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PaladinOfSune
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 Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 16:08 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Same thing, more or less. I just put in the equivalent of a +5 AB/+4 enhancement/1d10 damage weapon.
_________________  "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 16:23 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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PaladinOfSune wrote: Same thing, more or less. I just put in the equivalent of a +5 AB/+4 enhancement/1d10 damage weapon. But what's the difference between trueforged and warfoged? Which is the keen version?
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Remal
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 16:38 PM |
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Player
Joined: 12 Feb 2011
Location: Elsewhen
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Very_Svensk wrote: PaladinOfSune wrote: Same thing, more or less. I just put in the equivalent of a +5 AB/+4 enhancement/1d10 damage weapon. But what's the difference between trueforged and warfoged? Which is the keen version? Both are. Trueforged is keen and +1d10 physical damage. With sureforged (+5 ab, +1d10 damage), it's for one handed weapons. I believe all weapons with large crit range as scimitars or kukris are now sureforged only (requiring perfect mythal), but I could be wrong. Warforged are keen, +2d6 physical damage and xd6 massive criticals (2 or 3, depending on weapon's crit range). It's for two handed weapons only.
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 17:48 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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Depending on weapons crirange? The higher multiplier, the lower massive crit?
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Remal
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 17:54 PM |
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Player
Joined: 12 Feb 2011
Location: Elsewhen
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Very_Svensk wrote: Depending on weapons crirange? The higher multiplier, the lower massive crit? 19-20x2 base range is 2d6. 20x3 base range is 3d6. I'm not aware of two handed weapons with 18-20x2 crit range. Also, I know that two-handed flail gets +2d8 physical damage instead of +2d6 (guess it's because it does less base damage then greataxe and greatsword). I think it's similar for other "weaker weapons" like quarterstaff, but can't confirm it.
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 18:01 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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What? Only 2d6 (and 2d8) ?
One handers get 1d10? Should they not also get 1d10?
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 18:02 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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2d6 is higher than 1d10. Think about the maths.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 18:04 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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PaladinOfSune wrote: 2d6 is higher than 1d10. Think about the maths. I fucking hate the d6 system. 6d2 is not the same as 2d6, and all manner of weird things. 2d6 = 2-12 2d8 = 2-16 ?
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slkNihilus
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 19:23 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2008
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Pretty much, yes. The system isn't hard: once you see a number in front of "d6" it means you roll that number of six-sided die. Thus #d6 means you have a minimum damage of # and a maximum of # times 6.
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 19:30 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Consider each roll to be a separate distribution. Then find the expected value of each distribution and multiply by the number of rolls to get your mean. You can also figure out a variance. Some weapons do more damage on average but have a higher variance so arent as reliable if you need 10s more often than you need 15s sometimes and 5's another. (if facing DR etc)
_________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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Casvenx
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 20:00 PM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Feb 2013
Location: Badlands of 'Murika
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With the Quarterstaff Monk build... Does the quarterstaff receive STR x 1.5 (for a two handed weapon), AND off hand weapon attacks? Or is it counting as a double weapon?
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slkNihilus
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 20:14 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2008
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Quarterstaves receive 1.5 x STR. They're not double weapons so no off-hand attacks.
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Gobbledygook
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 21:17 PM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Sep 2011
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Casvenx wrote: With the Quarterstaff Monk build... Does the quarterstaff receive STR x 1.5 (for a two handed weapon), AND off hand weapon attacks? Or is it counting as a double weapon? What slk said. But it does get all of the usual unarmed attacks, and flurry can be used with it. So that's like 6 +1 +1, 8 attacks total? Still 1 better than a double-sided weapon which gets 4+2+1.
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bambootoothpick
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 21:41 PM |
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Joined: 01 May 2010
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I've seen this mentioned a few places incorrectly. Mindblank from a potion cannot be dispelled because potions cannot be dispelled because they are not considered spells. Anyone using mindblank against flayers will notice their constant greater dispelling has no effect.
Also regarding the Mummy Dust summons. Mummy dust is better in a number of ways than the 9th lvl summon/gate spells. One of the reasons it's an epic feat that lots of people take. A few people like to say that the summons are all about the same but I have to say the air elemental should be reskinned to a fart cloud and put alignment restrictions to evil necros only. *face punch*
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 21:48 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Are you saying that's why Mindblank isn't dispelled? Because that's false. Potions/scrolls/items with spells used by PCs with zero caster levels instead use the character level to determine their caster level when it comes to dispelling. Thus, a level 24 Fighter/WM is immune to dispels on their Mindblank potions from the Mindflayers. On the other hand, a level 24 13 Fighter/1 Bard/10 RDD has a caster level of 1, meaning those dispels will completely destroy their potion buffs.
You're welcome to try it yourself to see what happens.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Casvenx
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 22:01 PM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Feb 2013
Location: Badlands of 'Murika
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PaladinOfSune wrote: Are you saying that's why Mindblank isn't dispelled? Because that's false. Potions/scrolls/items with spells used by PCs with zero caster levels instead use the character level to determine their caster level when it comes to dispelling. Thus, a level 24 Fighter/WM is immune to dispels on their Mindblank potions from the Mindflayers. On the other hand, a level 24 13 Fighter/1 Bard/10 RDD has a caster level of 1, meaning those dispels will completely destroy their potion buffs.
You're welcome to try it yourself to see what happens. I've seen this mentioned a few times recently and would like some clarification. The standard spellcaster classes make sense (sorc/wiz/cleric/druid)... but what about rangers and paladins? Or assassins (and any others that only get a few spells)? _________________
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Mon, Apr 15 2013, 22:01 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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If the class has spell slots, then they're considered a caster. So yeah, rangers and paladins. Assassins have no spell slots, so they aren't.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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treant13
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Posted: Tue, Apr 16 2013, 0:15 AM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Oct 2012
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What about shifters is it caster level 5 only because of the druid, or is it 25 for us dedicated shifters?
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Lyle Underburrow...I would watch where you step when he's around, you might go boom
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Tue, Apr 16 2013, 0:15 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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5, Shifter has no spell slots, ergo is not considered a caster.
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MoshingChris
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Posted: Wed, Apr 17 2013, 5:48 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Location: Down South and Bent Edge
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bambootoothpick wrote:
Also regarding the Mummy Dust summons. Mummy dust is better in a number of ways than the 9th lvl summon/gate spells. One of the reasons it's an epic feat that lots of people take. A few people like to say that the summons are all about the same but I have to say the air elemental should be reskinned to a fart cloud and put alignment restrictions to evil necros only. *face punch*
I've been doing a revision of summons since the start of the year, but it's being held up by real life. I'm not sure what you are suggesting with regards to the Air Elemental as it has been revised and tested and is well within range of all the other Dust summons (at least numerically speaking).
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Socially and recently politically Inept Knight of Xymor
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Wed, Apr 17 2013, 13:45 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Yep, speaking as someone who has used the Air Elemental summon for over two years, it's pretty damn good now.
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 7:12 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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PaladinOfSune wrote: Yep, speaking as someone who has used the Air Elemental summon for over two years, it's pretty damn good now. What if you compare it to the others?
I like the air elemental and the golem because of the survivability. This includes the Pharaoe sentinel.
The others have hefty damage but are so squishy they don't even last two packs of monsters.
I know what i would choose if i had one summon that did 4000 damage for 5 packs, or 400 damage for 50-500 packs.
My point? Air elemental is good because it survives. But its damage is pretty pitiful.
The outsider need to be looked at now instead
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psycho
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 7:45 AM |
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Player
Joined: 27 Sep 2010
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If the Summon's damage is pitiful, it'll take longer to defeat monsters, thus, it will have to fight longer, thus reducing it's surviveability.
I've tried almost all Summons and quite honestly they're all good in their own way.
But yeah, somehow I dislike the Air Elemental one, even with the new changes.
The "low" statistic it has which I don't want to give out for spoilers is just plain too low!
As for the Outsiders, they're -far- from squishy IMO.
One of them has near 60 AC buffed.
Just because you can't just throw them at packs in the Abyss, stand there and do nothing, and hope for them to survive doesn't mean they're weak.
Only thing i'd personnally change about them is raise all the Mummy Dust's general AB a little, but that's me.
It find it a bit dissapointing the summons with the highest AB aren't even equivalent to pure -rogues- characters.
Perhaps reducing a little regen or DR to compensate.
EDIT: Oh, and something not too many people know about is that the level 27 Gate Summons are actually -stronger- than the Mummy Dust summons by a fair margin. Though they're short-lived so it makes them more situational. It's no secret though.
In all honesty we can't reallty criticize the summons, as they're stronger than every other single RP server i've tried.
Last edited by psycho on Thu, Apr 18 2013, 8:00 AM, edited 5 times in total.
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DerkDerkistan
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 7:51 AM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Earth
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Svensk doesn't know what he's talking about. The Outsiders are fine.
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Mobile_Svensk
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 9:36 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Location: Awarded most Confused Git of 2014!
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Okay.
I can throw the Golem, Elemental and the mummy at abyssal packs but not the outsider.
Either the other three are to beefy or the last one is to squishy
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DerkDerkistan
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 10:58 AM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Earth
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I'm not sure how this topic steered from "choose the summon that fits your character best" to "which ones can I take to the abyss?"
Also, elemental and construct aside, you're not taking the mummy to the abyss because it falls to pieces as soon as a Hellwench casts Mass Heal.
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Tyris
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 14:12 PM |
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Player
Joined: 05 Mar 2013
Location: Amana, IA USA
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Am looking for recommendations for starting stats for a bard, who's primary functions would be"
1: Song
2: Buffing
3: Melee\ranged
Issue one is I'd like him to be a dwarf and not sure how to overcome the -2 charisma penality. Open to a subrace if need be to smooth out the rough edges. I'm toying with 24Bard\6Shadowdancer or someone recommended Knight Commander in place Shadowdancer, I'm fairly new here so have not played the Commander class, but it looks very interesting.
Your inspiration is welcome.
Thanks, Dan
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 14:45 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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DerkDerkistan wrote: I'm not sure how this topic steered from "choose the summon that fits your character best" to "which ones can I take to the abyss?" Exactly. The EMD summons are not made so you can tank everything. Yeah, I was surprised when my full mage could solo the Abyss with his Geared Guardian and my spellsword died on the first/second spawn with his fully buffed self/Arcadian/panther (though I believe there were more than a couple Deadeyes in that group lol). Just made me re-evaluate things. Solution? I don't solo the Abyss (usually don't anyways, it's a PITA even with my mage though my monk/rogue does nicely). EMD summons are not supposed to let you just steamroll every area, stop thinking that people.
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Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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GreatPigeon
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 15:52 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 May 2009
Location: London, UK
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Tyris wrote: Am looking for recommendations for starting stats for a bard, who's primary functions would be"
1: Song
2: Buffing
3: Melee\ranged
Issue one is I'd like him to be a dwarf and not sure how to overcome the -2 charisma penality. Open to a subrace if need be to smooth out the rough edges. I'm toying with 24Bard\6Shadowdancer or someone recommended Knight Commander in place Shadowdancer, I'm fairly new here so have not played the Commander class, but it looks very interesting.
Your inspiration is welcome.
Thanks, Dan 25/5 is the KC Bard! You can overcome the charisma deficiency just fine. You just aim for 16 base cha instead of the 18 that I prefer or lose another bit of ab, whichever you like. _________________ The Peacock wrote: [GreatPigeon] is better than me. Uncle-Opustus wrote: Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
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serbiris
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 16:58 PM |
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Player
Joined: 14 Sep 2010
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Go for Gold (dwarf subtype)!
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@Thanatopsis#6293
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 17:10 PM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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Dad's da daulk yo. Plenty of ways to go, even Bard30 is really good.
_________________  UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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bobofwestoregonusa
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 18:26 PM |
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Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2012
Location: Eastern Washington
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So, I decided not to take the usual Fighter/Bard/DC method for a fighter-ish bard and went Dev Crit bard instead. Tell me what you think!
STR 18 (26)
DEX 8
CON 8
INT 12
WIS 8
CHA 16
1 – Bard 1 Extra music, Blind Fight
2 – Fighter 1 Weapon Focus: (Weapon of choice)
3 – Fighter 2 Power attack, Cleave
4 – Fighter 3 +1 STR
5 – Fighter 4 Weapon Specialization (Weapon of choice)
6 – Bard 2 Curse Song
7 – Bard 3
8 – Bard 4 +1 STR
9 – Bard 5 Extend spell
10 – Bard 6
11 – Bard 7
12 – Bard 8 Improved Critical: (Weapon of choice), +1 STR
13 – Bard 9 Maximize Spell
14 – Bard 10
15 – Bard 11
16 – Bard 12 +1 STR
17 – Bard 13
18 – Bard 14 Great Cleave
19 – Bard 15
20 – Bard 16 +1 STR
21 – Bard 17 Epic Weapon Focus (Weapon of Choice)
22 – Bard 18
23 – Bard 19
24 – Bard 20 Overwhelming Critical +1 STR
25 – Bard 21
26 – Bard 22
27 – Bard 23 Lasting Inspiration, Great Strength I
28 – Bard 24 +1 STR
29 – Bard 25
30 – Bard 26 Devastating Critical, Epic Skill Focus: Perform
_________________  Gerald EdmundDiscord: Metal Viking Guy #5433 DC taxation is theft!
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slkNihilus
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 18:36 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2008
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That 8 Con will bite you in the ass quite a bit. Your unbuffed HP will be 106 and fully buffed you'll barely hit 286. Sure song adds some temporary HP to that but you'll still be rather squishy. I know it's cheesy, but adding 4 levels of DD in the mix (and putting some of that Str into Con) would do wonders for the build.
Also, I'd ditch ESF: Perform for ESF: Discipline or Epic Fortitude.
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bobofwestoregonusa
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 19:08 PM |
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Player
Joined: 09 Jun 2012
Location: Eastern Washington
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No can do on the ESF: Perform. I need a 75 base perform for the +6 AC and -6AC granted from Bard Song and Curse Song respectively. That makes for a good +8AC and AB all together in any fight warrenting use of both abilities.
Though I suppose I could take it if it were possible to get that high without it. But as is I would need to mythal four items with +5 perform just to break even. The extra discipline would be nice if I could afford to take it, though bard song also gives a nice skill boost.
Also, I'm both not sure if I could or want to fit RDD in there.
_________________ Gerald EdmundDiscord: Metal Viking Guy #5433 DC taxation is theft!
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slkNihilus
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 19:30 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2008
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You can get to 75 without ESF. Not gonna be a fun time gearing up your char, but it's doable.
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wolfurt
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 19:33 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Location: equestria ;]
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slkNihilus wrote: You can get to 75 without ESF. Not gonna be a fun time gearing up your char, but it's doable. I'm pretty sure there is an epic perform item somewhere, though.
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 19:43 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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There are gloves alone which give +10 Perform, which are purchasable. They help a lot.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Uncle-Opustus
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 19:50 PM |
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Player
Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Location: Finland
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bobofwestoregonusa wrote: So, I decided not to take the usual Fighter/Bard/DC method for a fighter-ish bard and went Dev Crit bard instead. Tell me what you think!
STR 18 (26)
DEX 8
CON 8
INT 12
WIS 8
CHA 16
1 – Bard 1 Extra music, Blind Fight
2 – Fighter 1 Weapon Focus: (Weapon of choice)
3 – Fighter 2 Power attack, Cleave
4 – Fighter 3 +1 STR
5 – Fighter 4 Weapon Specialization (Weapon of choice)
6 – Bard 2 Curse Song
7 – Bard 3
8 – Bard 4 +1 STR
9 – Bard 5 Extend spell
10 – Bard 6
11 – Bard 7
12 – Bard 8 Improved Critical: (Weapon of choice), +1 STR
13 – Bard 9 Maximize Spell
14 – Bard 10
15 – Bard 11
16 – Bard 12 +1 STR
17 – Bard 13
18 – Bard 14 Great Cleave
19 – Bard 15
20 – Bard 16 +1 STR
21 – Bard 17 Epic Weapon Focus (Weapon of Choice)
22 – Bard 18
23 – Bard 19
24 – Bard 20 Overwhelming Critical +1 STR
25 – Bard 21
26 – Bard 22
27 – Bard 23 Lasting Inspiration, Great Strength I
28 – Bard 24 +1 STR
29 – Bard 25
30 – Bard 26 Devastating Critical, Epic Skill Focus: Perform You don't really need Extra Music. You could go Bard25/Fighter4/DC1 and grab yourself Dev, EWS, Spot -and- the fourth attack per round. You will fall on odd STR, but I think it's worth the Dev. If you don't fancy the idea, there's always the safe and sturdy Bard26/Fighter2/DC2 which Uce used to play, too. +2 damage is probably better, though. And yes, maxing skills as a bard is silly easy and the commonplace equipment found in several places makes upping Perform to 75 a piece of cake. _________________ UCE THIS, YOU COW.
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wolfurt
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 23:17 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
Location: equestria ;]
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If a mage with 24+ caster levels buffs someone with 2 caster levels (say, an AA), which CL goes against dispel checks?
Edited to clarify.
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Thu, Apr 18 2013, 23:28 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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The mage's since they cast the spells.
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 0:13 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Yup.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Casvenx
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 9:02 AM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Feb 2013
Location: Badlands of 'Murika
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I am currently building/playing a Master Scout... I'm used to playing sneaks and such, but are there any suggestions or tips for the class that might not be obvious from the small write up on it?
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Aeqvinox
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 15:43 PM |
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Player
Joined: 30 Aug 2011
Location: Underdark
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Take the 5'th level in epics to open up a better bonus feat list, but 1-4 take in pre-epic for better saves.
Use traps.
Dash stacks with stuff.
Apart from that, you'd have to say what your other class(es) are if you want more hints.
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Tyris
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 16:38 PM |
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Player
Joined: 05 Mar 2013
Location: Amana, IA USA
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How is the DC of an Arcane Archer's Arrow of Death figured or is it static?
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Aeqvinox
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 18:29 PM |
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Player
Joined: 30 Aug 2011
Location: Underdark
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Flat DC 20 according to wiki.
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Sphinx
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 19:26 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Aug 2011
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It increases with epic AA levels. My character with 15 AA levels has a DC of 28. Go figure.
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Sion of Nimlith
Shadow Disciple
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Jes
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 19:48 PM |
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DM
Joined: 23 Aug 2006
Location: Camriiole
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Odd that Death Arrow's not in the sidebar modifications.
It's 10 + AA Level + Casting Stat Modifier, if I remember properly.
My AA had 19 levels and 20 CHA for a DC of 10 + 19 + 5 = 34.
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 19:53 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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That sidebar will be the death of me... looking through the scripts, the Arcane Archer info is like, all wrong. I'll update in a bit.
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Casvenx
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 19:53 PM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Feb 2013
Location: Badlands of 'Murika
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I have actually never gotten into using traps before... Rearranging the skill distribution to make us of them. I was intending to take assassin levels instead of rogue... but considering the trap thing, I think I need the extra skill points (since traps require set, disable, and search... all maxed?), and only rogues can disable epic traps, right? And that's the only way to get them?
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Aeqvinox
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Posted: Fri, Apr 19 2013, 20:57 PM |
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Player
Joined: 30 Aug 2011
Location: Underdark
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Casvenx wrote: I have actually never gotten into using traps before... Rearranging the skill distribution to make us of them. I was intending to take assassin levels instead of rogue... but considering the trap thing, I think I need the extra skill points (since traps require set, disable, and search... all maxed?), and only rogues can disable epic traps, right? And that's the only way to get them? You can't disable epic traps as a non-rogue, but you can recover them just fine. Search is rather optional, because there is plenty of Find Traps spell sources. Max out Set Trap, and put in Disable as much as you can, though it shouldn't be a big problem if you fall short - there's a bunch of items out there that will give you bonuses when you're out obtaining traps. More information here, here and here
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