AMIA ARCHIVE • View topic - Job system, take a look and give suggestions.

Good things are worth the wait. *sage nod*

*fidgets patiently*

I cannot find the tailor instructor. Is it placed already?

so just caught up on this thread, and am curious if mortician would fall under the undertaker category?

Man, so many questions you can't possibly answer them all. I apologize if I missed an explanation here, so I'll comment.

I have one tiny concern about the "trader" jobs. I see no motivation for PCs to use your services if they can get the same money from a NPC merchant.

I suggest marking all of the "trader" items as unsellable to NPCs, that way PCs would have an inherent motivation to maybe seek out these professionals rather than just dump them at the temple and such.

Delarwyn wrote:

I cannot find the tailor instructor. Is it placed already?

It has. Ask around IC.

krytellan wrote:

I have one tiny concern about the "trader" jobs. I see no motivation for PCs to use your services if they can get the same money from a NPC merchant.

Traders should have higher rates as their job level increases.
Preferably with a system that lets them set up shop in a specific area even if they're not logged on.

I have one suggestion as to the placement of one of the Underdark jobs, namely the rothe herder.

I believe this instructor should be placed in the mushroom farm, not the hollow caverns. Mainly because Rothes do not spawn in the caverns, and do spawn in the farm.

Zanthair wrote:

I have one suggestion as to the placement of one of the Underdark jobs, namely the rothe herder.

I believe this instructor should be placed in the mushroom farm, not the hollow caverns. Mainly because Rothes do not spawn in the caverns, and do spawn in the farm.

I think the problem with that is accessibility for non-Ultri people.

if people can't get into the rothe area, they shouldn't be a rothe herder

blackvswhite wrote:

if people can't get into the rothe area, they shouldn't be a rothe herder

bingo

As far as I know, the boat to the mushroom farm isnt behind any race gate, meaning any underdark race can get to it.

Hell, if its THAT big of a deal, then put it in underport by the rothe pen, though those seem to be pretty well hearded if you ask me.

edit - i see the problem, with heretics and such not ICly allowed within the city and the job out of reach to them. But still, if you cant get to the rothe, how can you heard them in the first place?

krytellan wrote:

Man, so many questions you can't possibly answer them all. I apologize if I missed an explanation here, so I'll comment.

I have one tiny concern about the "trader" jobs. I see no motivation for PCs to use your services if they can get the same money from a NPC merchant.

I suggest marking all of the "trader" items as unsellable to NPCs, that way PCs would have an inherent motivation to maybe seek out these professionals rather than just dump them at the temple and such.

Traders get storage space as well. It's very neat, and I'd advise anyone who has to deal with lots of goods (for example miners) to take at least one rank of Metal Trader. It basically gives you unlimited carriage capacity for 15 types of metal or ore.

There are not that many NPC merchants around (they double as trainers) but I keep a few around so people can get rid of stuff when there's no PC trader nearby. I don't like to promote littering.

Mind that the job system items are nearly worthless in normal shops. You can sell your diamonds for 5 gold in a normal shop, or for a few thousand gold to a PC (or trainer).

Dramatic_Prince wrote:

krytellan wrote:

I have one tiny concern about the "trader" jobs. I see no motivation for PCs to use your services if they can get the same money from a NPC merchant.

Traders should have higher rates as their job level increases.
Preferably with a system that lets them set up shop in a specific area even if they're not logged on.

One is done, two can't be done.

Zanthair wrote:

blackvswhite wrote:

if people can't get into the rothe area, they shouldn't be a rothe herder

bingo

As far as I know, the boat to the mushroom farm isnt behind any race gate, meaning any underdark race can get to it.

Hell, if its THAT big of a deal, then put it in underport by the rothe pen, though those seem to be pretty well hearded if you ask me.

edit - i see the problem, with heretics and such not ICly allowed within the city and the job out of reach to them. But still, if you cant get to the rothe, how can you heard them in the first place?

I don't think Rothe herding is a Drow exclusive activity, and I am 100% certain it isn't an Ultrinnan Drow exclusive activity. Only reason I placed UD jobs outside the gates is that it's so bloody crowded within the gates. The engine doesn't really fancy too many NPCs within a small area (it keeps on calculating who can see who) so I ran out of options.

Dev Disco wrote:

Mind that the job system items are nearly worthless in normal shops. You can sell your diamonds for 5 gold in a normal shop, or for a few thousand gold to a PC (or trainer).

Can a PC sell off stuff to him/herself?

Yes, you can clean up your inventory by selling to the system. Only if you are a trader of course.

I think what Prescia Moneybags is getting at is "I sit around a lot. Can I craft gems/etc, sell to 'myself' for gross profit, and turn my downtime into 'ridiculously rich' time?"

And it seems the answer is yes.

Disco, I know it might be a lot of work but could you get a sidebar tab up for these jobs? It would be really useful to have a reference, even if the sidebar is a link to the PDF.

TormakSaber wrote:

I think what Prescia Moneybags is getting at is "I sit around a lot. Can I craft gems/etc, sell to 'myself' for gross profit, and turn my downtime into 'ridiculously rich' time?"

And it seems the answer is yes.

You can't. You need to find and mine ore, then you need to cut gems from it in another location, and then you can indeed sell 'em. You need three jobs and doing a Spire round is a lot easier.

Phantom-D wrote:

Disco, I know it might be a lot of work but could you get a sidebar tab up for these jobs? It would be really useful to have a reference, even if the sidebar is a link to the PDF.

Yes, we're working on that.

Dev Disco wrote:

You can't. You need to find and mine ore, then you need to cut gems from it in another location, and then you can indeed sell 'em. You need three jobs and doing a Spire round is a lot easier.

But not everyone can, or even wants, to do the Spires on a daily basis. If money can be made from this system, people will do it. Which is a good thing, because it means you dont have to spend your entire day grinding monsters... just gems.

Xaviera wrote:

Dev Disco wrote:

You can't. You need to find and mine ore, then you need to cut gems from it in another location, and then you can indeed sell 'em. You need three jobs and doing a Spire round is a lot easier.

But not everyone can, or even wants, to do the Spires on a daily basis. If money can be made from this system, people will do it. Which is a good thing, because it means you dont have to spend your entire day grinding monsters... just gems.

I like the idea of making money without killing things.

Yups, that's the idea. It shouldn't be too easy, though. Well, it isn't much of an issue, I keep records of the amount of XP and money made by killing, crafting, and questing so I can tune it when it's running.

Dev Disco wrote:

You can't. You need to find and mine ore, then you need to cut gems from it in another location, and then you can indeed sell 'em. You need three jobs and doing a Spire round is a lot easier.

Yeah but after doing over 5000 loops of spires, any alternative is a breath of fresh air. :lol:

Last edited by Xaviera on Fri, Apr 17 2009, 1:52 AM, edited 1 time in total.

Dev Disco wrote:

And a new version

http://staff.science.uva.nl/~dcslob/Ami ... System.pdf

This is the most recent version? Would it be possible to add all the relevant links as an edit to the first post so they're all in one place?

http://staff.science.uva.nl/~dcslob/Ami ... System.pdf
http://staff.science.uva.nl/~dcslob/jobs/
http://www.amiaworld.net/about/ds_j_resources.php
http://www.science.uva.nl/research/amst ... hp?id=3503

You've noted several recent updates, and certainly all the jobs listed in your post of 25 March are not included in these links, but I expect you'll update the publicly available material at your convenience.

I know you changed the success percentages from the original 10/35/60/85, I believe it was, but did you keep the bonus roll? I was just wondering if it would be any more efficient to just make one roll rather than two. So (using the original numbers) if you are rank 2 and have a 60% chance of success and a 20% chance of a bonus, does it make any difference in computation speed/efficiency to consider a roll of 1-12 (20% of 60%) a bonus success and 13-60 a regular success?

Also, the Performer seems to require that you stand for 5 minutes near the bard NPC before you can roll for xp based on the number of nearby PCs. Shouldnt a 2 min cooldown apply here as well, if that's the standard? As the bard NPCs arent likely to be standing on busy streetcorners, you basically need to drag people into the theatre to earn anything from this, and making people stand around for 5 min is a long time.

Dramatic_Prince wrote:

Yeah but after doing over 5000 loops of spires, any alternative is a breath of fresh air. :lol:

Filthy powergamer!

Is this cool down time based on the PC or the object?
I hope we don't have to queue up to harvest fruit :lol:

You have to queue, but there are multiple copies of the same object. We'll just have to see how it goes.

Mahtan is adding descriptions of the jobs with the specifics. I haven't updated the word doc in a while, and we'll go for a web page anyway.

With the xp reward system is it theoretically and sanely possible to level up via jobs alone? Ex: I play Jimmy who is pretty much a permanent lvl2 rogue I have no intents to take him monster grinding. He does odd jobs about Cordor for money, begs sometimes, shines shoes, serves soup, plays as a towncrier etc.

If I use the job system long enough he should start leveling up right? *Kinda wants to be the uber beggar of Cordor but doesnt want to go grind monsters lol*

Apparently big enough so it actually exists, small enough so that it won't replace grinding.
Which is quite something considering how little xp one gets in Amia fro monsters

I would assume it is within the realms of theoretical possibility.

Hey, I noticed there were some Rothe in Underport, maybe the trainer can go there? This makes it so many races can be a Rothe Herder instead of making it mostly drow.

You can herd them everywhere in the UD, you only need to go to that herder once for each rank. Doesn't make a lot of sense to place lots of double NPCs around the module if you are able to reach it.

Yurell wrote:

Apparently big enough so it actually exists, small enough so that it won't replace grinding.
Which is quite something considering how little xp one gets in Amia fro monsters

I would assume it is within the realms of theoretical possibility.

I gained my 29th level by testing.

Yurell wrote:

Apparently big enough so it actually exists, small enough so that it won't replace grinding.
Which is quite something considering how little xp one gets in Amia fro monsters

I would assume it is within the realms of theoretical possibility.

It is more than a theoretical possibility, it is a definite possibility. This gives those players who always said they should be able to get XP from something other than hunting a means of gaining XP and levelling up. It will, of course, take an awful lot longer.

And I am placing bets on the inevitable, "Increase the amount of XP given by doing jobs! We should be given more XP because we're actually RP'ing and people who are out hunting and grinding monsters aren't!"

Yossarin wrote:

"Increase the amount of XP given by doing jobs! We should be given more XP because we're actually RP'ing and people who are out hunting and grinding monsters aren't!"

Sounds good.

Mr Mago wrote:

Yossarin wrote:

"Increase the amount of XP given by doing jobs! We should be given more XP because we're actually RP'ing and people who are out hunting and grinding monsters aren't!"

Sounds good.

I'll gladly wait to make such a scewed opinion of the system until it is in place.

That, and I like to take the leveling slower. I trust that the initial quirks of 'is it enough' get worked out quite fast as people go nuts trying to learn the crafts and the functionality - once the system is activated.

N o w :

A real quesiton: Is there a job that will allow the making of antidotes or anti-venoms? [Ie: does herbalist perhaps?]
If not: I cast a vote for a job that'd allow such a specialty. Check out how many poisons and poisonous creatures are around anyways ^^ Sure; your standard antidote potion is probably going to be better but it's the idea you have the job- aye?

Herbalist or Alchemist. Not sure which yet.

low XP for monsters on Amia? Jesus Christ, what servers are you playing at? I would actually say the opposite of Amia. I think we get a little -too- much for monsters. I've been on some servers that give such low XP and gold is hard to come by so it really makes you appreciate what Amia gives.

I think the Job system giving us XP, even if it isn't too much, is an awesome idea. People that know me know I don't really like grinding much at all so I'll be putting it to good use for sure.

as for fighting monsters, it is up to you to roleplay while you do it or not. Just it is up to you to use the job system and not roleplay. It all depends on good or bad will from the players.

Dev Disco wrote:

Yurell wrote:

Apparently big enough so it actually exists, small enough so that it won't replace grinding.
Which is quite something considering how little xp one gets in Amia fro monsters :P
I would assume it is within the realms of theoretical possibility.

I gained my 29th level by testing.

Yay! I was just going off your previous comments.

Mr Mago wrote:

Yossarin wrote:

"Increase the amount of XP given by doing jobs! We should be given more XP because we're actually RP'ing and people who are out hunting and grinding monsters aren't!"

Sounds good.

I like that argument, but I'll wait to see just how much xp we're getting first.

i thought of some cool jobs you might want to add in

1. Dancer (whirlwind without its hostility could be an add on)
2. Comedian (as in a stand up comedian or cheesy jokes and riddles)
3. Poet (ultimate creativity or copyright infringement, hopefully creativity)
4. Musician (change performer to musician to cover a wider area)
5. Model (as in divas, super models, or those who strike poses for painters)
6. Tailor (as in lighter fine clothing such as cloth, silk, and polyester)
7. Private Investigator (more like sherlock holmes than a spy)
8. Animal Trainer (open up a pet store with useless summon animal widgets for sale xD)
9. Sailor (out on the open seas)
10. Cartographer (perhaps search out all the idols and mark them down?)
11. Journalist/Reporter (be apart of the annoying paparazzi)

these are the stupid ones that some people might get a laugh out of reading

1. Social Worker
2. Shoe Shiner
3. Lawyer
4. Prosecuter
5. Con Artist
6. Prostitute
7. Town Idiot/Drunk
8. Smuggler
9. Kidnapper
10. Lookalike
11. Puppet Master

Gexx44 wrote:

6. Prostitute

'cept that's illegal in Cordor, and you can't really RP your service ... may as well be a"Professional Escort".

haha i said all the bottom ones were just jokes xD i mean come on a social worker! get jobs to make sure children arent being abused how cool do you feel? lol

anyhow i would be sad if dancer wasnt put in =( not really but yah get it

Dev Disco wrote:

I am not adding more jobs at this moment.

Some creative thinking and you can RP around the jobs you asked for, Dancer.. take the Minstrel and just RP the Perform as Dancing. *as one example*

ok now i read the entire long thing and all i have to say is wow, i love the large selection especially. Didn't see minstrel, but now that i know it's there i suppose i can settle for it, plus that way i'll be able to rp singing and playing an instrument with my rog/sd ^_^

Dev Disco wrote:

You have to queue, but there are multiple copies of the same object. We'll just have to see how it goes.

Mahtan is adding descriptions of the jobs with the specifics. I haven't updated the word doc in a while, and we'll go for a web page anyway.

http://www.amiaworld.net/about/ds_j_jobs.php

It isn't ready yet, but I guess it gives an indication of the way we want to make the manual. It will be cross-linked with the resources list.

It looks good, Disco. Just had a look through some of them ... it has a nice set out.

One thing I just thought up, does the "archer" job work will all ranged weapons or literally just a bow?

It works with anything. It's exactly the same as Man-At-Arms, but I gathered some people liked Archer better as a name. So, you can shoot, stab, club, impale, fry your target, whatever you like.

Just to make sure I got this right, a higher job level only gives a higher sucess rate and more gold/xp, but you can create everything the job can do at level 1 as well?

Job system, take a look and give suggestions.

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