmmmmmmmmmm!!!

Mind that Manual of the Planes covers Great Wheel (aka Core) cosmology, and not Realmsian, but that's fine since everyone even most Realms fans like the Wheel cosmology better than the Tree.

The only thing I'd be mindful of is creatures with specific ties to factions or individuals that supposedly exist in core cosmology but not ours. The initiates of Pistis Sophia, for example, follow some celestial monk whose name is a rip-off from real gnostic tradition. An ill fit for Faerûn.

But your typial celestial creature types listed in the book are what you'd probably find in Amia's cosmology, too.

I got a new question regarding Bhaal; If say, I want to play a character who wants to (attempt to atleast) work towards resurecting Bhaal, the Lord of Murder, which deity would be most appropiate for him to worship in the meanwhile? Would it be Cyric, as I think he took Bhaals portfolio? If not, which of the living gods fit an assassin char the best? Is there any God of Assassins after Bhaal was killed?

Cyric would be good. Mask too.

I have a character idea and want to know how it can work itself into Faerun without mutilating lore. I want to make an ex-pirate character. What kind of weaponry/Gods/navigation info do yall got for me?

EDIT: maybe not Cyric? my sneaky killer type characters go for Mask. I read their little dogmas but don't listen to me for all their lore n stuff.

Worshipping Cyric is the last thing a Bhaalyn would do.

I don't think a god would grant spells to a cleric who's only worshiping them in the mean time well they try and revive Bhaal... Clerics are suppose to be the 'true believers' of a faith, following a god's dogma as closely as they can.

If you're not playing a cleric I see no reason why you need a god for the meantime, if your character truly believes in Bhaal's ideals he can continue to follow them even before he manages to help resurrect him.

Last edited by IronAngel on Fri, Jan 30 2009, 12:16 PM, edited 1 time in total.

Yeah, I doubt Bhaal has any allies among the deities anymore. Well, maybe Bane. But you generally wouldn't worship another deity as a cleric if you're trying to resurrect yours. Getting spells from Bhaal, thanks to his coma state, would probably be very difficult and taxing, RP-wise. You'd have to labour for every drop of divine magic unlike any other cleric, but it might become easier as time passes.

blackvswhite wrote:

I have a character idea and want to know how it can work itself into Faerun without mutilating lore. I want to make an ex-pirate character. What kind of weaponry/Gods/navigation info do yall got for me?

Nelanther isles have pirates, they're close to Amia. The Pirate Isles house lots of pirates too, they're in the inland Sea of Fallen Stars. The Dragon Coast in general is pretty notorious, I understand.

Pirates would appease and worship all the gods of the sea, as well as gods of thievery and possibly combat: Umberlee, Valkur, Istisha, Mask. Tymora, Beshaba and Tempus would be important in his trade.

He'd also give the occasional prayer to gods of law, to prevent from being caught. Helm and Tyr have the power to stop his brigandry, so he fears and respects them, and gives them sacrifice.

Valkur is the most likely patron, though. Maybe Umberlee if he's particularly sinister.

Don't forget Selune! Her stars guide sailors

Last edited by Yurell on Fri, Jan 30 2009, 12:16 PM, edited 1 time in total.

QPR wrote:

I got a new question regarding Bhaal; If say, I want to play a character who wants to (attempt to atleast) work towards resurecting Bhaal, the Lord of Murder, which deity would be most appropiate for him to worship in the meanwhile? Would it be Cyric, as I think he took Bhaals portfolio? If not, which of the living gods fit an assassin char the best? Is there any God of Assassins after Bhaal was killed?

There is no other god.
After Bhaal was killed, most of the followers of Bhaal went to worshipping Cyric, or Bhaal-Cyric as it were, just calling it a different aspect of the same god. All those who refused lost their powers, and were mercilessly hunted down and destroyed. Eventually it was accepted that Cyric was the new god.
They would not worship Mask or Cyric because the're who killed him.

Those who wish to resurrect Bhaal (and there is a Cult of Bhaal on the isle) would not worship Bane, as Bane is responsible for Bhaal's death - he killed many of Bhaal's followers t ogive himself more power, which weakened Bhaal before his battle with Cyric.

o0GuNz_N_RoSeZ0o wrote:

Don't forget Selune! Her stars guide sailors

Oh right, absolutely! Good catch.

I was thinking of having my pirate come from the seas outside Telflamm. Would that be reasonable?

I would also like to know what kind of weapons they would use. Does gunpowder exist? Cannons? If not, what is their replacement on their ships? IRL in melee a pirate with solid training would use a scimitar like weapon, and then a lighter sword with a little guard thing over the hand to be used defensively in the off hand. Rapiers were short-lived because they were to long to get around freely in the close-quarters of a ship. I was thinking maybe a little smaller and going double kukuri. If I decide on Nelanther or whatever, I need to go more monstrous with ogrillon prob, using double clubs (1.5 ft. long pegs they used to tie pretty much everything to on deck)

Wow, I got off track. I wanted to know about their long range stuff.

I believe I have a source book at home that deals with pirates in the forgotten realms. I will see what I can find out from it when I get home.

As for how their ships would be deisgned, I would assume like all navel warships prior to the invention of gunpoweder. I believe the romans and greeks would have versions of seige weapons, such as the Ballista and similar weapons but don't quote me on it.

as for weapons it really depends on your charachter. swords such as rapiars, scrimatars and basicly any good decent bladed weapon could be use by a naval fighter. Ranged weapons were also used for naval warefare, bows, slings,and various thrown weapons could be used.

I hope this helps.

No gunpowder or cannons, no. Well, theoretically some primitive version thereof has been discovered, but it's really only known to and used by Lantanese, AFAIK.

Ballistas, archers etc. However, the most succesful pirate ships also have something better than cannons: mages. A pirate wizard would be an incredibly valuable addition to any ship's crew.

And yeah, the Pirate Isles are pretty close to Thesk. He could've been pirating between Impiltur, Thesk (where Telflamm is), Aglarond and the Isles.

This is on the Dragon Coast warriors, including the Pirate Isles:

Warriors and Priests of the Realms wrote:

Warriors of the cities of the Dragon Coast do not fight
for king, country, or even a particular deity. They are
hard-nosed pragmatists who fight for themselves and the
few associates they trust. They see the wealth passing
among organized nations and cities like Waterdeep and
Suzail, and it only passes through the trade routes of the
Dragon Coast. They just want some of that wealth for
themselves as well.
Description
Though there is no “set” appearance for warriors of the
Dragon Coast, they do take certain measures to make
sure that people cannot tell much about them by simply
looking at them. Lavish displays of wealth, coats of arms,
and other distinguishing stamps of identity are avoided.
Most scabbards are deliberately obscured, and usually
many smaller weapons are hidden on a warrior’s person.
Their capes and cloaks are voluminous, hiding well what
lies under them. Dressed in this manner, a warrior never
needs to reveal any more about herself than she deems
necessary.
Role-Playing
Warriors of the Dragon Coast are opportunists, always
looking for a way to make money, whether it be by
piracy, a mercenary job, employment as guards for caravans,
warehouses, or other people, or any other profitable
situations. There are always strong sword-arms to
be found here, like anywhere else; those from the
Dragon Coast, however, aren’t as choosy over who they
work for or what work they do to earn their pay.
These warriors are suspicious of organized nations and
those who profess loyalty to their home nations, cities,
or towns. There are few people among the Dragon Coast
cities who believe in any causes greater than their own
self-interests and profit. The warriors cynically cannot
believe that anyone could put a government’s interests
above their own and they believe that a group of rulers
would take their interests to heart even less.

undead summoning is like one of the most brutal things you can do. Kelemvor is about the dead resting/being in his domain, rather than forcing them in a dishonorable manner to serve the living. undead are like mutilated corpses which is not really something you'd like to walk around with. hell, call it 'graverobbing', which is like usually a thing punishable by death.

Elven Dictionary wrote:

Elegard Aquilar – ‘Ancient Elven Battle Cry

Anybody know anything about the orgin of this or the novel it is from?

oh, and a thing about Jergal is that he is all for 'honorable' burrial. Kelemvor is the deity of the dead. The better Deity in my opinion is Myrkul, which he was one where you would have people summon undead as 'servants' the difference between him and Kelemvor though is that Myrkul is evil, while Kelemvor is neutral

question what type of musical instruments do elves, particularly moon elves play with the most often? I assume the flute but I am wondering what other instruments exist.

A Question here which will help with a project I'm doing at the moment. Does anyone have much info about the Kingdom of Athalantar? I looked it up on the Forgotten Realms Wiki and all it said was this:

Quote:

Athalantar (also known as the Realm of the Stag) whose capital, Hastarl, stood on the site of the present-day settlement of Secomber, was a small human kingdom in the North.

Any information on this would be great

Uhm.. ruled by the Stag King, of family Aumar, who had several sons. I think those suns ruled several parts of the kingdom? Maybe not. Rural kingdom, I suppose. I think one son hired the Magelords to kill the king's offspring and take over, but he was killed too and the Magelords took control, or something like that. Elminster, of course, was the king's grandson, witnessed a dragon-riding Magelord killing his daddy, and later returned to destroy the Magelords and free the kingdom. It didn't stand for long after he gave up the crown, I believe.

Don't quote me on it, this is just random thoughts I seem to recall from a few years back, when I was reading Elminster: The Making of a Mage.

Circle Magic - What books detail it? What is it?

Casting spells in a circle to increase their power: effects such as increasing caster level or adding metamagic are possible. Used particularly by the witches of Rashmen and Red Wizards of Thay. A circle leader leads the casting, and must be skilled enough. Each participant must also be qualified to take part by certain feats, but that's boring 3e stuff. High Magic is often also a form of Circle Magic, and you those who've taken part in (both elven and non-elven) High Magic or High-Magic-like group rituals haven't had any particular feats; the humans and elves in raising the mythal over Myth Drannor, the dozens of mages of all races who aided Khelben in cleansing the High Moor and undoing the Dark Disaster, etc.

Anyway, Circle Magic is briefly explained in the 3e FRCS. I do not know where/if it's detailed further.

If one were to be researching a viking-themed character, what gods should they look into in the Faerun pantheon, what geographic regions should they be concentrating on, and what books should i be reading?

Any useful background info, book titles.. supplements, anything is super-helpful.

Ruathym is the island of blond sailors, and those Northmen have also landed on Moonshae. In the Savage Frontier and the Icewind Dale, there are northern barbarians (like Wulfgar) of the Uthgar tribes. They obviously worship Uthgardt and one of his animal manifestations. In Narfell, there are the dark-haired Nars barbarians, not Scandinavian in appearance but more interesting, IMO. And Rashemen has a Finno-Ugric thing going, or so I think. (Herkles would disagree, but he's wrong.

) There's also some on the glaciers.

Tempus is the obvious deity for many, too. You really have to pick a region before going into the more in-depth lore, because there's a lot of info. You can get the North and the Savage Frontier for free on Wizards' website. Volo's guide to the North is also good:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/downloads

Okay! Question about Elven bonding. In the Cormanthyr sourcebook it mentions what it -does-, but not how the ritual is actually performed. Can it be bestowed upon another individual just by the elves' own wills, or is there a particular ritual that goes along with it?

snap to it, loremonkies! >_>

I'm fairly sure it's between 2 Elves only, but I don't see why it couldn't happen elsewise. Iron will correct me shortly.

Cormanthyr Sourcebook wrote:

U'Aestar'Kess "One Heart, One Mind, One breath" This ritual provides a creature and an elf with a link, not unlike the one shared among elves in communion. Most often this is used as a marriage rite, forging a bond between spouses, though it is not limited to pairs of elves.

Just doesn't say how it actually happens.

Oh. Well, I'm clueless then, and in the words of the Improv DM Extraordinaire, I say make up something pretty.

Re. the Elven Bond,

The Complete Book of Elves wrote:

Very rarely, an elf will form a mystical and unbreakable bond with another being, whether elf, human, dwarf, or otherwise. Some signify this bonding through the giving of gifts designed to demonstrate one's love. Others merely forge the bond quietly, without any outward signs. Whatever the process through which this bond is formed, the elves involved and their chosen can sense the strong emotions of each other. They feel the joys and sorrows of the other, their triumphs and angers as well. Should distance separate the two in this bond and one pass away, the other can feel the death through the breaking of the bond. This is an even stronger version of the communion ability elves share, for this is a lifelong bond and not lightly broken.

For this one person, elves become truly altruistic. Their lives are focused around making their loved one happy, even to the extent of sacrificing their own life. When this bond is broken, whether through betrayal or death of one of the pair, it is a tremendous shock to the other member of the union. Elves can die from the grief caused by such partings.

Because they can enact this union only once (or twice, in extremely rare cases) in their lives, elves are very careful about those to whom they attach themselves. Many elves go through life without joining their spirits to another, for many find no mates suitable for or deserving of such an important union.

This bond applies, to a lesser extent, to the earth itself. If confined or kept away from the land or the company of other elves for too long a time, an elf can die from grief and loneliness. Even if being held prisoner near nature or with other elves, the elf can lose hope and-without sustaining physical injury-force his or her own death. This is done only in the darkest of times, and only when there is no hope left at all to the elf.

See here for the text.

Once before I found a website on all sorts of elven lore which, as I recall, gave more information on the bond. Cant find it now, though.

Is there an equivalent to the goddess Evening Glory in FR?

who or what does evening glory repersent?

She's the deity of love through death into undeath i.e immortal love, that kind of thing.
She's from the Libris Mortis

well I don't think so. most things that accept undeath are evil and not associted with love. now mind you the FR is a polythiestic world, while everyone has a patron deity,they don't worship just that one diety. The closet I can think of is sune, the goddess of love, and velahsroon, the undead god. wiered combination, but there are good undead such as the bealnorn.

I don't think Evening Glory has a FR counterpart, no.

though, since the FR is a polytheistic world, you could say worship Sune as your patron deity, being the deity of love and all, and Velashroon since he is the necro deity as another highly important deity to your char.

Na, there is nothing even close to Evening Glory in FR. A Sune/Velsharoon worship doesn't make much sense at all. I would say worship one or the other or neither of them. You don't HAVE to worship a deity after all

. I would say a sick/crazy/blind/perverted view of Sunes dogma would make most sense. Velsharoon would make less sense.

o0GuNz_N_RoSeZ0o wrote:

. You don't HAVE to worship a deity after all

.

actually you do have to worship a diety in the FR world, if you are a divine class that is, or if you don't want to be stuck at the wall as a faithless when you died and unable be raised, though this isn't on amia so you can be an atheist cleric/druid on amia even though that isn't part of the FR world.

o0GuNz_N_RoSeZ0o wrote:

A Sune/Velsharoon worship doesn't make much sense at all. I would say a sick/crazy/blind/perverted view of Sunes dogma would make most sense. Velsharoon would make less sense.

It was just an idea I had, though an evil and perverted view of sune's dogma does sound interesting, I was trying to give an idea how to make it possible, but the prevented idea actually sounds a bit better.

Thank you for your feedback. I was thinking of making a character to fit into that style of RP, but without the god I may not ...althogh perverting Sune's views sounds interesting.

IronAngel wrote:

Ruathym is the island of blond sailors, and those Northmen have also landed on Moonshae. In the Savage Frontier and the Icewind Dale, there are northern barbarians (like Wulfgar) of the Uthgar tribes. They obviously worship Uthgardt and one of his animal manifestations. In Narfell, there are the dark-haired Nars barbarians, not Scandinavian in appearance but more interesting, IMO. And Rashemen has a Finno-Ugric thing going, or so I think. (Herkles would disagree, but he's wrong.

) There's also some on the glaciers.

Tempus is the obvious deity for many, too. You really have to pick a region before going into the more in-depth lore, because there's a lot of info. You can get the North and the Savage Frontier for free on Wizards' website. Volo's guide to the North is also good:
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/dnd/downloads

Also sea faring deities likely. Valkur, Talos and Umberlee. Garagaros perhaps for those more choatic pillaging vikings.

Depends on the culture. Uthgar barbarians don't really do much seafaring.

There's nothing wrong with a Sune/Velsharoon combo, by the way. Most people worship any and all deities with influence in their life/environment. In Ed's home campaign, a priestess of Bane was seen in a ritual to both Ilmater and Bane, flogging herself to prevent becoming too proud. There's generally two kinds of worship, appeasement and reverence, but the lines are obviously blurred. The gods are recognized as real and superior, and people generally don't have these silly notions of not being concerned with divine matters. Rebellion against the gods, disdain or indifference towards gods don't really fit the setting at all, they're something the players bring into the game.

Generally, people don't go around Toril looking for a god whose ideals somewhat match your own. They have their set of deities worshipped in their culture and homeland. Even if there's a gnome deity who's a perfect fit for your typical human Heartlander, he's much more likely to worship a variety of local human gods and pick one or several of them as his patron, possibly misunderstanding their dogma a great deal. Worshipping gods doesn't mean approving their dogmas, it means recognizing their tangible power over your every-day life and treating them with due respect. Even if Umberlee is a vile bitch, you don't go around mocking her and giving her the finger. Nope, she's a goddess who's indefinitely superior to you in every way, so you submit to her power and offer that prayer and maybe a coin or two before attempting a long trip at sea.

What is the pantheon worshipped by those who live on Wiltun? I know they have the whole jarldom setup dealy and I've gone and learnt the history, had a little adventure but there's no real religious presence in the fortress - not even a battle chapel. So.. whose their deity?

IronAngel wrote:

Even if Umberlee is a vile bitch, you don't go around mocking her and giving her the finger. Nope, she's a goddess who's indefinitely superior to you in every way, so you submit to her power and offer that prayer and maybe a coin or two before attempting a long trip at sea.

Alternatively, you can give her the finger and pray to Istishia and Selune!

-----------------------------------------------------------------

I understand that it's not odd for people to worship a number of deitys of influence in a PnP campaign. On Amia though, a ton of deity's hold influence, dare I say, to an unrealistic degree when compared to PnP. That why I think it makes less sense to worship Sune and Velsharoon. Thats just my opinion though ::shrug::

And yeah, if you're a divine class, of course you have to have a deity, but again, you don't HAVE to worship anyone in FR because you don't HAVE to be a divine class. And also, you actually do have to have a deity you worship to be a Cleric or Druid on Amia. If you don't worship one, you don't receive your spells, just like in PnP.

But this is the lore thread. Of course you don't "have" to worship a deity, but practically everyone else but you does worship several deities. You don't have to play according to Faerûnian standards, but not doing so begs the question: why to role-play Forgotten Realms in the first place?

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