I don't seek out PvP because I'll lose. I've been PvP'd a few times in 10 or so years, though apart from two assassinations pretty much everything else was my own fault (mainly getting into mass battles). This tends to make my characters either cowards, pacifists or loners.
You can RP below 30th level (and you should, because the quest to reach 30th is great for character development), but I'm inclined to agree with the OP that you pretty much need to be high level on Amia because not being high level limits where and how you can RP. No, it's not essential, but it does make it a whole lot easier.
_________________ ~Sharess on AmiaWiki~ Priestess, politician, prostitute "[They] were moving in on me like Sharessans on a new broad in the bath house" - Tracer Bolt AmiaWiki mod (mostly inactive)
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I mention it every time this gets brought up, but I intentionally keep one of my characters from max level(epics really) simply because I feel better playing her there. Maybe I'm looking for something else in roleplaying that character. She's a nice break from Beldor, and part of that break is not having to constantly act as, be seen as, or even react as some supposedly powerful character. It changes your game world perspective. Getting involved in fights, events, etc, has a bit more risk and consequence. I know for a fact Zammi is likely not going to be the most powerful chess piece on the field. Not weak, just not godlike. That's where her story needs to be for now, until or if it advances.
I have another character, lv 12 or so I think, I break out especially so I can play with lower level PC's or be involved in lower level-oriented events. If I happen to come across a lv 30 Banite looking for a fight while playing as her, oh well, that's the story. The story of how she ran away from some uber-warrior or got her ass handed to her by him/her.
The pressure to be at lv 30 before you "start" roleplaying is largely, from my perspective, a viscous cycle that we perpetuate upon ourselves. We as a playerbase are so freaking caught up in having the best mechanical chances we can that we deny ourselves anything but stories with post-epic PC's. We're afraid someone else is going to "beat" us, to knock us out of our position, that one of the older, more established PC's will effortlessly steamroll us out of whatever they want. And we need to get over that. It's understandable to get attached to a character. Honestly, something gets fucked up or goes wrong with Beldor, it gets to me sometimes. It's only natural for being invested in a decade-old character. But I make myself get over it(most of the time) for the sake of the story. A solution I've found is what I do now: have that one character that's your "main." And have another character or two where it's just whatever. Someone that you can role with the punches easier. That's a compromise I think anyone can work towards.
If we want to stop feeling the pressure to reach lv 30 and have epic gear for the sake of RP, then that change has to happen with each of us at an individual level. You want to encounter more low level PC's in RP, play more low level PC's in RP. If some asshat 6 INT lv 30 beefcake comes in and wrecks face, well, that's the story. That's not something you can control or avoid necessarily, because like it or not, that roid-filled beef cake is as much a part of the setting as your PC. And as bad as it feels to have something you work towards seemingly destroyed at the whim of a more powerful character, it's not as bad as allowing the mere fear of that happening prevent you from ever trying it. Something I suggested a while back was level-advertised events. Have a DM specifically run A FEW events for specific levels. Is it somewhat artificial to the setting? Yes. But at least it's getting us, as a playerbase, to dip our toes in the pool where otherwise we'd be too afraid to touch the water at all.
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Joined: 01 May 2009 Location: GMT-8 Bangor, Washington
Just going to throw this out, as a personal view/opinion/perspective, but aside from with Taelar, who got there just because I've played him a long time, my desire to get characters to level 30 usually stems from the fact that the concept I have for them in terms of abilities and the RP I want requires me to max level to get the abilities to reflect what I want the character to be known for at least in some way. Kolthar is probably the best example, I have to max his build so that I can literally punch people blind with him.
That being said...build what you want, do what you want. If you want to make low level characters that are not gear dependent, make them, just know its going to restrict you in some ways. If you want to make a PvP hound and go aroun wreaking havoc, do that, but be aware that ICly and OOCly tha tends to draw a lot of flak. If you want to make an RP build, eff it, slap that puppy together run out there and RP your damned heart out. Bottom line, this a game that is about creativity. Sure leveling can restrict what you can do, but finding creative ways to get around in the world despite that handicap is part of the fun of doing it. Do what you want. This whole game is literally about creating people, histories, and personalities in a world different from our own. Go out there and have fun dammit!
_________________ Sir Taelar Ardelyn of Wiltun Winner of the Razor Tongued Award 2015!
Joined: 10 Nov 2015 Location: WHY SHOULD I TELL YOU WHERE WHEN YOU'RE ABOUT TO DIE?! NGAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!
Ok yep. This thread is exactly what I expected.
Two things -- first, to address the mental stat discussion; second, to address the OP.
1. For a referencepoint on Charisma, Intelligence, and Wisdom; consider the average person's intuitive ability as being Wisdom, (INT * 10) to be IQ, and a Charisma to be a mixture of one's looks and social graces in an average setting.
Look at absolutely anyone, anywhere; and you are most likely looking at someone with a 10 CHA, INT, and WIS
Now look at Donald Trump. You will find the prime example of a man with low CHA (for being completely unattractive and completely offensive), and on account of absolutely murdering foreign relations with no regard for consequence a low WIS, but he also knows how to 'play the game' because he's actually manipulating the system really really alarmingly fucking well; ergo his highest mental stat is likely INT.
Refer to figures like the Roosevelts, Winston Churchill, and Ronald Regan for fine examples of people with Charisma. These people weren't exactly the most attractive fuckers, but if you want to tell me that Regan's speech on the Wall wasn't powerful as fuck you're completely retarded.
At the same time, figures like Marilyn Monroe as well as celebrities we see everyday doing modeling are/were 'also' high CHA. They have looks, yes, but it's not just that; they have looks that compel us to idolize them beyond what is or should ever be reasonable. If I need to explain why it isn't reasonable, you're also retarded.
Wisdom beyond a certain point mostly bubbles down to 'philosophical bullshit', but intuition and the trope of the idiot savant also rely heavily on it. If it doesn't boil down to 'knowing' what something is and it's a rational thought? It's wisdom. You use this to know when to blink, to beat your heart, to know wether you can survive something or not, and even to foresee the future consequences of a small decision in a greater scheme.
There can be factors in any of these within which your character excels beyond the rest, keep in mind; your 8 CHA character may well be a pragmatic negotiator. That's fine. You can deviate from your tendencies a bit, and 'should' because otherwise everyone would be the same.
The thing to remember, though, is that your character sheet should reflect tendencies. If you can chain everything you've done or said together at the end of the day and your 8 WIS 8 CHA 8 STR character has singlehandedly inspired a city to begin a revolution amongst the proletariat against their bourgeoisie masters because he picked up and threw two of them from the top of a building 'just' high enough to injure them without killing them, there's a problem.
2. OP.
I completely understand what you're feeling. There was a time on another server where I was, too, perfectly content to loose almost 100% of the time; and then I realized I wanted to eventually win, and ultimately 'had' to if I was going to escape that 'shell' of being a community joke.
Granted, I never did escape that shell.
But I'm here now, so let me just be upfront to say this: Hitting 30 is and should be a natural part of eventual character growth. How early that needs to be? That's all a measure of how important your character is to you, and how important you want it to be to the world -- but only if you intend to, 'with' that importance, shake the status quo up. It's a twin axis; and the more important you want to make it, or the more you intend to change the norm, the 'sooner' you need to hit that level.
With the sole reason of relevance among a server that is largely older than you are.
If your goal is to make a character to try and be an intermediary for Tarkuul and Kohlinghen relations for some reason? Fucking yolo do it man, and that shit isn't going to need to be 30 either; because one won't kick your ass on virtue of player numbers and actual concern, and one wouldn't anyway on the virtue of not wrecking innocents' shit.
If your goal, on the other hand, is to make a tyrannical leader? You had better be prepared to actually bench your weight -- because eventually someone is going to challenge it.
The actual role-play of the character isn't affected by this though. Strictly speaking, your actual role-play of a character, building something with depth and personality (which is lost on too many people) should literally be doable with a level one. I've had plenty of enjoyable encounters with lots of people that I just sadly never see rise to any high standard because they don't have the force of arm power to back their force of personality. The important thing to understand is the difference between the importance of levels to the role-play of a concept, and the importance of levels to the role-play of a plot.
With how important plot motion is to character development, and thus to the former, this is often mixed up I think.
The only better way to present it: look at my character now. I'm going to now remind you that it has literally existed since late May. That's what. 3 months?
There are people that have been around for 'years' that aren't at the head of a faction, or leading sieges against cities, or having diplomatic talks between cities to avoid getting kicked out of them. I've literally done all the above and am 'still' doing it. These people have been level 30 forever and has it gotten them anywhere, or improved their character innately?
But on the same spectrum regarding my character -- if you've ever interacted with her, she has 100% of the time acted exactly the same and is exactly as self important as she was off the boat; but ask yourself if you'd receive her the same way if I was 'still' level 1.
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Joined: 15 Dec 2009 Location: The Sky Above The Rain.
If you drag politics into a discussion about gear, levels and roleplay...
#StraightOutaAvernus wrote:
... you're also retarded.
If you want a prime example of charisma, just remember Robert of Caris.
_________________ Mercadier - *sleeps six feet under the warm sands of Khem* Alex - Life is adventure or nothing! Eddie - Sex, drugs and rock'n... more sex. ========= Obsidian (inactive)
Other thing to keep in mind, the kraken, with it's 20 natural charisma, is easily one of the most attractive and sociable creatures in the sea known for traveling in tight-knit groups with an established social hierarchy. Compare to the lowly killer whale and other cetacean's who have a measly charisma of 6 and thus live anti-social lives devoid of any personality or social traits.
I'm being facetious obviously but that's why needing to RP low cha is dumb. Even their own rules don't assign values to things based on the criteria some people here think apply.
Joined: 15 Dec 2009 Location: The Sky Above The Rain.
It's to be taken with a grain of salt, or my favourite common sense.
A -2, 6 int. orc barbarian should hardly be able to solve puzzles, same as -2, 6 dex. dwarf should not excell in court dancing.
Charisma may seem tricky, because some people think that charisma = pretty person, which is not true. I doubt Dirk was a charismatic character (dunno for sure, though, but Eddie liked him ), but don't forget that he led a group of criminals, and they often follow slightly different kind of leadership. Sure, a charming and handsome criminal overlord is possible, but same is an ugly and sociopathic mass murderer whom others follow out of fear and respect.
_________________ Mercadier - *sleeps six feet under the warm sands of Khem* Alex - Life is adventure or nothing! Eddie - Sex, drugs and rock'n... more sex. ========= Obsidian (inactive)
Joined: 10 Nov 2015 Location: WHY SHOULD I TELL YOU WHERE WHEN YOU'RE ABOUT TO DIE?! NGAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!
Guardian wrote:
If you drag politics into a discussion about gear, levels and roleplay...
#StraightOutaAvernus wrote:
... you're also retarded.
If you want a prime example of charisma, just remember Robert of Caris.
Wew I was disagreeing with Commie on stats being entirely non correlated. When did I shit in your cereal friend.
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*So, i've got a question for ya. *do you think even the worst person can change…? *that everyone can be a good person, if they just try? *all right. *well, here's a better question *do you wanna have a bad time
Joined: 15 Dec 2009 Location: The Sky Above The Rain.
The moment you've dragged...
Guardian wrote:
... politics into a discussion about gear, levels and roleplay...
Commie's irrelevant. You have so many examples from Amia to picture your point, no need to taint it here with RL politics.
_________________ Mercadier - *sleeps six feet under the warm sands of Khem* Alex - Life is adventure or nothing! Eddie - Sex, drugs and rock'n... more sex. ========= Obsidian (inactive)
What I'm trying to say is that if you want to make a good Amia character you should be like the majestic Kraken who has an ability spread that's clearly representative of its personal rp goals, and not be like the Orca thst just dumped charisma so it could be an apex predator.
Joined: 10 Nov 2015 Location: WHY SHOULD I TELL YOU WHERE WHEN YOU'RE ABOUT TO DIE?! NGAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!
But fam, I'm literally just using examples that are easily relatable and well known because it's effective.
I think it's perfectly adequate to present charismatic figures as examples of charisma.
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*So, i've got a question for ya. *do you think even the worst person can change…? *that everyone can be a good person, if they just try? *all right. *well, here's a better question *do you wanna have a bad time
... politics into a discussion about gear, levels and roleplay...
Commie's irrelevant. You have so many examples from Amia to picture your point, no need to taint it here with RL politics.
I'm pretty sure you need to relax. Seriously. The vitriol in your two posts after SOA's is disheartening.
_________________ Whomst've'll'd'mn't I play: Salema Nefahri::A penny for your thots Zrae'a'stra'fryn::That which nightmares are made of Khasir::From the East a storm is coming
Joined: 15 Dec 2009 Location: The Sky Above The Rain.
I think, on the other hand, that calling people retards because they don't jizz their pants from Regan's speech is not perfectly adequate.
So preach on, if you will, but I'll try to argue with gaming world examples. The last thing I'm interested in, and I dare to say I'm not the only one, is discussing and comparing RL to Amia.
_________________ Mercadier - *sleeps six feet under the warm sands of Khem* Alex - Life is adventure or nothing! Eddie - Sex, drugs and rock'n... more sex. ========= Obsidian (inactive)
Joined: 02 Jun 2015 Location: Georgia, United States.
I'm going to voice myself one last time before I end this topic for myself. Aside from the rude comments to each other, and getting off topic with real life situations..
Gear doesn't impact your roleplay. No DM will control a NPC like.. The Voice of Tarkuul, and say if you don't have appropriate gear you'll not be on the Council. Or you'll not be the Headmaster.. Or you'll not even be a guard. Gear is irreverent to roleplay. You 'want' gear because it helps you in PvP / PvM situations, you don't want it because it will further your roleplay.
Levels doesn't mean shit in roleplay. Lord Tuomas Valo's player, Gy, played a Level 15 Aasimar who was on the Council in Cordor. Who stopped a MAJOR issue in Cordor. (I'm trying to be very vague not to give away rp information from years ago.) but in general. Is he one of the only players to ever contribute to the game at low level? No. Many players who are level 5, 6 or 20 do stuff to further Amia. It may just not have that big of a impact. Does the size of your impact matter? No.
Joined: 10 Nov 2015 Location: WHY SHOULD I TELL YOU WHERE WHEN YOU'RE ABOUT TO DIE?! NGAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!
Commie wrote:
Guardian wrote:
I think, on the other hand, that calling people retards because they don't jizz their pants from Regan's speech is not perfectly adequate..
Who said anything g like this? Wtf?
^
I literally just said that it was effective. Like honestly.
To have impact, to be remembered, to carry on past the time something has occurred; that's charisma.
At the end of the day, I would also call someone retarded who didn't say that Hitler was a charismatic influence on Germany; just as well as I'd call someone that who said Lincoln wasn't a charismatic influence on the US during its civil war.
These aren't matters of opinion or reflection of their quality as a person. These are discussions of 'fact'.
_________________
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Playing: Tanar'i Shit Disturbers
Last edited by #StraightOutaAvernus on Sun, Aug 28 2016, 19:51 PM, edited 1 time in total.
But yes. This topic is starting to get trolled, can we turn it back around to the source please.
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*So, i've got a question for ya. *do you think even the worst person can change…? *that everyone can be a good person, if they just try? *all right. *well, here's a better question *do you wanna have a bad time
I think, on the other hand, that calling people retards because they don't jizz their pants from Regan's speech is not perfectly adequate..
Who said anything g like this? Wtf?
*Sigh*... Seriously, just read the thread, don't write anything just because you can without having an information.
#StraightOutaAvernus wrote:
if you want to tell me that Regan's speech on the Wall wasn't powerful as fuck you're completely retarded.
There you have it.
I agree with LibrisMortis_666, having high level and gear is pretty much a luxury. You don't need any of those (sometimes it could be even worse to have it).
It's like saying you need to be the strongest powerbuild ever to play a guard, so you can enforce the law.
Sorry for my english
EDIT: I'm also a slow writer and 3 people wrote something before me
Last edited by Bertnard on Sun, Aug 28 2016, 19:57 PM, edited 1 time in total.
Joined: 10 Nov 2015 Location: WHY SHOULD I TELL YOU WHERE WHEN YOU'RE ABOUT TO DIE?! NGAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!
Eh. I mean, if my point was missed because of the preface; I'mma go ahead and back out of this one before I make an ass of myself.
Without any trace of irony, there wasn't any legitimate offensive intent. I assumed the word would be taken as the way it is in most situations RL these days; where the overwhelming majority are desensitized to its original use and purpose on account of being used in standard language to describe something completely different.
To rephrase, since the word was clearly not appreciated; thinking it's anything to do with intelligence to idolize celebrities for their looks alone, or that a speech which has resonating effect isn't charismatic, is a foolhardy thing to do -- which I fronted with real world examples.
There's really no better way to 'describe' charisma, I would argue. Charisma is, quite simply, the ability of something to affect us at all for good or ill. It's the forcefulness behind words, less how 'good they are' or wether we agree with them; Charisma is by its very nature political -- and the more persistently it does that, the more it's Charisma.
_________________
*So, i've got a question for ya. *do you think even the worst person can change…? *that everyone can be a good person, if they just try? *all right. *well, here's a better question *do you wanna have a bad time
... ask for this thread to be locked. Look at this, two pages in and it's already spiraled this far from the main topic. Nick's opinion: Play your stats, you made them. If you don't know how to play your stats, ask for advice from someone. If that doesn't help and you continue to play with the "no consequence for pvp" attitude, stop playing; you're doing nothing but ruining the good times of a lot of people. Your stats define your character and it should not be terribly difficult to understand how to play them. Here, this should be fun: STR: Oooh! 18 STR? Flex them guns, move those heavy rocks. 8 STR? ... well that does seem like an awfully hard turd to push out. DEX: Nice! 18 DEX? Yeah, flip that butterfly knife like a boss. 8 DEX? I completely understand why you can't catch the coin you're flipping. CON: Whoa, 18 CON? Can you even tell it's freezing out here? My nuts -literally- just froze solid with my 8 CON. WIS: Capital! You just chose not to fall into a bandit's ploy and leave the city limits with him whitchow 18 WIS. I just got stabbed with my 8. INT: Neato torpedo! With 18 INT you correctly reasoned how many potential planes there are! I can't speak with 8 INT, so " ffqa f7 df6". CHA: Oh! You just convinced someone to buy that rock for ten times it worth at 18 CHA! I just convinced a guard to jail me at 8.
This is simple, people. Stop making me not want to play with you. PvP when you have to or it makes logical sense to do so, not because you want to. There are other servers for that. A lot of them. Filled with people just like you. Oh, what? You've tried those servers and those people are annoying?
I guess the question is, is your character a Kraken or an Orca?
The way I look at it, if you don't have abilities that run off charisma, but don't have charisma above 14 or so, you're an Orca build. If you do have abilities that run off charisma, but don't also have 14 int and 14 wis, you're an Orca build; you just dumped stats you don't care about to be an apex build.
Remember, nobody would believe something said by a literal idiot (<12 int character), nobody would trust a general with even average common sense (<12 wis character) and nobody would ever consider following someone without above average charisma (<12 cha character). That's just common sense.
I'm going to voice myself one last time before I end this topic for myself.... JUST ROLEPLAY FFS.
Nu! Bby come back! But seriously. Man I think you speaky my language, cause you just handed me a Vegemite samich.
Gear doesn't effect role-play so much as you can still rp your basic stats and abilities. Gear can only offer you enhancements to what's already good.
In fact Matthew has trash for gear since creation till about a week ago. Why? I feel pressured by the community to participate in pvp. If you loose in pvp you get trash talked as a player not just as a character. So! Apparently it looks very bad if you loose at pvp and people will rag on you for it. Doesn't matter if it was intentional to help stir the plot up a bit. On this server no very many people know how to give and take for the better meant of a story. Mostly it's just folks who want to take all the time in my experience. I'll be honest. I don't like pvping with people who want to destroy a concept. Yes that's right destroy a concept. I don't like it when pvp is thinly veiled as roleplay for the purpose of pud stomping for giggles. Until about lvl 23 I lvled my first few characters with completely mundane gear.
I gave in to some pvp stuff to make conflict interesting recently and things went down hill way to fast and people started slinging insults at me ooc. This is not cool.
Recently... my character was tortured to a detailed degree and disfigured for some time...
Happened in to some conflict purely by coincidence on another pc with the same pc who tortured my original. Initiated some stuff in town with words took a hike. They lost. Suggesting to offer disfigurement in a much less gory manner and a more symbolic manner based on IC religious differences? Nope. The very same player who with out asking me ooc if I was cool with them destroying my pc to such a degree immediately went ooc and started saying not to do that stuff... IMO if you want to take you need to give. If you can't give don't take.
Some folks forget there's a player on the other side of the screen just trying to play a character and that they may want to see a development from the character.
I did several scenes with Drow in the community and played the roles for servants and sacrifices. They had a lot of fun but the whole time the players of the community realized that I was willing to play the role who was getting the worst of it and play it to the fullest degree. They were very chill ooc with me about it and everything went fine. These were actually were more interesting and memorable occasions where I actually had fun and the story over all was great to read.
It's when folks play antagonistic characters to the point of poking that sleeping dog one too many times that when the pc's they tormented want to do something about it and reply in kind... they hide behind ooc restrictions and this ruins the story. They take mechanical means to avoid it simply because it was fun to stir up trouble but they don't want to deal with having the heat on them. IMO this is very poor sportsmanship.
PVP can be fun... it can give you a killer rush and it can spark some pretty awesome plots and story developments and changes... On Amia I haven't had very many good experiences.
Nick11689 wrote:
*mic drop*
+1
DukeDublin wrote:
Play nice or I'll ask for the thread to be locked. This should be talk about Amia and the sharing of opinions, agree to disagree.
There's no right answer in a thread like this.
+1
Quote:
I guess the question is, is your character a Kraken or an Orca?
The way I look at it, if you don't have abilities that run off charisma, but don't have charisma above 14 or so, you're an Orca build. If you do have abilities that run off charisma, but don't also have 14 int and 14 wis, you're an Orca build; you just dumped stats you don't care about to be an apex build.
Remember, nobody would believe something said by a literal idiot (<12 int character), nobody would trust a general with even average common sense (<12 wis character) and nobody would ever consider following someone without above average charisma (<12 cha character). That's just common sense.
Sea creatures... I don't think you are presenting your basis of argument very well.
I get you want every thing to be awesome.
Let me describe my character stats, why the are the way they are, and how I play them. These are max lvl base stats with out gear:
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Both of those would qualify as 'Orca' builds due to the presence of an 8.
Claiming ignorance to a generally accepted concept while being fastidious is not flattering.
If you really want to understand how stats work with in the community and what people mean by playing your stats, and get in on the beauty to this sort of system, then... I'm willing to help. But if you're going to keep with the querulous responses I think I'll tap out here.
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Commie wrote:
Remember, nobody would believe something said by a literal idiot (<12 int character), nobody would trust a general with even average common sense (<12 wis character) and nobody would ever consider following someone without above average charisma (<12 cha character). That's just common sense.
Not gonna disagree with the point necessarily that people do min maxing to make pinnacle builds, or for other reasons. It happens, period, not always the reason people do it, but it happens and that is that.
That being said this statement above is UTTERLY false. History is full of examples of generals lacking in common sense that men happily followed because they were personable leaders. Or vice versa, there were leaders that were followed who weren't personable but were really damn good at their jobs so people were willing to trust them, or conversely, that were hated but were so ruthless in dealing with dissent that they were able to maintain power without being particularly likeable.
And as for people believing idiots? That happens all the time. Its literally everywhere in the world constantly. People follow other people who aren't much brighter than them and believe things that make no kinds of sense.
_________________ Sir Taelar Ardelyn of Wiltun Winner of the Razor Tongued Award 2015!
I just like pvp because combat is fun ;-; One of my favorite characters is a good-aligned dorf who just duels people occasionally because I just plain like combat in NwN.
pls be nice peepole pls
Also, if ideas or characters or people with low INT were unbelievable, we wouldn't still have identity politics and people wouldn't be beholden to ideologies needlessly. Stats =/= efficacy.
Edited to reflect the same concept without mentioning anything specific.
_________________ Osiris Masud
Last edited by MisterLich on Mon, Aug 29 2016, 2:42 AM, edited 1 time in total.
My own experience on this server to be honest, has been mixed. As a more recent newbie than not, these are my thoughts.
1) The community is kind of awesome, we bicker, we argue, we take OOC things ICly sometimes, but everyone seems to at least want to get along and want to make it work, if nothing else.
2) The pressure to level to max is INTENCE. I’ve never felt such a pressure anywhere to lvl lvl lvl lvl lvl lvl what gear do you have? lvl lvl lvl anywhere. Being completely honest, that pressure is part of the reason I’ve fled back to my original RP server, Narfell. Personally I just prefer the slower approach so I can actually get to know my character. The RP here is great, but it feels like I’m RPing in an MMO rather than RPing in D&D.
3) There is a level of dissonance between gear/stats and the characters themselves that it seems like one could drive a tractor through it. I’m sorry, but it IS noticeable to an outside observer. This isn’t necessarily bad, but it is there.
I love ya’all I really do, but the style of role play just isn’t quite my cup of tea. Not saying it's bad either, just not my preference.
Well, for me, I cant say that I ever designed or built a character with any idea of what it would be at level 30. In fact, I only have one character that ever reached 30 and that's mostly because of the time investment I put into that character. Play enough and you'll get there. Sure, I've made a few DC rebuilds that helped focus on certain skills or abilities making her more effective. Yes I have requested DC gear that was tailor made to give her an edge where she might have one. Honestly though all of that was done because I still play her with the mind set that she is continuing to grow and change. The only thing different now is that growth does not come in the form of levels, it comes in the form of small changes to a skill point, or a certain item that gives a tiny bit more of a boost to her in some fashion or another. She's not particularly strong, has lost most every PvP situation she's been involved in, but I think she's regarded as effective in what she does do on the server.
I think there are some general thoughts to keep in mind when playing. Not everyone is Muhammad Ali, or Bruce Lee. We can't all be the best fighter. Some of us are going to be better at it, some of us will find that we are better at something else. In this way I think Amia can reflect real life. Just like in real life there are people who are not fighters, but they are really good at something else and that something else earns them a lot of respect. I think of characters like Tuomas Valo here. I don't think Tuomas is much better than a pin cushion in a fight, but he is often sought after for what he is good at. For me and my character, she's pretty good (certainly not the best) at PvE, and she's got a pretty good mix of skills that make her a decent utility character. She's good at coming up with ways to solve problems and for me that works.
I don't think it's all about having the right build and the right gear, it's more about the journey to finding what that character's niche is and trying to be the best you can be in that niche.
I totally get that it sucks getting the snot wooped out of you by the local bully and how that makes you want to be a stronger fighter so you can return the favor, but really... how far does that get a person?
I think there are a lot of us who have realized this, or something close to it, and are happy playing the characters we have. Hopefully the rest of us can find some sort of inner acceptance and feel better about playing characters who are not going to be one bad ass mother f*%$er.
Cheers.
Oh, on a side note - for me Charisma is a measure of your force of character. Sure, in some sense physical beauty can be tied to that (Marilyn Monroe), but that's not all it's about (Oprah Winfrey). Charisma is about your persuasiveness, your natural ability to light up any room you enter, your unforgettable (or completely forgettable) character, weather or not people tend to follow your lead (do your personal fashion statements become fashion trends?)... and none of this as measured by a particular skill. I have a good personal example of this. I have 5 children. The oldest is genuinely liked by everyone he meets, people know who he is and respect his individualism, but he's not a trend setter. My second from the youngest is a wonderful little boy who is smart and genuinely happy. People like him and think he's great, but he's shy and doesn't stand out from anyone else in the crowd. My youngest has more personality then the next ten people put together. Random people stop us in parking lots and stores to tell us how wonderful she is... not once or twice... but numerous times a day. It's honestly got to be a bit annoying because sometimes I just want to get my shit done, but I have to stop and talk to total strangers that are just wowed by my three year old who is 'just so cute they could eat her up'. If I was going to rank those three children in 'DnD terms' they would have CHA scores (on the 3-18 scale) of 13, 9, and 17 respectively.
On the topic of gear. Why are dc allowed items clearly better then the gear in game. Weapons with different damage types i can understand. But allowing +5ac 3stat 5skill boots* starts some power creep. Non epic -> epic -> dc
*Boot example taken from pre priced dc request catalog
On the topic of gear. Why are dc allowed items clearly better then the gear in game. Weapons with different damage types i can understand. But allowing +5ac 3stat 5skill boots* starts some power creep. Non epic -> epic -> dc
*Boot example taken from pre priced dc request catalog
That's also true, I've seen many weapons that had like 7-8 "mythal" powers. I think it shouldn't be done...
And it's not because I'm poor when it comes to DCs
On the topic of gear. Why are dc allowed items clearly better then the gear in game. Weapons with different damage types i can understand. But allowing +5ac 3stat 5skill boots* starts some power creep. Non epic -> epic -> dc
*Boot example taken from pre priced dc request catalog
The below is not an official opinion of the DM team, and is to be taken as my opinion as a player.
I feel like having slightly stronger items via DC requests gives people an incentive to keep trying to move forward in some way or another, to give them something to keep working for while still having a reasonable power ceiling so people cannot just keep getting stronger. However, I will say that it might be best if we were required to have some kind of pre-existing item similar to the item we want to request in the first place, as to not materialize equipment that doesn't exist within the means of your character, or to limit the extent of what can be made to the theme of pre-existing items(pre-existing items being epic loot, items in the loot bin, not DC items)
Try to roleplay as well as you can with OTHER PLAYERS. You DO NOT need DM to roleplay.
I feel like the whole DC system is build around "How much attention can you get" either by spanking others with DC wands or writing tells to DM (or even role-playing in party chat, also saw that one once).
DC items should bring a flavour to roleplay (custom looking effects, bottled companions, unique subraces....), not unobtainable gear.
I understand that gear is important to many players. For some having good gear means surviving PvE, for others involved in conflict RP gear means you are more likely to win those conflicts. The reason gear is important to players is less important than the basic fact that: Reward an activity and you'll get more of it.
Making DC gear less powerful than Epic gear? You'll get more activity around Boss farming, which will then be the source of the best gear. Probabilities are low, which means your reward requires repetition, preferably alone since that mode maximizes the chance for a drop.
DC gear being top shelf means you'll get more of the activity that nets DC's. Probabilities are low, which means your reward requires repetition, preferably in a group since that mode maximizes the chance for your RP to be noticed.
I know which system I'd rather live with. That's not to say there should be no power ceiling. There should and we have people, objective people, on the staff to make those calls and say "NO" when it's warranted.
Yes, there are PC's around who have been here for the better part of a decade. They have things the PC you and I made last month doesn't. However, I value endurance, continuity and the consistent roleplay of iconic long tenured PC's. If they have a few well earned goodies my PC's don't then I'm not going to whine about it.
_________________ Tark Hammerfeast - Immovable Object True Greenspan - Bendir's Boy Wonder
1.) The reason so much time is wasted on silly threads like this? PVE is too easy, good gear too accessible, level advancement too rapid, and meta-gaming too prevalent. (Just go to the fishing forum and look through a few threads and you will find suggestions related to in game gear that will ‘free-up’ that feat for you …) Also, I suspect some people have too much time on their hands, but that’s their business… coupled with the fact that there are only two skills that are required to achieve great power on this server: 1.) Social connections. 2.) the ability to create the time to mindlessly grind and boss hunt.
Do you, (yeah, you) have a stable of ecl 30’s that runs the spectrum of races and classes? Once they were ‘geared out’ did you promptly move onto something else? Looking for ‘the right fit’?… which is code for you got bored because they had no story and there was very little gear left for them to acquire because it is all too easy and was done in a matter of weeks.
Imo, the wrong aspects of the game server are currently being ‘balanced’. In fact, 'balance' is looking more like tilting the server dynamics in favour of one group over another. Today it is leaning one way, but there is the certain knowledge that tomorrow perhaps a wheel with a more annoying squeak will arrive on the scene and make a claim on all available grease...
But that’s ok, there are other servers (most servers, frankly) where none of this is an issue and the players would laugh at the sense of entitlement going on over here. That’s where I currently spend my gaming hours...
A little bit about my background and experience here...
I came to Amia after the small server I was playing got unplugged by a disgruntled DM. I loved the lay out here, and I met some really nice folks. But my impression after a month or so was that this was a meta-gaming level up module where the closest most of the players I encountered came to 'rp' was to ask me to go kill stuff with them in their best dwarven brogue. Lowlevel rp was superficial at best. I was used to building the characters story from the moment I rolled and entered a game. Here? Not so much... most people seem to be slaves to the early level grind. (Maybe its like being in the military, where no place is as good as the place you just left... I don't know.) I pressed on for a while, hoping I would find a place to fit. Every now and then I would roll a character that would find himself in an interesting place to experiement, but none of it really ever stuck... and we were either ignored or discouraged by the establishment. Now, it would seem the current attitude of discussion is to, essentially, turn the place into an arena that spans two servers. Couple that with the 'social network' in place... no thanks. It's pretty much the final nail in my time here.
I am not blaming anyone, I liked the server but never liked the game being played here. It happens. I eventually moved on.
Since I am on a roll...
2.) The awarding of DC’s is arbitrary and has nothing to do with being a better rp’er than the next player and everything to do with having the right ‘ooc social network’. But this isn't exactly new information is it?
Sometimes this place reminds me of junior high all over again. And some pigs are definitely more equal than others.
There are plenty of good rp’ers operating on the fringes who never receive DC’s. Meanwhile, the request forum archives are full of those who seem to get them quite frequently. I recently had someone show me a barter screen of unique junk they had been requesting with their apparent mountain of DC's. I am not sure what the point was, as I wasn't really that impressed with their 'specialness', tbh. Well, knowing what I know... they might not have even had to request them as that seems to only apply to those who are not properly networked...
The following is an example of the sort of corruption that being in the right 'ooc social network' can bring:
I had a pc that I messed up the skill-point req for his PRC. I submitted a request for a partial rebuild where my request was hemmed and hawed over for several days. I believe it took a week to finally get accepted. Which was fine, because that is the accepted procedure.
Less than a month later, I am in a dungeon (in the middle of a hunt!) with someone who hit their next level and realized they had made a similar mistake early in their build and were now unable to take their PRC at the scheduled moment (NOW!).
The difference between them and me? They knew a DM oocly and were able summon them through skype and do a full rebuild (A. Full. Rebuild.) in the middle of the dungeon without going through the formal request process. For free.
Let me say this again: I saw a player do a full rebuild in the middle of a dungeon without submitting to the approval process or having to spend a single DC. Because one of their buddies is a DM.
I waited patiently, because I genuinely liked the player … but the corruption was revealed and I have not viewed the server the same since. I won’t mention names, because I am not a complete dick. Also, I don’t have to… Favouritism and elitism are not exactly a secret here, ask around…
I have also heard talk of ‘black listing’. I am not sure if that is a passed thing or a current thing…
Now, I suppose I might get hit with a maelstrom of rebuttals, but thats ok… I am betting that if I go to the request archives or the fishing forum I will see those same names over and over again. I suppose I could also look through my collection of logs for the incident listed above, but I hesitate to drag the player into this... and it is probably good enough that the DM knows that I know and have not forgotten. I won’t reply though, because I have a lot less to defend than the other pigs… and absolutely nothing to fight for on this particular server. Best of luck!
Freedom is just another word for ... nothing left to lose.
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), but don't forget that he led a group of criminals, and they often follow slightly different kind of leadership. Sure, a charming and handsome criminal overlord is possible, but same is an ugly and sociopathic mass murderer whom others follow out of fear and respect.
