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[ 32 posts ] |
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QPR
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 Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 9:12 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Location: Norway
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I found quite a few old threads on the faithless topic, but I didnt want to ressurect allmost 5 month old threads when asking a different question:
Is a Ranger under the same rules for spellcasting as a druid? Does he have to pick a patron deity to recieve spells from, or can he draw them from natute spirits, deals with fey or other sources?
Secondly, is there any deities that do not support Rangers, seeing that they can be of all aligments and races, and have any motivation; from defending nature to merciless hunting?
Thirdly, what happens to characters deemed False in faith, but who are of good aligment and have commited good deeds through their lives?
And last but not least; Just how much about the Wall, Kelemvors Judgement, the False etc should be common IC knowledge?
_________________
"Edwin do this, Edwin do that. Somebody get this jerk a banana!" - Edwin, BG II
Valygar 'Stonesnake' Stark -Human Ranger
Garret Smith - Archer and peddler of deity-statuettes
Dáin Saltbeard - Dwarven sailor and fencer. No, I'm not joking.
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BrainSplitter
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 9:15 AM |
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Player
Joined: 06 Apr 2005
Location: Victoria, Australia
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Rangers, as Divine spellcasters, must have a patron deity.
Most deities will permit it, common sense reigns true; I doubt there are going to be many Rangers of Velsharoon, for example, if any at all.
If you are False, you are false. Good or evil, chaotic or lawful, you are false; and such is your fate.
A fair bit of it, given Kelemvor's clergy openly proclaims what happens after death to reduce the fear of it, and so people not only learn to not be afraid of it; but to accept it. Kelemvor's got a pretty solid following on Amia, so it'd be common knowledge, I wager.
_________________
Mostly Retired
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QPR
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 9:26 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Location: Norway
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Right, next question then: Is there an idol to Shaundakul in the module? Not asking where, just asking if there actually is one.
_________________
"Edwin do this, Edwin do that. Somebody get this jerk a banana!" - Edwin, BG II
Valygar 'Stonesnake' Stark -Human Ranger
Garret Smith - Archer and peddler of deity-statuettes
Dáin Saltbeard - Dwarven sailor and fencer. No, I'm not joking.
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Nekhy
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 9:27 AM |
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IronAngel
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 9:35 AM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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The difference between rangers and druids is that druids strictly need a nature deity (though I would extend it to elemental lords and a select few others) while rangers can probably have any patron, within reason. (There's some argument about this, but I think there's a very solid case for rangers of virtually any deity, despite a contradicting passage in F&P.) But I guess you answered that with your second question, and Ron answered it too. Just a clarification.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Vaylek
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 10:05 AM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Sep 2008
Location: Sydney, Australia
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Just go for Silvanus, he's the big indifferent nature spirit god. He prefers people to get druid and ranger levels than cleric levels xD
_________________
Vaylek - The Worst Guy
Pu Liu - Descendant of the Great River Dragon
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Maias227
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 11:35 AM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Jun 2007
Location: Denmark (GMT+1)
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Just to add to the faithless/false part.
All faithless go to the wall and will be stuck there for centuries until they are dissolved by a supernatural mold. A few even gets abducted by the demons to the abyss.
The false are juged by Kelemvor by their actions through life. Some are punished severely for vile crimes while others are simply sentenced to an eternity of pretty much nothing at all.
The Time of Troubles really proved to the general populance of Faerûn that gods exists. So to deny all of them faith is not only insulting every single deity it is also a direct threat to their power as they are dependent on their number of worshipers.
I'd imagine most of this is known to the clergy. In paticular all the different faiths would be keen on relating the bleak fate of the faithless and the false.
_________________
...Hereof follows that the social contract is only beneficial as long as all have something and none have too much...
- Rousseau Book 1 Chapter 9 in "The Social Contract"
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Galenson
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 12:33 PM |
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Player
Joined: 26 May 2006
Location: Down Under, calculating your demise with blunt expressions.
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You just have to remember that Kelemvor hates you and wants you in his wall.
Don't let him do it to you! And don't let Opustus touch you either!
_________________
Plays:
"I'll think of something once Amia:EE drops."
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QPR
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 13:10 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Location: Norway
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Right, than thats cleared up. Next question since I now have a Ranger thread:
- Ranger/Druid skills that are not present in NwN such as Survival and Track, could they be in NwN represented by for example either Animal Empathy, or Ranger/Druid/(Barbarian?) levels?
- Since I find very little about Rangers in 3e and 4e edition that I myself consider interesting, is it valid to use lore from The Complete Ranger Handbook which is 2e? Ofcourse modified to be compatibel with NwN using common sense.
- Forgotten Realms Wiki mentiones a prestige class for Rangers named Horizon Walker, that is a planewalking ranger.
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Horizon_walker
Its obviously not possible to implement fully into Amia, but could it, after RP, be "taken" in a heavy altered form? Same question for other Ranger prestige/paragon classes.
- Is it possible for Rangers to, through IC study, aquire spells that rangers have in 3.5?
_________________
"Edwin do this, Edwin do that. Somebody get this jerk a banana!" - Edwin, BG II
Valygar 'Stonesnake' Stark -Human Ranger
Garret Smith - Archer and peddler of deity-statuettes
Dáin Saltbeard - Dwarven sailor and fencer. No, I'm not joking.
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Gunz
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 19:00 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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Maias227 wrote: All faithless go to the wall and will be stuck there for centuries until they are dissolved by a supernatural mold. A few even gets abducted by the demons to the abyss.
Don't give yourself a false sense of security there bud, -any- person can be abducted by demons and devil while they're in the Fugue Plane waiting for a rep. from their deity or waiting for Kelemvors judgment. 
-------------------------------------------
1)Rangers are a hell of a lot more free to pick different gods than a Druid is. Although, there are some gods that support Druids that few people seem to be aware of that I recently read about in some official D&D books >.>
2)I would say the only deities you need to worry about -not- taking as a Ranger are anything that are heavily anti the balance. Mind, I don't mean things that are destructive to the balance (Like Talos, Umberlee and Talona are. They support Rangers. They're balance oriented, they're just all about wreaking havoc within it.). I'm talking Velsharoon, Kiaransalee, Faluzure and Orcus. Pretty much anything heavily into Undeath really.
3)Indeed, if you're false, you're false. It doesn't matter what alignment you are in the Good-Evil or Lawful-Chaotic scale. False is false. You could be a total saint in life and betray Gargauth by saving a city from mass corruption or betray Loviatar by showing mercy on some doing something good by letting them go. Good deeds don't make you any less false. You're going down.
4)Yeah, I agree with Won. I think a huge portion would be well know, especially because he's a pretty new god.
5)Track can be substituted by search I would think? But that's for a DM to call. I use the PnP skill track a lot and DM's usually tell me to roll search.
6)A DM's call, again. But don't be afraid to throw in your own flavor. Rangers are -very- diverse people. I would go as far as saying that they're only topped in diversity from person to person by Rogues.
7)Things like that I think are DM approved. And even if they're not, I would ask them anyway. They might be able to help you with a nice plot or something to make sense of a PnP class like that.
 PnP spells are usable freely as long as everyone involved in what you're doing agrees to letting you use it. Usually, people are fair by burning a spell of the same level somewhere to symbolize the use of the PnP spell.
_________________
My Characters:
Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
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Maias227
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 19:03 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Jun 2007
Location: Denmark (GMT+1)
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Ah well yes demons you never know what they might do though the devils will not. The devils of the nine hells have a contract with Kelemvor detailing exactly what they are allowed to do and what they may not do. And they tend to keep their word in spite of their evilness:P
_________________
...Hereof follows that the social contract is only beneficial as long as all have something and none have too much...
- Rousseau Book 1 Chapter 9 in "The Social Contract"
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HellScourge
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 19:09 PM |
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Player
Joined: 17 Jan 2007
Location: GMT+1
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Maias227 wrote: Ah well yes demons you never know what they might do though the devils will not. The devils of the nine hells have a contract with Kelemvor detailing exactly what they are allowed to do and what they may not do. And they tend to keep their word in spite of their evilness:P
Hence the lawful - Chaotic axis there  _________________ "Most assume that all the followers of Lathander are great morning people. They're very wrong." "I think we are the only group where AD&D stands for Attention Deficit Disorder." TeroSNS wrote: Hello Everyone [...] I like tentacles [...] 
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Gunz
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 19:33 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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Although Demons do it a hell of a lot more, Devils do it too.
_________________
My Characters:
Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
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QPR
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 19:55 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Location: Norway
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Im asking all theese questions because I feel NwN has seriously crippeled the Ranger class (for obvious reasons of keeping things simple), and try to get the feel of just how much I can take from tabletop games and into NwN regarding Rangers. In a game where all terrain is treated as grass plains with a constant tempereature of about 18 degrees celsuis and sunshine, the Ranger class seems sort of.. obsolete. Atleast a large part of it.
As for skills, I myself would imagine that any Ranger would be fairly good at tracking, points in search or not, which is for Rangers in NwN a rather useless skill, unless they multiclass to rogue.
_________________
"Edwin do this, Edwin do that. Somebody get this jerk a banana!" - Edwin, BG II
Valygar 'Stonesnake' Stark -Human Ranger
Garret Smith - Archer and peddler of deity-statuettes
Dáin Saltbeard - Dwarven sailor and fencer. No, I'm not joking.
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Gunz
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 20:31 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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QPR wrote: As for skills, I myself would imagine that any Ranger would be fairly good at tracking, points in search or not, which is for Rangers in NwN a rather useless skill, unless they multiclass to rogue.
I would have to disagree. Search is a very useful skill for a Ranger.
_________________
My Characters:
Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
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Maias227
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 20:38 PM |
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Player
Joined: 08 Jun 2007
Location: Denmark (GMT+1)
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o0GuNz_N_RoSeZ0o wrote: snip
Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting page 258-259
Yep there is no doubt they both make portals to transport the souls, the question is as to how these souls are aquired. The Baatezu negotiate, the Tanar'ri steal them.
As for the ranger. Many of those skills can still be utilized through rp though they don't really have a influence on the actual mechanics. You can always rp that your ranger track something around somewhere. And I belive there is at least a few places with "tracks" though never had idea what they actually do.
_________________
...Hereof follows that the social contract is only beneficial as long as all have something and none have too much...
- Rousseau Book 1 Chapter 9 in "The Social Contract"
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QPR
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 20:49 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Location: Norway
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well. mechanicly. Search is not very usefull since it can only detect traps up to a certain DC unless you ahve rogue levels.
_________________
"Edwin do this, Edwin do that. Somebody get this jerk a banana!" - Edwin, BG II
Valygar 'Stonesnake' Stark -Human Ranger
Garret Smith - Archer and peddler of deity-statuettes
Dáin Saltbeard - Dwarven sailor and fencer. No, I'm not joking.
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Gunz
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 21:34 PM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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QPR wrote: well. mechanicly. Search is not very usefull since it can only detect traps up to a certain DC unless you ahve rogue levels.
No, Rangers can be damn good at search too. It's not useless as a Ranger. It has plenty of RP benefits too.
_________________
My Characters:
Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
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QPR
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 21:47 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Location: Norway
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RP benefits, yeah. But as skill point starved as Rangers are, its hard to pick it over more usefull and equally RP potential skills unfortunatly.
_________________
"Edwin do this, Edwin do that. Somebody get this jerk a banana!" - Edwin, BG II
Valygar 'Stonesnake' Stark -Human Ranger
Garret Smith - Archer and peddler of deity-statuettes
Dáin Saltbeard - Dwarven sailor and fencer. No, I'm not joking.
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Daniel_Waynold
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 21:56 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Oct 2008
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[quote='Maias227']*snip*
As for the ranger. Many of those skills can still be utilized through rp though they don't really have a influence on the actual mechanics. You can always rp that your ranger track something around somewhere. And I belive there is at least a few places with "tracks" though never had idea what they actually do.[/quote]
Exactly. For instance my ranger Ethrolian, knows the next spells:
- Summon Food
- Detect Scent
- Cold Snap
- Heat Wave
- Detect Heat
These all ofcourse are not mechanicly possible, except Summon food and Detect Heat, but I play them as RP spells. Those are also the few key things Eth survived in Underdark.
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Ranger_Spells
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Gunz
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Posted: Sun, May 31 2009, 22:04 PM |
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Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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QPR
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Posted: Tue, Jun 02 2009, 11:35 AM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Location: Norway
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Another thing that comes to mind: As rangers get spells from their deity, in my chars case Shaundakul, would it be appropriate for him to take on some functions clerics normally have when there are noone else around? Like "preaching", holding cermons, etc, or would he spesifcly need cleric levels to act as any sort of priest?
_________________
"Edwin do this, Edwin do that. Somebody get this jerk a banana!" - Edwin, BG II
Valygar 'Stonesnake' Stark -Human Ranger
Garret Smith - Archer and peddler of deity-statuettes
Dáin Saltbeard - Dwarven sailor and fencer. No, I'm not joking.
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Kjetta
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Posted: Tue, Jun 02 2009, 11:49 AM |
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Player
Joined: 11 Nov 2006
Location: A Clean, Well-Lighted Place
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You can certainly do that.
_________________ To err is human; to forgive divine, but VENGEANCE IS MINE!
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QPR
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Posted: Tue, Jun 02 2009, 12:01 PM |
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Player
Joined: 21 Sep 2008
Location: Norway
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But just how priestly can you be without having cleric levels?
_________________
"Edwin do this, Edwin do that. Somebody get this jerk a banana!" - Edwin, BG II
Valygar 'Stonesnake' Stark -Human Ranger
Garret Smith - Archer and peddler of deity-statuettes
Dáin Saltbeard - Dwarven sailor and fencer. No, I'm not joking.
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Guxx
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Posted: Tue, Jun 02 2009, 13:23 PM |
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Player
Joined: 04 Dec 2007
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QPR wrote: But just how priestly can you be without having cleric levels?
One has to remember, not every priest in the forgotten realms actually gets divine power for it. There's members of the church that aren't clerics and don't get spells at all... So I'd assume you can be pretty dang priestly... hell, look at priests in real life, they aren't calling down holy fire and we call them men of god.
_________________
Dran 'Brick' Do'ani - The Half-Drow
"Hey, who you calling un-chrasimatic?"
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hendrack
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Posted: Tue, Jun 02 2009, 13:36 PM |
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Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2007
Location: Vienna
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Rangers and druids are part of the clergy for many nature gods. They try to spread their deitys influence with different means, maybe.
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TormakSaber
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Posted: Tue, Jun 02 2009, 18:11 PM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere
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QPR wrote: Another thing that comes to mind: As rangers get spells from their deity, in my chars case Shaundakul, would it be appropriate for him to take on some functions clerics normally have when there are noone else around? Like "preaching", holding cermons, etc, or would he spesifcly need cleric levels to act as any sort of priest?
Torin does this and he has no divine casting whatsoever! Piety has no bounds!
_________________
Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds
Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
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Gunz
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Posted: Wed, Jun 03 2009, 0:46 AM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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QPR wrote: But just how priestly can you be without having cleric levels? Very. Especially with Shaundakul as your deity. Shaundakul's clergy is made up of clerics, crusaders and rangers. Different deities have different rules for who gets to be "official clergy". For example, Mielikki has Clerics, druids, rangers and druid/ranger mix as clergy while Silvanus only excepts druids, clerics and shamans. But of course, here on Amia, I think people like to play it a little more by ear which is perfectly cool. So yeah, you're "officially" good to be clergy if you wanted to. TormakSaber wrote: QPR wrote: Another thing that comes to mind: As rangers get spells from their deity, in my chars case Shaundakul, would it be appropriate for him to take on some functions clerics normally have when there are noone else around? Like "preaching", holding cermons, etc, or would he spesifcly need cleric levels to act as any sort of priest? Torin does this and he has no divine casting whatsoever! Piety has no bounds! I would have to agree.
But I like to think that divine spell casters are the head honchos or whatever the deity prefers. Like Milil has pure Bards in his clergy and Mystra has both pure Wizards and pure Bards in hers.
_________________
My Characters:
Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
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TormakSaber
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Posted: Wed, Jun 03 2009, 1:22 AM |
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Player
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere
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Well sure, but I don' need to be head honcho to tell ya about the Lord of Portals, Helping Hand, Windfather Shaundakul.
_________________
Davion Telemos - Monk of the Four Winds
Korthan Isharnos - Dragon Shaman of Thunder Spirit Zamasham
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Gunz
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Posted: Wed, Jun 03 2009, 4:53 AM |
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Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Location: The City of Fallen Angels, Ca
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TormakSaber wrote: Well sure, but I don' need to be head honcho to tell ya about the Lord of Portals, Helping Hand, Windfather Shaundakul.
Sure don't.
_________________
My Characters:
Yuilith Kethil Menaiivan Garadeth
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IronAngel
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Posted: Wed, Jun 03 2009, 14:08 PM |
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Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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And furthermore, I doubt the gods themselves govern the hierarchy of their church much. If you're the only active preacher of your faith on Amia, it doesn't much matter whether you're a Commoner, Fighter or Cleric. And even if there was a powerful, established church already, a Commoner could still become the local religious leader. It would be very unlikely, mind, but it's really just a matter of IC authority, mundane influence and social skills. Or whatever RP is necessary to raise to such a position. If your PC is acknowledged as an authority figure of the faith IC, others have little grounds to prove you wrong OOC.
_________________ On Joon, Kjetta wrote: The guy that probably has sexual fantasies about masturbation. I mean, Iron, you're a bookworm nerd that even in your wildest escapism fantasies flee to the internet to play the role of another bookworm nerd? Come on!
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Xaviera
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Posted: Wed, Jun 03 2009, 14:50 PM |
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Player
Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Location: Temple of Love
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IronAngel wrote: And furthermore, I doubt the gods themselves govern the hierarchy of their church much. If you're the only active preacher of your faith on Amia, it doesn't much matter whether you're a Commoner, Fighter or Cleric. [...] If your PC is acknowledged as an authority figure of the faith IC, others have little grounds to prove you wrong OOC.
Xaviera was High Priestess of Sharess for ages with only 2 cleric levels. On the other hand, nobody was challenging her for the position.
I look at deities as one might a national or multinational corporation, say a cable TV company. They may be powerful but they aren't omnipotent. If a customer can get free cable for a year before they find out and shut it off, and if they can mix up their own employees schedules, paycheques and benefits, the same thing can happen to a cleric who becomes false or a worshipper who preaches heretical ideas. Some things are just beneath their notice unless specifically brought to their attention, and orders from above may not be followed promptly (or at all). _________________  ~Sharess on AmiaWiki~Priestess, politician, prostitute "[They] were moving in on me like Sharessans on a new broad in the bath house" - Tracer BoltAmiaWiki mod (mostly inactive)
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