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Arcadence
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 16:10 PM 

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Anubis wrote:
On a sneak with 10 STR, I am debating whether to take weapon spec or IKD (Take note, I wont be taking EWS either way), and also debating on Epic hide or skill mastery. I will end up with 90 or more hide with epic hide, that's not including the +15 cloak, which I don't really use, instead I get more AC, since most spotters, if dedicated will see me anyway. Suggestions, please?


+2 damage to your likely 1d6, or the ability to push over anything, granting bonus AB and adding your 15d6 (or a lot less if you aren't pure rogue w/e) to your damage rolls?

A lot of people doing the whole spot thing are likely wearing a ton of spot only gear to do it. That likely also applies to happening only at certain times as well. You'll want ESF Hide/MS to plow over the people who go ESF spot and aren't wearing their special set.

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 16:31 PM 

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Yeah, IKD is superior, which was quite obivous, I must have been having a dumb moment when I thought there was competitiom between the two. :P

As for epic MS, I did that on another character, I found it to be quite a mistake, because nearly nobody uses listen, I found that more people could spot me than who could hear me. Listen is also easier to boost - so anyone with listen, especially a bard will max or near max their listen rather easily. I can live with 80 - 85 hide and 70 odd MS tbh if I turn to take Skill mastery.

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maglorine
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 16:35 PM 

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Dex based Monk/WM/Ftr whos still a lowbie at the moment. I've built it two ways which are largely the same from an RP and theme perspective but there are some functional differences as follows:

First one has Armorskin and ESF Discipline.

Second one has +1 BAB, +3 Fort, +1 Reflex, + 1 Attack per Round compared to the first one but has neither of the feats included in the first.

For reference he'll have about 65 AC in the second version, unhasted.

I'm a bit torn but leaning to the second version.

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Vaul Tarrith
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 17:25 PM 

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If Version 2 has a 65AC unhasted and +1 AB AND +1 APR...call Version 1 a 'learning device', crumple it up, and throw it away. :twisted:

I'd also be willing to bet you could find a way to get ESF: Discipline into Version 2, but w/o seeing the build it's hard to say.


Last edited by Vaul Tarrith on Fri, Oct 21 2011, 17:27 PM, edited 1 time in total.

 
      
PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 17:26 PM 

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Anubis wrote:
Yeah, IKD is superior, which was quite obivous, I must have been having a dumb moment when I thought there was competitiom between the two. :P

As for epic MS, I did that on another character, I found it to be quite a mistake, because nearly nobody uses listen, I found that more people could spot me than who could hear me. Listen is also easier to boost - so anyone with listen, especially a bard will max or near max their listen rather easily. I can live with 80 - 85 hide and 70 odd MS tbh if I turn to take Skill mastery.

The better question is why you're not taking EWS? :P

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 17:34 PM 

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I thought the extra two AB from EWF may have been more worth while. Would you say the extra 4 dmg is better?

I myself am not sure, but if you can't hit anything what's the use in having such damage? Heh. But, not that EWF will make my AB super high or anything, maybe the dmg is more worth it the more I think about it.


EDIT: 43 AB with a single weapon with EWF, 41 dual wielding. As opposed to 41 single, 39 dual.

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PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 17:47 PM 

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The extra AB tends to be more useful, but... in another manner of question, why can't you fit both? What's your epic feat choices looking like?

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 17:49 PM 

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Great Dex I, Armour Skin, Epic Dodge, Epic Hide, EWF. That's the original I planned.

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-Cloak-and-Dagger-
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 17:50 PM 

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I don't think you need Armour Skin. Your AC is obscene enough as is. And with Epic Dodge, too?


 
      
Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 17:55 PM 

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Maybe you're right, 47 AC, or 52 with a large shield +4 is good. But I like my extra AC alot. :/ it's a tough one to let go for me.

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PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 18:49 PM 

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Hrm. What's your overall build?

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 18:51 PM 

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Rogue13/fighter7/10SD.

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PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 18:53 PM 

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If you're not far enough leveling yet, Rogue 16/Fighter 4/ SD 10 would be better if you have no intention of picking up EWS.

Though, you should have six epic feats, looking at that build... 6 Fighter feat, 13 Rogue feat, 4 generals. How come you only have five?

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 18:59 PM 

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All fighter levels, except 7th were taken pre-epic. I think that is why there's only 5 feats in epic. I have the classes and levels wizard up in Leto from when I created and saved the character offline and it's only showing those five feats (Besides the automatic free feats from Rogue and SD ofcourse).

Also, I wanted to be that many fighter for 4 attacks per round, but I suppose I can compromise if that is better. The character is only lvl 8 atm after all.

I could infact leave the 7th fighter lvl and go 11 SD, just because I can. I think, anyway.

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PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 19:00 PM 

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8 Rogue/4 Fighter/8 SD pre-epic gives you four attacks per round. :D

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 19:03 PM 

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It does? I could have sworn it took 6. I must be going crazy or something. Guess I should re-do my build to fit that then.

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Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 19:12 PM 

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Thank you, you were right! So is it rogue/fighter/SD 8/4/8 pre-epic, then SD/Rogue 2/8 Epic? I suppose I can deal with a late Crippling strike for HIPS earlier. :)

EDIT: I think I worked it out now, thanks for zhe help.

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Last edited by Herr Delta Houdini on Fri, Oct 21 2011, 19:20 PM, edited 1 time in total.

 
      
PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 19:20 PM 

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That's correct!

...though Crippling Strike is overrated. :?

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Lord Jarski
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 19:29 PM 



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Quick question:

Your paladin/blackguard/cleric level determines how big of a bonus you get from your Charisma when using Divine Shield&Might.

Do the levels affect the duration aswell?

Like if you have a level 3 blackguard with 20 charisma, do you get +3 AC/dmg for full 5 rounds or just 3 rounds?


 
      
Herr Delta Houdini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 19:32 PM 

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Full five rounds, I believe.

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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 19:47 PM 

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Aye, five rounds.

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Lord Jarski
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 19:49 PM 



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Awesome, thanks.


 
      
Zamtrack
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 20:03 PM 

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So my sneaky Assassin build has no room for HiPs. (Which isn't necessarily an awful thing.) I'm certain this is the best thread for this question.

I need corner sneaking/sneaking without HiPs tips.
Such as, how far around a corner do I need to wrap around, how far behind me do I need to keep a monster/opponent, etc.


 
      
PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 20:07 PM 

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Honestly, it's hard to give tips, because the objects you're able to break line of sight with can be very inconsistent and sometimes make little sense at all. Likewise, some large objects you'd think you would break line of sight with don't work at all.

I suggest just learning from experience. You'll get the feel for it after a little while.

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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 23:02 PM 

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Since I'm bored and lurking the forum 24/7 (since I cant play), I will post an assassin build.

Rogue 3/Fighter 8/Assassin 19

Name: -
Race: Air Genasi
Diety: Mask
Alignment: CE

Str: 12
Dex: 18 - 28
Con: 12
Int: 14 - 16
Wis: 8 - 6
Cha: 8 - 6

AB: 44 (42 dual wielding with +5 weapons)
AC: 56 (with haste, dual wielding)
DO: 1d4 basic, +1d6 elemental, +1d8 flame scroll, +6 ews, +2 str, +14d6 sneak, DC-38 save vs. death

Skills (239):
Hide 33
Tumble 30
Search 20
Set Trap 20
Appraise 12
Open Lock 1
Discipline 32
Pick Pocket 1
Disable Trap 25
Move Silently 33
Use Magic Device 32

1 R - Feats: Luck of Heroes, Toughness, Sneak +1d6
2 R - Evasion
3 F - Feats: Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus: Dagger
4 F - Feat: Ambidexterity, Dex: 21
5 R - Sneak +2d6, Skill dump
6 A - Feat: Two-weapon Fighting, Sneak +3d6
7 A
8 A - Sneak +4d6, Dex: 22, 2nd Attack
9 A - Feat: Great Fortitude
10 A - Sneak +5d6
11 A
12 A - Feat: Improved Two-weapon Fighting, Sneak +6d6, Dex: 23
13 A
14 A - Sneak +7d6
15 A - Feat: Improved Critical, 3rd Attack
16 F - Dex: 24
17 F - Feat: Weapon Specialization
18 F - Feat: Blindfight
19 F - Feat: Improved Initiative
20 F - Dex: 25, 4th Attack
21 A - Feat: Epic Weapon Focus, Sneak +8d6
22 A
23 A - Sneak +9d6
24 A - Feats: Improved Sneak Attack, Armor Skin, Dex: 26
25 A - Sneak +11d6
26 A
27 A - Feat: Great Dex I, Sneak +12d6
28 A - Feat: Improved Sneak Attack, Dex: 28
29 F - Feat: Epic Weapon Specialization
30 A - Feat: Epic Discipline, Sneak +14d6

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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 23:05 PM 

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And for you AA's out there, I made a Master Scout version.

Bard 6/Master Scout 5/Arcane Archer 19

Name: -
Race: Moonelf
Deity:

Str: 12
Dex: 20 - 28
Con: 12
Int: 14
Wis: 8
Cha: 8

AB: 56 (+5 bow)
AC: 57 (60 with mage armor, dodge feat and dusty rose ioun stone + epics)
DO: 1d8, +2d8/2d10 special arrow, +10 aa, +5 mighty, +1 favored

Fort: 39 (all are with bard song)
Ref : 42
Will: 19

Skills (198):
UMD 21
Spot 32 (+2) ~ 46 (without gear)
Tumble 30
Search 2 (4)
Perform 13
Appraise 31
Set Trap 2 (4) ~ 47 (enough for deadly traps)
Spellcraft 23
Discipline 33
Craft Trap 2
Pick Pocket 3


1 B - Feat: Skill Focus: Spot
2 B
3 B - Feat: Skill Focus: Listen
4 B - Dex: 21
5 B - Skill requirement for Master Scout
6 M - C.Feat: Favored Enemy: Humans, Feat: Point Blank Shot
7 M
8 M - Dex: 22
9 M - Feat: Weapon Focus: Longbow
10 A
11 A
12 A - Feat: Rapid Shot, Dex: 23
13 A
14 A
15 A - Feat: Improved Critical: Longbow
16 A - Dex: 24
17 A
18 A - Feat: Blindfight
19 A
20 B - Dex: 25
21 A - Feat: Epic Fortitude
22 A
23 A
24 A - Feats: Armor Skin, Epic Weapon Focus: Longbow, Dex: 26
25 A
26 A
27 A - Feat: Epic Skill Focus: Spot
28 A - Feat: Great Dex I, Dex: 28
29 A - +10 Arrows, Skill dump
30 M - C.Feat: Master Scout Special?? (pick something), Feat: Epic Prowess, Skill dump

Edit: Could ditch epic fort and grab Great Dex II and III (the latter from the MS feat at 30), or pick epic discipline!!

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Last edited by Ulir on Fri, Oct 21 2011, 23:14 PM, edited 1 time in total.

 
      
-Cloak-and-Dagger-
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 23:06 PM 

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Why not use the new Assasssin feats and take Epic Dodge?


 
      
Ulir
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 23:07 PM 

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I made it before the changes. Easy to swap the feats around for epic dodge.

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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 23:26 PM 

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A shifter with all shapes.

Druid 5/Divine Champion 6/Shifter 19

Race: Ffolk
Diety:
Alignment:

Str: 11 - 10
Dex: 8
Con: 11 - 12
Int: 15 - 14
Wis: 18 - 30
Cha: 8

1 D - Feats: Alertness, Luck of Heroes
2 D
3 D - Feat: Weapon Focus: Staff
4 D - Wis: 20
5 D
6 S - Feat: Knockdown
7 S
8 S - Wis: 21
9 S - Feat: Expertise
10 S
11 S
12 S - Feat: Great Fortitude, Wis: 22
13 S
14 S
15 S - Feat: Blindfight
16 DC - Wis: 23
17 DC - Feat: Improved Knockdown
18 DC - Feat: Improved Critical: Unarmed
19 DC - Feat: Improved Expertise
20 DC - Wis: 24
21 S - Feat: Great Wisdom I
22 S
23 S - Feat: Outsider Shape
24 S - Feat: Great Wis II, Wis: 27
25 S
26 S - Feat: Undead Shape
27 S - Feat: Great Wis III
28 S - Wis: 29
29 DC - Feat: Great Wis IV (30)
30 S - Feats: Construct Shape, Dragonshape

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Bini
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 23:36 PM 

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Ulir wrote:
Feat: Weapon Focus: Staff


:P

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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Fri, Oct 21 2011, 23:45 PM 

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Oh yeah :lol:

Well, you need weapon focus in something to get divine champ, and the only weapon that is available for druids that also is used in one of the shapes is the staff (Rakshasa).

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TormakSaber
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 0:38 AM 

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Except it doesn't work because Magic Staff doesn't equal Quarterstaff. :(

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-Cloak-and-Dagger-
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 0:42 AM 

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Ulir wrote:
Oh yeah :lol:

Well, you need weapon focus in something to get divine champ, and the only weapon that is available for druids that also is used in one of the shapes is the staff (Rakshasa).


Doesnt a Drider use a spear?


 
      
Ulir
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 0:45 AM 

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TormakSaber wrote:
Except it doesn't work because Magic Staff doesn't equal Quarterstaff. :(


I'll be damned.

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Ulir
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 0:46 AM 

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-Cloak-and-Dagger- wrote:
Ulir wrote:
Oh yeah :lol:

Well, you need weapon focus in something to get divine champ, and the only weapon that is available for druids that also is used in one of the shapes is the staff (Rakshasa).


Doesnt a Drider use a spear?


It uses a halberd.

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TormakSaber
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 0:58 AM 

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Both correct! Spear pre epic, halberd in epic.

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MoshingChris
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 3:24 AM 

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What the hell is it with you people and expertise. . .

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HellScourge
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 17:11 PM 

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I am curious if there is a list with the various new domains and what spells/ability they offer.

I also can't seem to see the new domains on character creation, all I get are the standard ones.

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PaladinOfSune
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 17:17 PM 

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Have you looked at the sidebar under Classes and Feats? :P

You can't see the domains on character creation, the hak isn't loaded until log in. It's just how NWN works.

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Selmak
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 18:04 PM 

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MoshingChris wrote:
What the hell is it with you people and expertise. . .


It's your sig, they're assuming the worst. :D


 
      
HellScourge
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 18:04 PM 

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Oooohhh!

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Thani
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 18:04 PM 

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Okay so I'm basicly making a Shadow Adept. Was thinking Wiz 24, getting two epic feats, then SD 6 where I dump all the skillpoints I've saved since level 1. Seems allright or what?

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--Phantom--
 
PostPosted: Sat, Oct 22 2011, 18:37 PM 



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Zamtrack wrote:
So my sneaky Assassin build has no room for HiPs. (Which isn't necessarily an awful thing.) I'm certain this is the best thread for this question.

I need corner sneaking/sneaking without HiPs tips.
Such as, how far around a corner do I need to wrap around, how far behind me do I need to keep a monster/opponent, etc.


The golden rule with corner sneaking is fairly simple. If you run behind something and the person you want to hide from goes transparent, that means you've broken line of sight. Also, darkness (the spell) is invaluable. If they don't have ultravision, you drop a darkness scroll and enjoy several rounds of HiPS.

Thani wrote:
Okay so I'm basicly making a Shadow Adept. Was thinking Wiz 24, getting two epic feats, then SD 6 where I dump all the skillpoints I've saved since level 1. Seems allright or what?


Consider going Wizard 23/SD 6/Ranger 1 for Discipline and an Epic Spell Focus. There are worse classes than Ranger to fit that concept, as well.


 
      
DerkDerkistan
 
PostPosted: Sun, Oct 23 2011, 2:55 AM 

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Do note that in order to really be a Shadow Adept, you need a request to use the Shadow Weave.

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Thani
 
PostPosted: Sun, Oct 23 2011, 17:27 PM 

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Could anyone calculate the number of feats total I would have with the build or atleast show me how to do it myself? And I didnt know there would be a request for it. I thought I'd woship Shar or pay a peice of my mind so to say.

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Dergaii
 
PostPosted: Sun, Oct 23 2011, 17:32 PM 

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Thani wrote:
Could anyone calculate the number of feats total I would have with the build or atleast show me how to do it myself? And I didnt know there would be a request for it. I thought I'd woship Shar or pay a peice of my mind so to say.


One every three levels: that makes 11 at level thirty
One for every 5 wizard levels: that makes 4
And one for epic wizard: to add 1

Making a total of 16 feats unless I'm wrong, which happens fairly regular.


 
      
Naivatkal
 
PostPosted: Sun, Oct 23 2011, 20:49 PM 

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Couple questions regarding Geared EMD:

Should GMW and flame weapon for on it? I know you can cast them on certain summons, but wasn't sure about this one. I -think- I read you can flame a summon's natural weapons.

Should the Geared only have a base three APR? I noticed this and was curious. I figure if so, it's cause of how powerful it already is.

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MoshingChris
 
PostPosted: Sun, Oct 23 2011, 20:52 PM 

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Constructs work of a Base AB of .75 not 1

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Naivatkal
 
PostPosted: Sun, Oct 23 2011, 20:54 PM 

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Ah ha! So yeah it's a balancing thing. I didn't even think to check a sourcebook XD

Thanks, though what about the flame weap/GMW?

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Poorsod
 
PostPosted: Mon, Oct 24 2011, 10:19 AM 



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Hey folks! I was thinking of a SD build that has the Epic Shadowlord feat, and here's what I came up with:

Human
14 STR
18 DEX (26)
10 CON
14 INT
8 WIS
8 CHA

Rogue 11 / Fighter 6 / Shadowdancer 13

Before epic: 8 rogue/8 SD/4 fighter
Feats (3 of which are Fighter boni): Point Blank Shot, Rapid Reload, Dodge, Mobility, Weapon Focus: Heavy Crossbow, Blind-fight, Called Shot, Improved Critical, Weapon Specialisation, Weapon Finesse, Stealthy

Epic: 5 SD/2 Fighter/3 Rogue
Feats: Epic Weapon focus, Great DEX 1, Epic Shadowlord (SD bonus feat), Epic Dodge, Epic Weapon Spec., Epic Skill focus Hide+Move Silently

...and yes, this chap will be using a crossbow. Not sure how silly of a choice that is, but they look cool at least! Though, I also took Weapon Finesse, just in case (even though he has HiPS).

Sneak attack will be 6d6 - and there's two ways to get it higher; either dropping the idea of getting the epic Shade, or dropping the fighter levels. I don't like either of the ideas!

And, uh... Called shot? Is it any good? <.<


 
      
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