AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic

1) You can set it to change your race type, hair color, skin color, etc, rather than any animal or NPC static skin. So you can just put different clothes on, yes.

2) No expiration, correct.

3) It saves whichever form you were in last.

I keep (or kept, back when it was a bit morerelevant) hearing about RP that could be done for WM, and possible fighting techniques that WMs could learn. I can't find any info on this though. One time it was talked about was in the new requestable spells. Anyone have some info on this?

There's really not much on them to tell, they're custom abilities for WMs and a handful of people know about them, ICly, but there's no one active who actually has them, as far as I'm aware.

Ok. And how would one go about getting one? I mean, RP and such, but then... how should I RP without actually knowing what I am going to get?

You'll have to talk to the people who do know about them, or can tell you enough to make your own way. (Hint: One of those people is Elwyn!)

So! Not naming names, characters, anything.

Two PC's, exchange threats outside city. Offensive spells cast in view of guards. Summons done, PvP ensues.

Ruling on the field?

Personally, I doubt guards would care if it was done outside the city border.

I agree on that point, but honestly, there's gotta be a line.

Like, if EMD, EDK, and Greater Ruin are cast right outside (or attempted to), I mean... really?

Mhm. No one gives a damn.

Don't forget the unfortunate settings where a freshly arrived mage who barely casts a cantrip is able to throw around hellballs and summon epic fiends in a matter of days of heavy grinding.

So... yeah. Nothing special.

Pretty sure you are not supposed to do that kind of thing in view of NPCs, especially guards (metagaming?). But DMs would be the best to ask.

Honestly, I still feel like that sort of thing shouldn't just be ignored. Outside the walls or not, if it's actually in VIEW OF THE GUARDS, it's close enough to the city to matter. It's one thing to be getting into a large magic fight out in the wilds and something completely different right next to a city's walls.

That's why the question is here. I know that city laws are enforced IN the city, but things like that directly outside should not just be blatantly ignored.

CratzBlade113 wrote:

That's why the question is here. I know that city laws are enforced IN the city, but things like that directly outside should not just be blatantly ignored.

They usually aren't. The few hellballs I've seen cast near a populated area had the DM's plop down smoking derbis and leave it there for a while.

We return to "the outer walls of Bendir were a mistake" as a topic.

The outer walls of Bendir were a mistake. They never should have been allowed. They were, and now because of it we have a completely dysfunctional exception rule that keeps having to be restated.

There are no server enforced rules against PvP there. If you want to enforce it hike up your skirt and kill the offending party. Bonus points if you wait until the fight finishes and explicitly open on a mords scroll without word because it was a hostile action to PvP to start with. They'll be out of wards to cast and you'll probably have ripped off most of their defenses.

.... I'm shooting from the hip and assuming it's Bendir anyway. Was it? Not that the 'letter' of the rule still doesn't trump the 'spirit' of it in such a case, however fortunate/unfortunate that is.

CratzBlade113 wrote:

Not naming names, characters, anything.

The question wasn't about the event of PvP being allowed or not, it's the degree to which the PvP evolves to.

I'm simply saying that throwing around tenth-tier spells in front of city limits, in front of guards, should merit some sort of response by the guards. My opinion, it's absolutely silly that it doesn't. And that people do it.

But that is why I'm wanting to discuss it.

Yes, it's kinda absurd; but it's technically legal.

It's just as rule legal for someone to sling a hellball as a Scythe WM to onehit kill someone.

Is it reasonable? Maybe not.
But what I'm saying is that rules don't apply in 'degrees' -- we have to trust folk use common sense.

Not arguing that it's dumb, no, just pointing out that it's objectively no different for the same reason that it's fine for someone to walk around with a summon: restricting mages and not anyone else, conversely, isn't very 'rule fair' when the weaponmaster can fight at full capacity without any buffs or implied collateral.

See: the discussion in hellball balancing of 'it's not fun to inflate its strength realistically'

#StraightOutaAvernus wrote:

-- we have to trust folk use common sense.

We're all sooo screwed. :lol:

That Guy wrote:

#StraightOutaAvernus wrote:

-- we have to trust folk use common sense.

We're all sooo screwed. :lol:

Guess I just gotta suck it up and deal with it. As much as I hate it.

I feel your pain, I remember seeing crazy things happen and thinking, "Would the guards really ignore that?". I don't think they would, so long as it's their land... I'd say they'd defend it, however, that's not how our rules work here, unfortunately.

I have seen other servers that had active NPC guards, where if any hostile act happened within X distance, they went and beat the shit out of everyone involved. It was effective, but... realistic? Not sure.

Conversely, there are 100% for certain RP servers with actually higher playercounts where people have literally ran cross-transitions PvPing with officials in the middle of a settlement and NPCs wouldn't even lift a finger with DMs watching.

Which I'm still not condoning, but it's superbly ungrateful to think it is elsewhere, or ever has been, the implicit job of the DMs to admonish people for every little thing that happened in the earshot of a guard NPC down to nuanced and otherwise minor differing discrepancies. It's already artificial enough that you have to completely put the stopping brakes on conflict if someone picks the right spot at the right time.

If it helps you look at it differently, just entirely ignore anything that isn't mechanically done by any given spell because a hellball's practically a mage's crit

I never said I was ungrateful, and I don't believe Cratz did either, we were simply discussing something, realism vs what we have... discussing points as to why it could or even should be a certain way. In the end, we both understand the "why", so please... don't say we're ungrateful.

If the instance in question was in the Dale, then this is what was ruled in the Dale forums in a topic of a similar nature:

TormakSaber wrote:

Bendir's laws do not apply outside the "inner walls". It is not metagaming any guards to PvP outside of the inner walls where the racial gates restrict entrance. Do not expect DMs to enforce this, because it is not a rule, IC or OOC.

If there's a DM around to make them act, then great. But IC'ly I've tried to help with the "suspend disbelief" required by having the Militia Captain tell the guards to stay out of any fights outside the main gates, since Tallers are crazy and they can beat each other up so long as they're not hurting innocent residents who aren't involved.

And unless a DM says that a Hellball destroys half the Dale, then it doesn't.

So! I hope that helps!

That Guy wrote:

I feel your pain, I remember seeing crazy things happen and thinking, "Would the guards really ignore that?". I don't think they would, so long as it's their land... I'd say they'd defend it, however, that's not how our rules work here, unfortunately.

I have seen other servers that had active NPC guards, where if any hostile act happened within X distance, they went and beat the shit out of everyone involved. It was effective, but... realistic? Not sure.

Stuff happens too fast for DM's to get on the guards anyway, if someone is even on to do it.

At the same time, if someone is saying they're gonna kill you, and/or start tossing hostile spells (including disjunctions) around, just kill him and screencap the chat and battle logs. The pvp/NPC rules go out the window if you're attacked, you're always allowed to defend yourself. If it happens, just screencap the part of the log that shows you making a save or them rolling an attack initiating the combat (along with any pre-fight shit/threats they threw your way) and you're in the clear. You're allowed to defend yourself even though it's completely absurd that the five guards standing right next to you don't react.

When I actually get in impromptu fights, or someone does some total BS they shouldn't and I end up in a fight, I try and hit the screenshot button as much as possible as you go at it. It's saved my ass every single time.

edit; also for gods sake if you're going to take a screenshot and send it to DM's don't crop it in ms paint or whatever, just submit the whole screenshot/s with combat/chat viewable and let the DM's deal with picking out the pertinent info. This isn't a rule, but as someone that's had to sort out online pissing matches as a mediator or moderator, I'd much rather get complete screens then stitched-together conversations that could be missing relevant bits because it's just not there.

A Goldsmith makes jewelry.

Mhm. When you're attacked, you may attack back if that's your choice. It is technically your right to do so, and you should screencapture or save the logs as evidence that you did not start the conflict - followed by reporting the incident, because its still against the rules. However, you might also want to simply nudge the other player and let them know that fighting around NPC guards is against the rules in general, in case they aren't aware, and in the slim chance that might stop it from ending in an OOC disaster.

A DM will come along afterwards, most likely, and mediate the situation or rule it retconned if thats what the party wants.

As for Bendir, I don't think anyone really anticipated or realized the inner-wall-outer-wall rule would be a thing until its actual implementation. It is what it is; guards are either too weak or too busy minding their own business for the safety of the people inside (which accounts for the majority of the settlement anyways) as opposed to spending their time breaking up fights between adventurers on the roads.

i.e, NPC guard rule is not enforced outside of the inner-wall. So PCs have to enforce their own laws at their own discretion, Wild West style.

I think removing the golems/patrolling guards in that vague state would help.

It's a wall against invaders anyway, not a wall to indicate newly claimed land.

#StraightOutaAvernus wrote:

-- it's superbly ungrateful to think it is elsewhere, or ever has been, the implicit job of the DMs to admonish people for every little thing that happened in the earshot of a guard NPC down to nuanced and otherwise minor differing discrepancies. It's already artificial enough that you have to completely put the stopping brakes on conflict if someone picks the right spot at the right time.

I'm somewhat offended that you think I (or anyone else for that matter) want or need DM's to oversee every instance we've ever come across. I'm fine with rolling with fights, but things like this tend to bug me, because of the amount of power the spells can do, even if it's not *actually* doing anything.

I'm also unclear on why everyone is jumping to the conclusion that it's both A) in the Dale, and B) that Hellballs were thrown around.

I've told everyone who needs to know, both IC and OOC. The fact that this can happen anywhere is the issue I'm trying to address.

My bad for assuming. People were talking about the dale and hellballs so I just assumed.

There actual is a rule where certain areas need DM supervision. So, yes, you actually do need a DM for a lot of PvP.

robbi320 wrote:

There actual is a rule where certain areas need DM supervision. So, yes, you actually do need a DM for a lot of PvP.

Yeah but if someone attacks you in one of those areas you don't just have to roll over.

To be clear, my goal wasn't to offend -- and honestly, the goal I did have doesn't really care about or account for the exact spell or location in question. It could be outside Cordor with my point still not being trivialized, really. Twas actually my aim to raise an alternative perspective to your statement.

My point is this: it's not perfectly immersive as it is; but at the same time it's not exactly fun or fair to fuck the mage's ability to go on the defensive by going more realistic, and it's definitely possible to break immersion even more than it currently is.

There's probably never going to be a specific "don't use ______ spells in a public area" ruling because that would both get pretentious to mediate the consequences for, and extremely restrictive on a fight's outcome. Why? Because the mage not being able to mechanically use anything but guaranteed single targetters like IGMS reduces them to more-or-less a walking scrollbag.

EDIT: Feel like I should add that I'm not condoning the fight either. It checks out in rules I suppose, so I would just stamp it with IC consequences. Carelessness can be case to case handled

CratzBlade113 wrote:

I'm also unclear on why everyone is jumping to the conclusion that it's both A) in the Dale, and B) that Hellballs were thrown around.

I've told everyone who needs to know, both IC and OOC. The fact that this can happen anywhere is the issue I'm trying to address.

I had answered with Dale-specific stuff because someone else mentioned the Dale. Otherwise, it's location-specific whether or not the guards do anything.

I don't know the ruling anywhere but the Dale, regarding what guards do right outside the gates. Sorry I can't be more helpful! D:

Quote:

As for Bendir, I don't think anyone really anticipated or realized the inner-wall-outer-wall rule would be a thing until its actual implementation.

Yeah we did. that's why we didn't want it going in.

TormakSaber wrote:

Quote:

As for Bendir, I don't think anyone really anticipated or realized the inner-wall-outer-wall rule would be a thing until its actual implementation.

Yeah we did. that's why we didn't want it going in.

Uhuh. What I meant was more, I don't think it was realized /before/ that point, which was right before it was about to go in.

If a metallic dragon disciple gets his breath weapon: Can he decide to rather take a nonlethal breath? If yes, how much would they cost, and how do they work (DCs, cooldowns, duration, etc.)? And which dragon types have which nonlethal breath?

They don't do custom scripting anymore for custom breath weapon changes, but there are a couple. The copper dragon slow breath weapon exists, I know (as a toggle used with the regular breath weapon, so they can have both potentially). Whatever Bioware default has, otherwise, so you'll probably have to have someone look for you to see what's available to request.

Ok, so, for example wyrmling breaths, but then on a 5x per day or something, at least I think I saw that on an old request.

Also, is there a list of requestable horns? If I understand correctly, there are some on a VFX, but I can't find a list...

Then I recommend you look in the appropriate forum: viewtopic.php?f=151&t=77002

Sorry for looking in the sidebar, only seeing that you can request then, looking at the links in the one it links to and getting frustrated at that... Thanks Tarnus.

You're welcome! We should probably consider sticking that list in the sidebar to make it easier accessible.

Btw -- just as an aside, I can see no reason you couldn't try to get a restricted use/day widget for the other breath weapons if they aren't already coded to be alt DD breaths.

Not trolling.

Could I, with the right job skills, make soft-drinks, and request a soda-pop item spawner?

Everything needed to make a classic coke-like/root beer/ginger ale exists at this time and I don't feel carbonated water with some maple syrup, strawberry syrup, or ginger root is out of the question.

That doesn't sound out of the question to me, really. I would say just dont name it Coke and stuff like that

SamTheGiantSlayer wrote:

That doesn't sound out of the question to me, really. I would say just dont name it Coke and stuff like that

i'd do it like ye old days and have beverages and 'tonics.'

How are you going to carbonate the liquids?

You can carbonate liquids with several methods IRL, though the only one I'd really see even remotely feasable in our setting would be vinegar and baking soda, since afaik CO2 isn't even something that even the most educated scholars would know even exists.. (Example: a mineshaft is so deep that it requires an air vent. The explenation used for that wouldn't be 'Too much CO2 in the air' but most likely 'the air is stale', 'too little air' or 'the air is bad' and so the explenation for the air shaft would be that you need fresh air or more air, not you need to remove the co2 from the air by introducing fresh air that isn't oversaturated with co2). and that presents a problem since baking soda probably wouldn't exist in FR at this time either. You can get baking soda from Nahcolite, a mineral that probably might exist in the FR setting, but refining it to produce baking soda most likely wouldn't be known, and even if Nacholite was refined for something, it mostl ikely wouldn't be to produce baking soda. Even if Nahcolite was used at all, it'd probably be for ornimental purposes, due to the lack of obvious uses for it as you have with most metals and other minerals that exist in the FR setting.

Unless magic was used to carbonate liquids, I don't see how.. and even with magic, you'd have to have some sort of scientific understanding of the process to do it since development of magical spells tend to have a purpose, just smashign a spell together and then trying to find a use for it isn't very logical.

The first sodas, Ginger ale and Birch Beer, and Root Beer were made using yeast! They were mildly alcoholic as a result, but, the yeast provided carbonation. I've done this in the real world myself, so I know it works too. If we have ale, wine and other beverages, we have access to yeast, so.. there you go.

Ginger beer/ale= water, ginger root and yeast
Birch beer = water, birch bark or sap and yeast
Root beer = water, sassafras root, and yeast

The amount of alcohol present can be almost 0% depending on fermentation time. Normally overnight or two to three days is sufficient to gain some fizz without making something too alcoholic in nature.

Given that beer is naturally carbonated from the fermentation as you said, I really really overthought that problem <.< Yeah fermentation would do the trick.

Gravemaskin wrote:

Given that beer is naturally carbonated from the fermentation as you said, I really really overthought that problem <.< Yeah fermentation would do the trick.

I was going to answer but thanks our cola experts, sodapopologists as they like to be called, beat me to it. They also touched on why I wanted ginger ale and root beer specifically, they are the first and easiest.

Imma write the request when I get home.

Also could just use magic to make a fizzy drink. We don't have to obey natural laws here.

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