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slkNihilus
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 Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 10:23 AM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Jun 2008
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It's considered cheesy, yes. But nobody's going to tell you not to make a char with this build, if you want to.
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O'Raghailligh
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 10:32 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Location: NZ
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Why is it cheesy, please?
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DerkDerkistan
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 10:53 AM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Earth
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Oh hey, I want to be immune to critical hits and sneak attacks by taking this caster class but I want to be a warrior.
_________________
Remember when I knew a boxer, baby
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O'Raghailligh
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 10:57 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Location: NZ
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DerkDerkistan
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 10:58 AM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Earth
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Would you still pick Palemaster if they removed the Crit/Sneak immunity from it?
_________________
Remember when I knew a boxer, baby
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Righteous Anger
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 11:01 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Feb 2012
Location: South Carolina, USA
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O'Raghailligh wrote: Spellsword? With 11 Charisma he won't be casting many spells.
_________________
"I will never refuse a challenge from an equal. I will give honor to worthy enemies, and contempt to the rest."
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O'Raghailligh
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 11:07 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Location: NZ
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Hell no. Would you still pick Wiz/Sorc if they removed the Epic Spells and Tensers?
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O'Raghailligh
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 11:11 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Location: NZ
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I'm not a PnP player, I don't know why some things are considered cheese and why some things aren't. Just looking for some sort of schooling really, but without being belittled or chastised or made fun of/judged.
Spellsword
Oh hey, I want to be a self buffing epic spell slinger by taking this caster class but I want to be a warrior.
Bard Pm BG
Oh hey, I want to be an evil ass undead summoning, undead rebuking warrior, so i'll take this caster class to enhance my undead summoning, evil ass-ness, and to top it off, i'll get crit and sneak immunity to boot.
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O'Raghailligh
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 11:21 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Location: NZ
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Or.. Oh hey, I want to be a fighter/ weapon master of (insert weapon here) but I want to be able to read all level of magical scrolls, even though I have only 13 int and 8 wis and 0 + Int Mod Spellcraft.
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DerkDerkistan
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 11:34 AM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Earth
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O'Raghailligh wrote: Hell no. Would you still pick Wiz/Sorc if they removed the Epic Spells and Tensers? Yes, because there is more to the class than those things.
_________________
Remember when I knew a boxer, baby
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O'Raghailligh
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 11:40 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Location: NZ
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Right. Same for Palemaster, yes?
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 11:41 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Palemaster has a rather bad reputation for cheese above most other things other than RDD, because it's rather strong in vanilla NWN and is most usually played by people who have obviously taken it for the mechanical benefits and zero roleplay, up to the point some have crafted their bone arm to look like flesh and pretended they aren't palemasters at all. Spellblades aren't comparable, really, because they haven't had a bad reputation of pretending to be something they're not because it looks ugly.
_________________  "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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O'Raghailligh
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 11:55 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Jan 2009
Location: NZ
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Okay, that helps to clarify it a bit better. For the build I posted above, the Blackguard is not one to try and hide their evil ways so much as it is, and taking Palemaster levels to enhance their powers to the undead would only serve to solidify their ways, so hiding anything of their nature would be even less likely.
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 11:58 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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For what it's worth, I don't particularly care as long as it's roleplayed and a part of the character. There's very few builds I consider irredeemable if they actually acknowledged as part of the character's roleplay. Human subraces are the worst offenders.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Aeqvinox
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 13:05 PM |
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Player
Joined: 30 Aug 2011
Location: Underdark
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O'Raghailligh wrote: Is this build frowned upon, classed as cheese, or labelled bad in any way? (bad in the true sense of the word, not bad as in good). And if so, why? As Sune said. Don't mind people who tell you something you do is intrinsically cheesy, such as this build, as long as you have nothing to blame yourself for. If you have all intention to roleplay it accordingly, the build itself is actually not falling under the definition of cheese at all. Dragon-monks are, not this. I have a drow Bard10/BG8/PM10, and i've been called names too, yet this is the most consistent character i've played on Amia RP-wise. Some folks just don't know any better. As for your build, forget about Improved Expertise, that feat is nonsense. Regular Exp is useful, though i personally would still drop both, take 14 CHA instead of INT, and grab divine feats. Also consider this: 4bard/6PM/10BG pre-epic, that's the only way you'll get 4'th attack. This sadly means one of two things - no bard skill dump in the epics, or no EFS feat. Considering that the only thing the EFS feat gives your summon is +4 STR, +8 natural AC and +1 regen, the summon still pretty much sucks at anything you'll be hunting on 29'th level, so ending with 5bard/15bg/10PM is a lot better for you (unless you've plans for Book of Vile Rituals).
_________________
Mark it zero!
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 13:29 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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exquisitelyme wrote: I dont see why you would pass on +5 free AC for when you are spamming high DC abilities. Erm, you can't cast while using Expertise but can you use abilities such as the ones your shapes give?
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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Aeqvinox
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 14:30 PM |
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Player
Joined: 30 Aug 2011
Location: Underdark
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I believe so, yes. Heard that one before.
_________________
Mark it zero!
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treant13
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 14:55 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Oct 2012
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Yup, and in defense of imp exp. It gives your wyrmling amazing survival in the early shifter levels. Is how i survive since they don't merge all items.
_________________
Lance battle shifter of Red Knight
Lyle Underburrow...I would watch where you step when he's around, you might go boom
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 16:42 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Hm, you really shouldn't be able to use Improved Expertise while using Shifter abilities. That doesn't make much sense and wasn't what I balanced the current forms around. We disabled casting while in that mode for a reason, after all.
I'm planning an overhaul on them, anyway.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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treant13
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 18:50 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Oct 2012
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It kind of makes sense. Abilities don't require as much concentration as a spell and therefore could arguably put the focus more on dodging. Sad face if lost my dodging while breathing gas.
_________________
Lance battle shifter of Red Knight
Lyle Underburrow...I would watch where you step when he's around, you might go boom
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 19:05 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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PaladinOfSune wrote: Hm, you really shouldn't be able to use Improved Expertise while using Shifter abilities. That doesn't make much sense and wasn't what I balanced the current forms around. We disabled casting while in that mode for a reason, after all.
I'm planning an overhaul on them, anyway. So would it be best to not take Expertise/Imp Expertise on a Shifter with the expectation to use and continue to use them in various shapes? I just don't want to end up with feats that are unusable in the end, plus if they should not be able to be used anyways I'd like to know since then it will make perfect sense to not take them if eventually they will no longer be of use.
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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treant13
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 21:46 PM |
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Joined: 24 Oct 2012
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So I am toying with a Trap Master that utilizes HIPS to lay traps in the midst of battle. It will be Kobold and focuses on skills and I am thinking Crossbow. The build is shaping up to be 19 Rog/6 SD/5 MS. I will be posting the build later tonight for approval, but I have a few questions first. I looked up a couple other trapmasters, but I didn't find one that matched this one exactly. 1. Is Crossbow the best way to defend with this build? 2. Is Move Silently necessary or is Hide enough? 3. Can epic traps say from abyss or guantlet be recovered? 4. Is it better to take MS in epic or pre-epic? That is all for now...build on the way 
_________________
Lance battle shifter of Red Knight
Lyle Underburrow...I would watch where you step when he's around, you might go boom
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Mr. Hackums
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 22:12 PM |
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Player
Joined: 22 May 2008
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Master Scout in Epic levels will net you two Epic Bonus feats. Feats that are largely useless (Or much more easily expanded upon) in the Epic levels. So I'd say definitely take it there.
Crossbow isn't the best way to defend that character, I'd say. If you were going defensive while you're setting traps, darts and a shield would be the best defensive strategy. Crossbow for flavor purposes though, is fitting in my books!
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treant13
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 22:29 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Oct 2012
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Sorry i am a little confused. Are you saying to take them in Epic or to not take them in epic.
_________________
Lance battle shifter of Red Knight
Lyle Underburrow...I would watch where you step when he's around, you might go boom
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DolphinRacer
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 22:33 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 May 2009
Location: GMT-8 Bangor, Washington
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Take them in epic because then the bonus feats are epic, I believe he is saying.
_________________
Sir Taelar Ardelyn of Wiltun
Winner of the Razor Tongued Award 2015!
Kira "Penny" Sigers
Better than Boulderdash!
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Mr. Hackums
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Posted: Thu, May 02 2013, 22:35 PM |
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Player
Joined: 22 May 2008
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Yep! Take 'em epic.
Basically, if you decide to take them pre-epic, the selection of bonus feats is sub-par. However, in the epic levels you can choose things like Epic Skill Focuses, Epic Saves, and even Great Dex
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 0:11 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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I don't really want to continue this discussion here too much, but no, using your breath or what have you requires no less concentration than casting a spell. That's flimsy reasoning for the sake of keeping +10 AC. Admittedly, the amount of forms Improved Expertise even applies to for abilities is small, but don't expect that to remain. I will bear that in mind for balancing, of course. I don't intend to make Shifters bad again - I like that they're actually usable on Amia.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 0:37 AM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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Sounds good! I'll select some other feats, just in case.
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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DerkDerkistan
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 0:50 AM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Earth
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PaladinOfSune wrote: I don't intend to make Shifters bad again - They're actually kind of OP right now.
_________________
Remember when I knew a boxer, baby
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The1Kobra
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 1:02 AM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Oct 2009
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treant13 wrote: So I am toying with a Trap Master that utilizes HIPS to lay traps in the midst of battle. It will be Kobold and focuses on skills and I am thinking Crossbow. The build is shaping up to be 19 Rog/6 SD/5 MS. I will be posting the build later tonight for approval, but I have a few questions first. I looked up a couple other trapmasters, but I didn't find one that matched this one exactly.
1. Is Crossbow the best way to defend with this build?
2. Is Move Silently necessary or is Hide enough?
3. Can epic traps say from abyss or guantlet be recovered?
4. Is it better to take MS in epic or pre-epic? From a friendly neighborhood kobold lover... 1: The crossbow does have some advantages. You won't apply your STR penalty to damage, and it does more base damage than other ranged weapons. Also the 19-20 threat range is better in most cases than 20x3 like on the bow. However, the main drawback is that a crossbow needs rapid reload and cannot get the benefits of rapid shot. Since most of your damage will likely be from sneak attack, this still makes the crossbow a less effective option, especially because you'll miss the second attack in your first flurry unless hasted. That said, the crossbow is a classic among kobold weapons, so by all means, I'd still reccommend taking it for the awesomeness factor. 2: You will need move silently. 3: Just max your ranks and you'll be okay. 4: This one's a tricky one, with your class combo. You have a few options as far as your pre-epic level setup is concerned: Option 1: 16/4 Rogue/SD pre-epic, gets 3 bonus rogue feats pre-epic, which may be redundant. You'll want IMPR evasion, you won't need defensive roll, since SD automatically gets it. Slippery mind is reasonably nice. Crippling strike won't really be useful if you primarily use a ranged weapon. Skill mastery is nice if you're setting traps in combat, (you can generally take 20s on other rogue tasks). Opportunist is pretty much useless. This does however, get you 2 master scout feats in epic. Option 2: Take 6 SD pre-epic, go with 14/6 pre-epic. This messes up your BAB though, so I don't reccommend it. Still, it pushes one of your rogue feats to epic. Option 3: Go 12/4/4 Pre-epic. This has some nice advantages. While you lose one of your epic master scout feats, it does get better saves pre-epic since MS has favored save: Fortitude. You get both needed rogue feats in epic. You also get 15 BAB. I think this is the best option. I'd opt for great fortitude for the pre-epic master scout feat. Assuming option 3, here's what I'd do for feats: sa Pre-epic(7+1R+1MS): Dodge, Mobility, SF: Spot, SF: Listen, (Required for PRCs) Weapon Focus, ?, ?, IMPR Evasion (Rogue), Great Fortitude (MS) Epic(4+1MS+3R): G-Dex 1, EWF, Eprowess, Armor Skin, Epic Dodge, ESF Hide, ESF MS, ESF Spot Picking your 2 pre-epics will be tough, you're 4 feats down on PrC requirements. You want: Weapon Finesse, Shield Proficiency, Blind Fight, Rapid Reload or Rapid Shot, Point Blank Shot, IMPR Crit. Gonna be a tough call picking which ones fit the character best. I'd probably go with blind fight and rapid reload though, and forget about melee combat entirely. _________________ I play: 
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Bini
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 1:29 AM |
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Player
Joined: 26 Mar 2011
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DerkDerkistan wrote: PaladinOfSune wrote: I don't intend to make Shifters bad again - They're actually kind of OP right now. Kind of? Ah huhuhuhuhu ha. Vastly. _________________ feel the blood gushing from your anusONE feel the blood gushing from your anus
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 1:34 AM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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Yeah, I know. Hence why I'm fixing them, once I've done the proper research. Fixing a class when you have to bear in mind they can Empower their spells and cast them infinitely due to spell slot items isn't exactly the simplest task, though. There's a lot of variables, and it's really trying to bring down the power ceiling of the class without shafting those who haven't gone the full optimized builds, too.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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Coil
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 3:29 AM |
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Player
Joined: 14 Dec 2012
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Would you perhaps be planning to alter the class in a way which makes shifters who focus in the use of a specific shape more notably different than a shifter who does not?
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DerkDerkistan
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 3:35 AM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Earth
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Coil wrote: Would you perhaps be planning to alter the class in a way which makes shifters who focus in the use of a specific shape more notably different than a shifter who does not? There's really no way to do that unless you take weapon focus and improved critical for the particular weapon that a shape uses.
_________________
Remember when I knew a boxer, baby
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 4:52 AM |
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Joined: 26 May 2010
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ARGH?!
I'm trying to build a Great Smite pally and I'm just failing horribly. The only way I can get it to work with a Human is by going 14 str 8 dex 8 con 14 wis 10 int 18 cha, and that just makes me weep. So starved on skillpoints and HP it's not even funny -_-
I swear to God I will make him a Durpari...
So, can anyone supply a CHA-based Pally that is Human? Aasimar is an idea, too, though only because you avoid the God awful ability point massacre.
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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Bobo_Underhill
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 5:19 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Location: The Drone Star State
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You're going to be gimped in dexterity, low in constitution/intelligence and mediocre in strength no matter how you go.
_________________
Andrew Fryar: Cordor's Folk Hero
Bobrin: Eccentric Avenging Executioner
Lyle Torrowfire: Retired badass
Marigold Cobcruncher: Perceptive Priestess
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 5:22 AM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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Yeah, it's pretty stupid they made it so you need such a high CHA for great smite. I mean, I get that all the ability based epic feats are 25+ but still, that's hard to do on a class that can't just focus in that one stat.
_________________
Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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Righteous Anger
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 5:40 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Feb 2012
Location: South Carolina, USA
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Naivatkal wrote: Yeah, it's pretty stupid they made it so you need such a high CHA for great smite. I mean, I get that all the ability based epic feats are 25+ but still, that's hard to do on a class that can't just focus in that one stat. In Pathfinder your spells are Charisma-based as well. It's great. Anyway, on topic: If you want an Aasimar build, Strength or Charisma based, I can PM you some ideas.
_________________
"I will never refuse a challenge from an equal. I will give honor to worthy enemies, and contempt to the rest."
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PuttheLime
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 5:53 AM |
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Player
Joined: 31 Mar 2013
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Well.. I made a shifter with the original intentions of aiming for Dragon Shape, but scrapped that idea... I'm left with my build in this predicament:
Is 5 AC, Epic Wildshape IV, and UMD worth trading in for a 4th attack per round and a little higher AB?
5 AC because 17 shifter vs 19 shifter loses 2 AC. And not taking a tumble class loses out on 3 AC.
Speaking in general terms. Universally, is it worth it?
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Righteous Anger
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 10:03 AM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Feb 2012
Location: South Carolina, USA
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PuttheLime wrote: Well.. I made a shifter with the original intentions of aiming for Dragon Shape, but scrapped that idea... I'm left with my build in this predicament:
Is 5 AC, Epic Wildshape IV, and UMD worth trading in for a 4th attack per round and a little higher AB?
5 AC because 17 shifter vs 19 shifter loses 2 AC. And not taking a tumble class loses out on 3 AC.
Speaking in general terms. Universally, is it worth it? No. Keep the 19 Shifter 1 Tumbler.
_________________
"I will never refuse a challenge from an equal. I will give honor to worthy enemies, and contempt to the rest."
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Bobo_Underhill
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 12:35 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Location: The Drone Star State
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There's a halfling shadowdancer I've been working on. Quote: CN Ghostwise
Str: 10
Dex: 18 > 26
Con: 10
Int: 14
Wis: 14
Cha: 10
Rogue 8/SD 8/MS 4 > Rogue 15/SD 10/MS 5
Pre-epic: Dodge, Mobility, Skill Focus: Spot, Skill Focus: Listen, Weapon Finesse, Blindfight, Shield Proficiency, Open Feat (MS)
Epic: Epic Skill Focus: Disable Trap, Epic Skill Focus: Hide, Great Dexterity(MS), Armorskin, Epic Dodge, Epic skill Focus: Move silently, Open (Rogue) I've kind of given up on him being particularly useful in a fight, though. Mostly just focusing on utility and a bit of survivability with him. Thoughts?
_________________
Andrew Fryar: Cordor's Folk Hero
Bobrin: Eccentric Avenging Executioner
Lyle Torrowfire: Retired badass
Marigold Cobcruncher: Perceptive Priestess
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Coil
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 12:41 PM |
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Player
Joined: 14 Dec 2012
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DerkDerkistan wrote: Coil wrote: Would you perhaps be planning to alter the class in a way which makes shifters who focus in the use of a specific shape more notably different than a shifter who does not? There's really no way to do that unless you take weapon focus and improved critical for the particular weapon that a shape uses. That's what I assumed. Figured that maybe there'd be a way to alter how shapes work based on wether or not you have additional epic shape feats or alter gains based on wisdom or something. No idea what the limits are on this.
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Naivatkal
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 14:04 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2010
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So I think I ironed out the Shifter stuff:
Druid(5), Shifter(19), Divine Champion(6), Human
STR: 14
DEX: 8
CON: 10
WIS: 18 (28)
INT: 14
CHA: 8
01: Druid(1): Blind Fight, Alertness
03: Druid(3): Knockdown
06: Shifter(1): Zen Archery
09: Shifter(4): Disarm
12: Shifter(7): Weapon Focus: Unarmed
15: Shifter(10): Improved Knockdown
17: Champion of Torm(2): Improved Critical: Unarmed
18: Champion of Torm(3): Toughness
19: Champion of Torm(4): Improved Disarm
21: Shifter(11): Great Wisdom I
23: Shifter(13): Great Wisdom II
24: Shifter(14): Outsider Shape
26: Shifter(16): Great Wisdom III
27: Shifter(17): Epic Skill Focus: Spot
29: Shifter(19): Construct Shape
30: Champion of Torm(6): Epic Prowess, Armor Skin
Concentration 32(32), Discipline 33(35), Heal 33(42), Listen 32(43), Lore 8(10), Spellcraft 13(15), Spot 33(54), Tumble 15(14)
Points of note:
1) Added Zen Archery since it made sense and I had a spare pre-epic feat. Seemed silly to take any save-feats since the base saves are already pretty ridiculous.
2) Picked up Spellcraft by lowering Lore, since it wasn't super important and +3 saves against magic is nice.
3) Question: If I were to get rid of Epic Prowess or Armor Skin (both?) what would be a good other option? Not sure if I necessarily need either, since I dunno how amazing shifter AB and AC can get.
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Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play:
Salema Nefahri :: A penny for your thots
Zrae'a'stra'fryn :: That which nightmares are made of
Khasir :: From the East a storm is coming
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DolphinRacer
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 15:21 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 May 2009
Location: GMT-8 Bangor, Washington
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Coil wrote: DerkDerkistan wrote: Coil wrote: Would you perhaps be planning to alter the class in a way which makes shifters who focus in the use of a specific shape more notably different than a shifter who does not? There's really no way to do that unless you take weapon focus and improved critical for the particular weapon that a shape uses. That's what I assumed. Figured that maybe there'd be a way to alter how shapes work based on wether or not you have additional epic shape feats or alter gains based on wisdom or something. No idea what the limits are on this. Best way to reflect dedication to a particular shape is to fight almost exclusively in that shape, use it a lot, then RP doing research and testing and fiddling with that shape and request abilities. That's what Cory does and its gotten him some badass and fun stuff over the years.
_________________
Sir Taelar Ardelyn of Wiltun
Winner of the Razor Tongued Award 2015!
Kira "Penny" Sigers
Better than Boulderdash!
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Coil
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 16:00 PM |
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Player
Joined: 14 Dec 2012
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I know, I've also been doing this on my own shifter as well. I asked about class balance on its own without any intervention from RP.
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DerkDerkistan
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 16:35 PM |
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Player
Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Location: Earth
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Bobo_Underhill wrote: There's a halfling shadowdancer I've been working on. Quote: CN Ghostwise
Str: 10
Dex: 18 > 26
Con: 10
Int: 14
Wis: 14
Cha: 10
Rogue 8/SD 8/MS 4 > Rogue 15/SD 10/MS 5
Pre-epic: Dodge, Mobility, Skill Focus: Spot, Skill Focus: Listen, Weapon Finesse, Blindfight, Shield Proficiency, Open Feat (MS)
Epic: Epic Skill Focus: Disable Trap, Epic Skill Focus: Hide, Great Dexterity(MS), Armorskin, Epic Dodge, Epic skill Focus: Move silently, Open (Rogue) I've kind of given up on him being particularly useful in a fight, though. Mostly just focusing on utility and a bit of survivability with him. Thoughts? I would recommend going 12 rogue / 8 shadowdancer pre-epic. Master Scout is more valuable when taken in epics. Oh, and Bobo? L2Powergame.
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Remember when I knew a boxer, baby
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exquisitelyme
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 17:22 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2009
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Naivatkal wrote: Points of note:
1) Added Zen Archery since it made sense and I had a spare pre-epic feat. Seemed silly to take any save-feats since the base saves are already pretty ridiculous.
Maybe exchange Zen Archery with Weapon Finesse since you dont seem to particularly care for it, and Finesse gives you a melee AB boost for the DEX heavy forms?
_________________
I play:
Frums Deedone, the Green Child
Balrig Sootkiln, Blood and Vellum
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PaladinOfSune
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 17:29 PM |
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Player
Joined: 15 Dec 2004
Location: England, UK
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I believe Weapon Finesse does not work on creature weapons for Shifters (even if the character sheet says it does), though I've never confirmed it myself.
_________________ "Let's unwrite these pages and replace them with our own words."
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exquisitelyme
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 17:33 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2009
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Hmm, I am sure it works for the Air Elemental in Vanilla NWN...
_________________
I play:
Frums Deedone, the Green Child
Balrig Sootkiln, Blood and Vellum
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Bobo_Underhill
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Posted: Fri, May 03 2013, 17:57 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Location: The Drone Star State
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DerkDerkistan wrote: Bobo_Underhill wrote: There's a halfling shadowdancer I've been working on. Quote: CN Ghostwise
Str: 10
Dex: 18 > 26
Con: 10
Int: 14
Wis: 14
Cha: 10
Rogue 8/SD 8/MS 4 > Rogue 15/SD 10/MS 5
Pre-epic: Dodge, Mobility, Skill Focus: Spot, Skill Focus: Listen, Weapon Finesse, Blindfight, Shield Proficiency, Open Feat (MS)
Epic: Epic Skill Focus: Disable Trap, Epic Skill Focus: Hide, Great Dexterity(MS), Armorskin, Epic Dodge, Epic skill Focus: Move silently, Open (Rogue) I've kind of given up on him being particularly useful in a fight, though. Mostly just focusing on utility and a bit of survivability with him. Thoughts? I would recommend going 12 rogue / 8 shadowdancer pre-epic. Master Scout is more valuable when taken in epics. Oh, and Bobo? L2Powergame. Powergaming is what Andrew is for. As for MS, I couldn't really decide on another epic level feat, so I was going to take the 2 bonus to fort for being pre-epic.
_________________
Andrew Fryar: Cordor's Folk Hero
Bobrin: Eccentric Avenging Executioner
Lyle Torrowfire: Retired badass
Marigold Cobcruncher: Perceptive Priestess
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