But seriously, anything that doesn't require WIS is fine. That's because of the -2 WIS, y'know.
Lol bro. What tiefer gets negative wisdom?
_________________
The Peacock wrote:
[GreatPigeon] is better than me.
Uncle-Opustus wrote:
Just before I fall asleep, I like to pretend it's just a public feat so Pigeon can succeed in politics and save the world from poverty... with his unicorn and shining armour and Excalibur.
6 Rogue/4 Fighter/20 Assassin Int-based, wreck people with your Assassin tools DC.
_________________
"Operating in the border between light and darkness, shadowdancers are nimble artists of deception. They are mysterious and unknown, never completely trusted but always inducing wonder when met"
But seriously, anything that doesn't require WIS is fine. That's because of the -2 WIS, y'know.
Lol bro. What tiefer gets negative wisdom?
The kind of elemental outcast who has zero friends in the world and doesn't know who his mum and daddy were unless he was spewed right out from the ground?
6 Rogue/4 Fighter/20 Assassin Int-based, wreck people with your Assassin tools DC.
What's dc look like on tthosein that build?
My proposed Fire Genasi assassin, earlier in the thread is:
Kamina wrote:
one-shot kill is going to be the following:
Murder DC: 10+20 Assassin+16 Int modifier (Base 30 (18+2 Fire Genasi + 7 Ability + 3 Great Int) + 12 from items) = 46 Fort DC vs death that bypasses death immunities.
Crippling Strike.
Death Attack at DC 46 vs Fort for paralysis, good at catching off-guard enemies who need Freedom to move, it will last for 20 turns and deal 10d6+1d6 sneak damage.
Poison.
Arrows pending for more poison/base damage.
No, this certainly isn't going to be a walk in the park to hit 30 ECL.
_________________
"Operating in the border between light and darkness, shadowdancers are nimble artists of deception. They are mysterious and unknown, never completely trusted but always inducing wonder when met"
I'm only stuck on one feat: Cleric 6, can't figure what to put there. Maybe just shove Great Fort in there?
Epic Spell Pen is for fun times breaking things with SR. ESF: Evoc, obvious reasons. I said screw Greater Ruin in favor of more Fort and dat sexy Will (33 base with maxed WIS). Sorry, Pidge, no banishing this guy unless you get lucky on a 1 (33 base WIS plus uni saves and +7 saves vs spells) :>
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
Crap... its still the same. However, i will likely not be using my others for a great while so it will look the same but it will be the only one running around. I will promise this however... no more new characters for a long loooong time, and i will play around with the armor and see if i can find something different. The only reason why i keep the same look is because i like it.... and likely also my OCD as well.
_________________ Osmodius Blackstar - Human Necromancer
Anyway... i envision a rogue who is basically a ranged hit-man. He will stick to the shadows and pick off targets one by one with his bow. I plan to pimp out his stealth and ranged ability as much as possible and hopefully by lv 30 have an ultimate assassin capable of killing anyone.
_________________ Osmodius Blackstar - Human Necromancer
Shit I forgot about Craft Wand, too... fook that's hella useful as well.
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
Anyway... i envision a rogue who is basically a ranged hit-man. He will stick to the shadows and pick off targets one by one with his bow. I plan to pimp out his stealth and ranged ability as much as possible and hopefully by lv 30 have an ultimate assassin capable of killing anyone.
Then:
Quote:
one-shot kill is going to be the following:
Murder DC: 10+20 Assassin+16 Int modifier (Base 30 (18+2 Fire Genasi + 7 Ability + 3 Great Int) + 12 from items) = 46 Fort DC vs death that bypasses death immunities.
Crippling Strike.
Death Attack at DC 46 vs Fort for paralysis, good at catching off-guard enemies who need Freedom to move, it will last for 20 turns and deal 10d6+1d6 sneak damage.
Poison.
Arrows pending for more poison/base damage.
No, this certainly isn't going to be a walk in the park to hit 30 ECL.
Without the Fire Genasi you only lose 1 DC on Assassin Tools and Death Attack, it's a good "Strike first" build but dear god will you be party/job system/Dreamcoin-bound to level up.
_________________
"Operating in the border between light and darkness, shadowdancers are nimble artists of deception. They are mysterious and unknown, never completely trusted but always inducing wonder when met"
Haha, that's true. But if you are not using spell slots fully you need to rethink your spells!
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
"Operating in the border between light and darkness, shadowdancers are nimble artists of deception. They are mysterious and unknown, never completely trusted but always inducing wonder when met"
Joined: 25 May 2011 Location: Canada, Qc (EST, GMT -5)
Naivatkal wrote:
Haha, that's true. But if you are not using spell slots fully you need to rethink your spells!
Not really; a cleric that keeps situational restorative spells in case of falied saves doesn't need to rethink their spell slots. And Craft Wand is useless until higher levels; it consumes all your funds until you have a decent income.
_________________ login:mirvala Em'rae d'Ussen d'Vhid No mercy for the kivvil akaAgentOfLyumis
What do you think about spending points in spellcraft? If character has 40+ fort save he is safe against most dangerous spells anyway. And other times you don't get bonuses from spellcraft, like against storm of vengeance. Also I don't think it brings any extra saves against pulse attack of spectres and epic bosses.
And another question, how useful is here using traps? Is it good in PvM, PvP? I haven't actually used them yet.
In PvM I found them handy for my DEXy chaps to bring Sneakproof and/or critproof bosses down by a good few hundred HP before Haste(10) from items runs out. Other than that, they take so ridiculously long to set that you're better in every way to find something easier to fight.
In PvP they are a vital tool to the cornersneak, but for everyone else they still give you a pretty major home turf advantage, and in this context 'home turf' means any patch of ground that you've had time to seed with traps.
Don't bother with anything but Epic Sonic/Lighting/Cold or Deadly Acids.
For PvE in places like the Abyss, how useful is Epic Spell Pen on a character with 27 CL? It is enough to break help through SR? Or is it pointless?
I'm assuming that (not including events) the Abyss is the likeliest place to encounter high SR. Could be wrong.
edit: Is Greater Spell Pen enough? Or should I just forgo Spell Pen completely with CL 27? I know it's more of a circumstantial thing, but it can be useful after all.
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
Last edited by Naivatkal on Thu, Jan 30 2014, 18:51 PM, edited 1 time in total.
I was thinking about investing some skill points in those. At least it could be some fun. Can you buy epic traps in abyss/gauntlet? Or how much of search/disable you need?
You can't buy epic traps anywhere. You need Enough Search/Disable. I can't remember how much 'Enough' is. I may in fact know fine well but I shall remain coy in the interests of keeping my feminine mystique.
6 Rogue/4 Fighter/20 Assassin Int-based, wreck people with your Assassin tools DC.
What's dc look like on tthosein that build?
My proposed Fire Genasi assassin, earlier in the thread is:
Kamina wrote:
one-shot kill is going to be the following:
Murder DC: 10+20 Assassin+16 Int modifier (Base 30 (18+2 Fire Genasi + 7 Ability + 3 Great Int) + 12 from items) = 46 Fort DC vs death that bypasses death immunities.
Crippling Strike.
Death Attack at DC 46 vs Fort for paralysis, good at catching off-guard enemies who need Freedom to move, it will last for 20 turns and deal 10d6+1d6 sneak damage.
Poison.
Arrows pending for more poison/base damage.
No, this certainly isn't going to be a walk in the park to hit 30 ECL.
Good luck actually hitting anything.
_________________ Remember when I knew a boxer, baby
The build for that one in particular was 9 Fighter/1 Rogue/20 Assassin. Depending how quick you are to do so, you can quickly drink a True Strike before attacking.
The literal bitch to this build is having to attack someone with epic dodge, as you'll lose your assassin tools on the first go and have to wait another minute.
_________________
"Operating in the border between light and darkness, shadowdancers are nimble artists of deception. They are mysterious and unknown, never completely trusted but always inducing wonder when met"
For PvE in places like the Abyss, how useful is Epic Spell Pen on a character with 27 CL? It is enough to break help through SR? Or is it pointless?
I'm assuming that (not including events) the Abyss is the likeliest place to encounter high SR. Could be wrong.
edit: Is Greater Spell Pen enough? Or should I just forgo Spell Pen completely with CL 27? I know it's more of a circumstantial thing, but it can be useful after all.
Le bumpity.
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
Posts get pushed up, people don't see them, post no getty answers XD
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
Does anyone here know anything about a weapon's reach factoring into defense? I have noticed that when the monk I made uses her quarterstaff she gets hit less than when she is unarmed. Maybe this is just because the quarterstaff version kills quicker. But I would think a dex-based unarmed Monk would get hit less.
Posts get pushed up, people don't see them, post no getty answers XD
When you ask about a different build every week that you're never going to commit to playing, people start to not gaf. And when you refer to Uncle Opustus as Uce, you've fuct up big time.
I blame Uce for having spoken to be recently IG. It gave me all sorts of cow brain diseases.
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
What do you think about spending points in spellcraft? If character has 40+ fort save he is safe against most dangerous spells anyway. And other times you don't get bonuses from spellcraft, like against storm of vengeance. Also I don't think it brings any extra saves against pulse attack of spectres and epic bosses.
The saves it gives are off your gearset, which is vurry good, although moot for Fort cos you need that beefy against Devcrit.
I have a niggling suspicion it will boost your saves against Storm while the caster is alive. After the caster is dead, the script goes a bit flooby, hence the the phenomenon where Prot/Evil works just fine against Brog Orc Shamans until you kill them and get stunned unless Mindblanked. I haven't tested the saves thing, though.
No use against pulses and other not-a-spell effects like Barby Rage.
The real question is: what are you giving up to get this Spellcraft?
My 16 monk/12 rogue (not max, will be 16/13/1 ranger) has 43ish ab, which is not bad. 60ish ac with epic dodge.
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
Well you're not going to hit -everything-, however if I have patience that char can solo the abyss. Just takes a while and can run through supplies. I've only gone halfway through the first map as a test, because it's not feasible to go through that many heal kits, but for having that ab and ac with epic dodge I think that's pretty good.
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
43 AB isn't bad? Perhaps my 45ab 50ac devcrit fighter/monk is worth trying then
That's better AB but poorer AC than my recent Devcrit Rogue16/Ftr8/Monk6 got. I've never played a character with so much DPS against mobs. Unless your party has twohandering WMs, then you can be pretty sure of killing four critters per spawn in the time it takes everyone else working together to dust the last two.
PvBoss, it's much less exciting, although in a group against the Sneakable, it speeds things up a lot.
In PvP it's got one nasty trick, but it's mince without it.
Much as it's hugely enjoyable to see the engine struggle to keep up with you(when rushing Orc Shamans in particular, the archers would bite an Attack of Opportunity and be dead so fast they just fell over without any combat animation from my character), there's no denying that DEX base and Epic Dodge is still better.
I have a Monk20/Rogue10 with Epic Dodge who's got 62AC just with DEX/WIS capped. I guess his AB must be 42, which is bad. I never tested him much in PvP, but he hit harder than I thought he was going to, even minus Sneaks.
My classic Rogue dude was Rogue23/Barb1/Ftr6. I built him as my tribute to Belkar, only setting the levels of murderous insanity much, much higher, and making him much much stupider, so he's only got 8INT and is a hin. The smart way to build this is actually with a human Monk to capitalise on Flurry, feats, skill points and size modifer for IKD, but where's the fun in that? Pretty damn solid in PvBoss; better in PvMob; utter and total nightmare in PvP, except for the few people that know how to deal with cornersneaks. Hint: it's not the same as Shadowdancers.
Then I must have been really drunk because I made an Epic Damage Reduct III Rogue16/Ftr4/DwD10. Amusingly tough with when unbuffed due to Epic Dodge and 20/- DR but overall just a masochistic novelty build. The smart way to do it, Rogue19/Ftr6/DwD5 with sensibly arranged stats, is almost certainly a lovely mix of DPS, immunities, Sneaks and Defensive Stance.
I have a niggling suspicion it will boost your saves against Storm while the caster is alive. After the caster is dead, the script goes a bit flooby, hence the the phenomenon where Prot/Evil works just fine against Brog Orc Shamans until you kill them and get stunned unless Mindblanked. I haven't tested the saves thing, though.
That's interesting. Anyway wiki states "The modifier to saving throws against spells does not help against most spells with a duration, such as storm of vengeance, grease, and combust." So right now I don't see particular spell/ability that it could be useful against.
I was thinking about putting more into UMD or possibly set trap, but I don't know yet.
Wow, thanks man. You know my original concept was a STR based Monk, and I've tried every which way to make a purebuild with decent AB and AC so it can kill things eventually and survive really well. I tried various things to make Devcrit work, when I saw that it couldn't, which gave me my current idea, and after struggling with that I started giving up and going the Dex route.
I love the idea of Monks in any fantasy setting, probably SRPGs the most (alongside Archers) and I have yet to just make them... work the way I'd like. My expectations are too high.
I may end up just making the Ftr/Wm/Rg with Whip focus or something and call it a day if I am unable to find a cool option later. Or I can Mnk10/SD20 and see some really cool roleplay out of it.
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